Need opinions for my pig, 3 speed or 4 speed? (1 Viewer)

[motomodz]

Hello Guys, I usually bug Shmukster with all my pig questions but, I wanted to open this question up for some others to offer their opinions, pros, cons, etc.....

I have a 1971 FJ55 that I bought last year and have been slowing gathering parts for it and working on it here and there. Right now it is pretty much bone-stock, original drivetrain with 3 speed on the column. I knew it needed a clutch when I bought it so, when the opportunity came up, I purchased the following parts with thoughts of upgrading to a 4 speed (I'd really like overdrive but a 5 speed is not in the budget!):

so, I have:

Low mileage 4 speed trans and transfer case out of a 1976 pig
trans and transfer case shift levers and linkage
4 speed bell housing with clutch fork
4 speed flywheel,
both frt and rear correct length driveshafts
trans cover with the shift lever holes so I don't have to cut mine

I pulled the stock trans and transfer case out today, the cluth disc was toast! I have a friend who is going to turn one of the flywheels for me Saturday morning, I gave him the 3 speed flywheel and the 4 speed flywheel and told him I will make up my mind by Friday night so he knows which one to turn on the lathe for me Saturday morning.

So, here are my questions:

I am pretty sure I have everything I need to do the swap, can anyone think of anything I am missing? (obviously new clutch disc, clutch, T/O bearing, I am going to do the RMS while I've got it torn apart, anything else?)

Should I keep it stock or upgrade to 4 speed?

If I go with the 4 speed, are their advantages to going with the 3 speed, vacuum operated transfer case?....and if I go that route, is there a gasket that I would need to buy that goes between the trans and transfer case?

If I go with the 4 speed, even though the trans has low miles (came out of the 26,000 mile original 1976 FJ55 that Smukster had a while back).....the exterior of the unit is rusty so I was going to wire brush and paint it but, do you think I need to check anything internally on it? it ran great before Gary pulled it?

Long post, I know......just want to avoid any surprises......need to make up my mind by Friday night so I know which flywheel to have turned!

I should mention that this rig is getting longer shackles for now to lift it an inch or so (might do a 3 inch lift in the future) and 33x9.5 or 10.5 BFG mud-terrains and will be my daily driver although I will drive it very little, probably 3000-5000 miles annually at the most, no more than 10-15 miles daily. As far as off-roading, hope to take it up to Rausch Creek once a year but that is really all the wheelin this thing is going to see realistically
while I own it.

I like the retro-coolness of the 3 on the tree but I'm sure the rare times the will need to drive it, she'd appreciate a 4 speed!

Lastly, the 1975 FJ40 in my avatar is for sale if anyone is interesed, I need to finance the completion of the Piggie! I've got someone interested locally but if he doesnt take it and there is no interest here, It will be going to ebay in the next couple days. PM me if interested in the 40. (will post in the for sale section as well) Thanks in advance for the opinions on what to do with the trans situation!

-Lee

PS.....here is a link to my for sale ad in the classifieds for the 40: https://forum.ih8mud.com/vehicles-trailers-sale-wanted/362382-1975-fj40.html

(hope that works!)

 

[abruzzi]

My 60 has the 4 speed and my 55 has the 3speed on the floor. The 4 speed is a more refined tranny. Syncro's on 1st make all the different in around town driving. I'd like to put a 4 in my 55, but I wonder how the ratios end up with the 3ps transfer and diffs?

Geof

 

[toddslater]

My 60 has the 4 speed and my 55 has the 3speed on the floor. The 4 speed is a more refined tranny. Syncro's on 1st make all the different in around town driving. I'd like to put a 4 in my 55, but I wonder how the ratios end up with the 3ps transfer and diffs?

Geof

Top end is all 1 to 1( ie. 3sp or 4sp going down the interstate is all 1 to 1 final drive ratio transfer cases all the same too at this point). The 3sp transfer and the 4 speed trans will give you a better crawl ratio when wheeling and it goes w/o saying that for DD type duties the 1st gear of the 4 sp is more forgiving if you're running 33's or so from the dead start (especially on an uphill launch).

 

[motomodz]

I did another search last night and it sounds like I could use the 3 speed flywheel with the 4 speed trans as long as I use the 4 speed bell-housing, 3 speed T/O bearing and 3-speed clutch and pressure plate.

I even read one post where someone suggested that the heavier weight of the 3-speed flywheel provides more torque??......is there any truth to that?

It sounds like approx $150 +/- worth of parts would allow me to swap the 3 speed transfer case onto the 4 speed trans which sounds like the best combination of parts that I have on hand. It sounds like this will also allow me to retain the dash-mounted vacuum operation of the transfer case, which I like.

Obviously this just comes down to personal preference. A few people really like the originality of the 3-speed. I dont mind changing things as long as I am not tearing something up that could not easily be returned to stock, which is not the case here.

I'm leaning towards the 4 speed trans and adapting the 3 speed transfer case to it. Since I have the brand new clutch, T/O bearing and pressure plate for the 3 -speed setup, I would probably use the 3-speed flywheel unless there is a convincing argument not to do so. Since all of those items are still new in the box, I'm sure I could exchange them for the 4-speed parts if use of the 3-speed flywheel is not advised.

So, what would YOUR preference be? Thanks guys. Pics and updates to build thread coming soon.

-Lee

 

[40Flipper]

5 speed

 

[motomodz]

5 speed

H55 = $2000 Plus......not in the budget.....maybe someday, would be nice!

 

[40Flipper]

You can buy them in AU for about $600 USD. Find someone importing a truck and throw it in the back. Chip ina few bucks for shipping and you're in for well under $1k

 

[motomodz]

If I did not have all the parts to do the 4 speed swap, I might consider it. Also, I like the fact that I know that I have a low mileage trans......If and when I go the 5 speed route, I think I would want to know that it has been gone through (rebuilt)......which starts to drive that price back up again.....good idea though to buy direct from AU.

I'm trying to get the pig on the road spending a total of about $1500 more than I have into it already and I still need:

new tires - going with 33" BFG's (5 for $700-ish?)
exhaust from the header back (maybe stainless - cost unknown right now_not cheap)
primer and paint - painting it myself
misc.

.....having been down this road before, total for the "misc" items alone will probably eat up that $1500!

 

[jtrock26]

I have the exhaust system I removed from my 55 in my garage. It is complete from the header back and has an aftermarket muffler that sounds pretty good if you are interested...

 

[LAMBCRUSHER]

I'm going w/ four speed. I'd say to do like slater says and marry a 3 speed t-case to the four speed transmolishin, but that'll take a few more parts and time, so .... four speed. DO NOT fail to replace the PILOT bearing as well. It is only 5 more buxsess. I recommend the poser rms method, drop pan, rear main cap, slip out old, slip in new and NO leaks!

 

[LAMBCRUSHER]

Have you priced out the window seals yet? Oh, and - welcome, brother....

 

[motomodz]

Have you priced out the window seals yet? Oh, and - welcome, brother....

I have the quarter glass and windshield seals......which appear to be the ones that need to be removed to properly install a new headliner......so that is the plan for now. I also have a lot of the rear tailgate rubber. Door rubber is in very good shape; will need replaced eventually but can be used as-is for now.

Thanks for the welcome! I'm on here everyday reading, looking, getting ideas, etc. I've got a lot going on with my rig all at once and will make entry number one in my build thread very soon to update everyone. I tend to get into 10 things at once on a build; it keeps me from taking short-cuts and leaving things for later that are important to me now.

-Lee

 

[motomodz]

I have the exhaust system I removed from my 55 in my garage. It is complete from the header back and has an aftermarket muffler that sounds pretty good if you are interested...

so, you have a complete exhaust in good shape that came off your rig when it still had the stock engine? Any idea which header you had out of curiosity? (not that I could'nt just alter that portion if needed......I am running the Downey header) Do you know what muffler you were running?

Do you mind snapping a few pics and sending them my way? let me know what price you're asking as well. E-mail addy is Ldearborn@clgi.biz

Thanks. Curious where it exits too.....have heard that it front of rear wheel or straight out the back will lead too exhaust inside the truck....which can't be good.

-Lee

 

[cruiserbrett]

I would go with the 4 speed transmission for sure. While I changed mine from a 3 speed on the floor, not a column shift, the difference was so much better. better gear splits for around town use, and of course a easily usable 1st gear.

As for the transfercase, if its truly that low milage, go with the 4 speed transfercase. Not worth the time/money to pull it all apart to put in a weaker(slightly), noisier transfercase. you really most likely wont notice the slight extra low range.

As for the clutch, if you were going to wheel it alot, I would say the 3 speed flywheel/clutch setup. If its around town kinda truck, I prefer the later diaphragm clutch, it just seems to be a little smoother engaging.

I would hit up your friendly toyota dealer and get a few seals for the tranny and t-case:
trans input shaft seal(and gasket for front bearing retainer)
t-case output shaft front and rear seals

 

[3_puppies]

I'd vote 4 speed also, if driven alot.
I think the floors changed slightly between your year range. the hump may be different where it bolts to the floor. I believe others have just used a thick foam weather stripping to fill the gap.

also you're correct on being able to use all the 3 speed flywheel/clutch with the 4 speed trans. just keep it all 3 finger style or all diapragm style.

 

[LC_Hamma]

the rare times the will need to drive it

I guess an upgrade to the SM420 4 speed hasn't been considered? There's a reason it's the #1 mod done to any Cruzah. I have them in all my LC's

 

[motomodz]

the rare times the will need to drive it

I guess an upgrade to the SM420 4 speed hasn't been considered? There's a reason it's the #1 mod done to any Cruzah. I have them in all my LC's

I have read that the SM420 is used commonly and it sounds like a great alternative but it is my understanding that the adapter required to use the LC transfer case is several hundred dollars.

Because of time and budget constraints, I would like to come up with the best combination of parts I already have on hand.

Knowing what parts I have, what combo would you go with LC_Hamma?

Thanks for everyones input. I know that there are a lot of threads on this subject, most of which I have read; but it's nice to get some different opinions and reasons for those decisions......as well as be reassured that I have all the right parts on hand before getting started.

-keep the opinions coming!

 

[Ron B]

I know a 4 speed is better around town but theres something about 3 on a tree. If the wife,s barely gonna drive it I would leave it on the tree. It has been doing its job for 39 years, . How can you say its not any good? But thats my opinion, like every one else has posted theirs. Plus its gonna hook up right and you have all the parts you need. My first truck was on the colum and I loved it.

 

[LC_Hamma]

Knowing what parts I have, what combo would you go with LC_Hamma?

the cluth disc was toast!

As far as off-roading, hope to take it up to Rausch Creek once a year but that is really all the wheelin this thing is going to see

Is this rig a weekend DDer? Sure would be nice to idle over obstacles at Rausch Creek rather than popping the clutch & lurching forward cuz you don't have lower gearing, possibly ending up the clutch. I've seen used SM420 plate adaptors & AA adaptors floating around in the classifieds for under $200.00. Ask anyone whose done the conversion if they regret it. You won't find a cheaper alternative to lower your gearing as this upgrade provides

 

[jtrock26]

I would have to say the 4sp. as well. My cruiser had a 3sp floor shifter, first gear was nowhere near low enough for wheeling, or even starting on inclines. Very hard on the clutch in my opinion. Also, climbing a steep grade on the highway wasn't easy either because there was no downshift option unless you wanted to go 35 at about 5000 rpm, lol. ( Not sure if the gear ratio on the 4sp. would help there as I never drove a cruiser with one, just thinking it had to be better!) I will try to get you pics and info on my exhaust tomorrow.