FJ80 or Saginaw PS? (1 Viewer)

[DangerNoodle]

What would you guys recommend? This would be going on a rig with 37s and FJ80 axles. I'm planning on running hydro assist and looking at the Redhead 80 box, or possibly doing a Redneck Ram with a Saginaw box. Which one would you choose, and why?

 

[69LC]

Do you have any junkyards around with IH Scout IIs? They have a saggy box too that is the same config as the 60/80 box.

 

[DangerNoodle]

Of those two choices? The FJ80.

I HATE standard style Saginaw and usual hackery that goes with it. I have one out of four cruisers with this style... and it has a completely custom front crossmember to ensure strength in the area.

The other three are or will be Scout boxes. Hard to find now days though.

What others would you recommend?

 

[69LC]

Another option not often discussed here is the f150/full sized bronco box from the late 70s. Same forward facing pitman arm, mounts outside the framerail and will turn the big tires.

 

[69LC]

Google Image Result for https://www.fordification.com/tech/images/PSswap01.jpg

 

[DangerNoodle]

Another option not often discussed here is the f150/full sized bronco box from the late 70s. Same forward facing pitman arm, mounts outside the framerail and will turn the big tires.

That looks like an ok option if I can find a core.

 

[69LC]

If you want to have the option to add a ram later, look on some Ford forums about where to drill and tap the box for cylinder lines.

 

[Rainman]

I've heard many folks gripe about the Saginaw setup because of the hole needed in the front cross member. This was decades ago so there's no comparison for me with the 80 box. I haven't even looked into that yet. BUT!

I was in an accident many years ago in the Zebranator where a girl ran a stop sign and I T-boned her at 40 miles an hour. It was such a hard hit, it totaled the Cruiser. Bent the frame to the right by about a foot. (she was going from my left to my right. FAST.) The cross member didn't have ANY warping, buckling, or tears in it. It held up just as if there was no hole. So I'm a fan of the Sag box. It's strong and in my case durable.

 

[DangerNoodle]

I've heard many folks gripe about the Saginaw setup because of the hole needed in the front cross member. This was decades ago so there's no comparison for me with the 80 box. I haven't even looked into that yet. BUT!

I was in an accident many years ago in the Zebranator where a girl ran a stop sign and I T-boned her at 40 miles an hour. It was such a hard hit, it totaled the Cruiser. Bent the frame to the right by about a foot. (she was going from my left to my right. FAST.) The cross member didn't have ANY warping, buckling, or tears in it. It help up just as if there was no hole. So I'm a fan of the Sag box. It's strong and in my case durable.

I'm not too worried about the strength. It's good to hear that you didn't have a problem though.

 

[DangerNoodle]

I guess I should also ask, will this work if I am pushing my front axle forward 3-4 inches with an 80 box?

 

[Rainman]

It drove aired down 36" Swampers just fine. Only had a spot once where I couldn't turn coming down off the face of Helicopter Pad in Tellico. Also most endo'd but saved it. My right front tire was bound up on a rock and I doubt anything would've been able to turn the tires where I was. Never squealed on me either.

 

[69LC]

I guess I should also ask, will this work if I am pushing my front axle forward 3-4 inches with an 80 box?

Are you planning on running the OEM 80 arms or some high steer setup? I ask only because some of the various forward facing high steer
Setups use a shorter acting arm on top of the knuckle which reduces the steering boxes’ power to turn the wheels-less leverage.

Shorter arms would help with clearance for moving the axle forward.

 

[69LC]

I just found this Delphi box to retrofit on Broncos.

It’s the same configuration as the 60/80/Scout II. It also has 4 mounting holes like the Toyota boxes.

Delphi Power Steering Box - Broncograveyard.com

1966-1977 Ford Bronco Power Box!br br br - Rebuilt Delphi 600 Power Box br - 14:1 Ratio Approx 3.5 Turns Lock to Lock br - 11/16”-36 Spline Input Shaft br - Fits Stock Factory Pitman Arm br - 14MM / 16MM Flare Hose Fittings br - Box Ships with 4...

shop.broncograveyard.com

 

[DangerNoodle]

Are you planning on running the OEM 80 arms or some high steer setup? I ask only because some of the various forward facing high steer
Setups use a shorter acting arm on top of the knuckle which reduces the steering boxes’ power to turn the wheels-less leverage.

Shorter arms would help with clearance for moving the axle forward.

Planning on running hellfire knuckles.

 

[69LC]

How much do you understand Ackerman angle? Do those arms allow you to maintain proper geometry for road manners? Just throwing questions out there for you to consider.

 

[DangerNoodle]

How much do you understand Ackerman angle? Do those arms allow you to maintain proper geometry for road manners? Just throwing questions out there for you to consider.

I'm not really sure with the hellfires. Its a complete knuckle assembly with high steer, so I would assume they keep the geometry the same.

 

[DangerNoodle]

How much do you understand Ackerman angle? Do those arms allow you to maintain proper geometry for road manners? Just throwing questions out there for you to consider.

The placement of the box shouldnt change the angle, right? Isnt it just based off the arms and the rod?

 

[69LC]

No, but the axle and box placement both contribute to how much room you will have with locating your tie rod and drag link, and the leverage the pitman arm has against the steering arms, and how much room you have to stuff it all into the space and have clearance between the rods when the axle moves.

The closer the tie rod is to the axle (with the knuckles and arms you want), the more Ackerman you’ll have-less tire scrub, but less leverage from the PS box. It will also steer faster. The opposite of those will yield more leverage and slow it, but have more tire scrub.

Pitman arm length also plays into the ratios and steering speed.

 

[69LC]

When considering on road handling and tire wear the stuff above matters.

 

[69LC]

I’m not trying to make this only about Ackerman, I just raised it as a component that can be attended to with the build. My main goal in raising the points that I have was to as our young friend to consider how he builds so that someday he can be old like us.

Have you seen his screen name? He might need a wooden block under his right pedal...

Cool video too btw @Lil’John