Extended charcoal canister breather ideas?

[linuxgod]

I replaced my charcoal canister last October, but recently got the dreaded series of codes that signify a bad canister. The dealer who replaced it originally looked at it since there’s a 12 month unlimited mileage warranty, but when they pulled the hoses muddy water came out. The canister is toast and at this point I’m going to swap it with a used one off a wrecked vehicle, but I’m also pondering ways to ensure the filter element on it is located higher up to avoid this fate in the future. (BTW I’m surprised about the canister pulling in water but given some of the deep and fast moving crossings I did in April I’m not entirely shocked about the cause).

Has anyone relocated their canister filter to somewhere higher up? Anyone have ideas of a higher location that’s safe for the possible venting of fuel vapors? I know the LRA tanks make a breather loop with a K&N filter up near the fuel filler but I’m wondering how much that would’ve helped. (@TeCKis300 how’s your setup holding up?)

Also I’m wondering if anyone else who was on my Cruise Moab pre-run has had any issues? (@nakman have you heard of anyone else especially with a 200 having this fate?)

 

[nakman]

Also I’m wondering if anyone else who was on my Cruise Moab pre-run has had any issues? (@nakman have you heard of anyone else especially with a 200 having this fate?)

I have not, but I can ask around I'll see a couple of them today, and quite a few more next week! I know my 80 has lots of fuel vapors and needs a charcoal canister swap, and our April run could have made that worse... but no CEL's.

 

[kcjaz]

I suppose the engine bay is a no-go? That would be easy.

 

[Artie]

How is the water getting in and how deep were these crossings?

 

[linuxgod]

How is the water getting in and how deep were these crossings?

There was about a foot of snow in the desert that melted, so some of the washes were pretty deep and moving fast as it melted. I didn’t think it was THAT deep but apparently 3’?

There’s an atmospheric vent that hangs off the canister with a filter. I think the canister is normally sealed but the filter housing took in water and eventually that made it into the system. Just a hunch but I can’t imagine how else mud and water got in there. The system smoke tested so no vapor leaks or other ways I can see how it would take on water

 

[linuxgod]

I suppose the engine bay is a no-go? That would be easy.

It’s an option, presumably I can run a long, large diameter hose. But if there was somewhere high up I could reach in the rear I’d prefer a shorter run, and not venting fuel into a hot engine bay…

 

[TeCKis300]

Has anyone relocated their canister filter to somewhere higher up? Anyone have ideas of a higher location that’s safe for the possible venting of fuel vapors? I know the LRA tanks make a breather loop with a K&N filter up near the fuel filler but I’m wondering how much that would’ve helped. (@TeCKis300 how’s your setup holding up?)

Holding up good. Though it's time to service/clean the mushroom filter as it's filling is a bit sensitive.

In regards to setting it up higher, I was thinking either above behind the taillight (if there's even room), or pull a breather line up front and under the passenger fender. I'm hesitant to put it in the engine bay as there are combustible fumes that can vent.

Real solution is to mirror the OEM breather config which draws and vents at the enclosed fill neck. Which uses a collar around the fill neck that doesn't need servicing. That would take some effort to scan the aftermarket neck and create a 3D print file.

 

[linuxgod]

Holding up good. Though it's time to service/clean the mushroom filter as it's filling is a bit sensitive.

In regards to setting it up higher, I was thinking either above behind the taillight (if there's even room), or pull a breather line up front and under the passenger fender. I'm hesitant to put it in the engine bay as there are combustible fumes that can vent.

Real solution is to mirror the OEM breather config which draws and vents at the enclosed fill neck. Which uses a collar around the fill neck that doesn't need servicing. That would take some effort to scan the aftermarket neck and create a 3D print file.

My setup is in fact OEM, there’s no LRA tank. And it still has the filter vent box as an appendage to the charcoal canister. This is almost surely where my water entered since the canister itself would’ve been waterproof

 

[brasskey]

Check @grinchy build thread. He put in engine bay.

 

[kong24680]

I retrofitted an Australian market 47 gallon Long Ranger aux tank earlier this year and had to relocate the canister since that tank doesn’t have a cutout for the larger US spec EVAP canister like the LRA tanks. The only place I could get it to fit was tucked below the left taillight area inside my Slee rear bumper. It took a fair bit of work with custom brackets plus extending all the hoses and wiring.

I looked pretty hard for a higher mounting location and honestly don’t think there’s anywhere higher than the spare tire area other than moving it into the engine bay.

 

[TeCKis300]

My setup is in fact OEM, there’s no LRA tank. And it still has the filter vent box as an appendage to the charcoal canister. This is almost surely where my water entered since the canister itself would’ve been waterproof

My bad, LRA on the brain.

I didn't think the little inline filter box has an entry point? Did your gas fill compartment have any traces of muddy water?

Ultimate mod would be to flash the ECU with a rest of world tune so we can delete the EVAP contraption. Seems far fetched, but in Porsche land, I can flash tune to remove things like air injection and evap. CA makes it difficult as CARB now reads checksums on the ECU which would only match the factory tune.

 

[prharper]

I retrofitted an Australian market 47 gallon Long Ranger aux tank earlier this year and had to relocate the canister since that tank doesn’t have a cutout for the larger US spec EVAP canister like the LRA tanks. The only place I could get it to fit was tucked below the left taillight area inside my Slee rear bumper. It took a fair bit of work with custom brackets plus extending all the hoses and wiring.

I looked pretty hard for a higher mounting location and honestly don’t think there’s anywhere higher than the spare tire area other than moving it into the engine bay.

View attachment 4182848

That's cool. If you ever have to replace the CC, you don't have to drop the LRA

 

[kong24680]

That's cool. If you ever have to replace the CC, you don't have to drop the LRA

Very true! Luckily I haven’t dealt with any evap/fuel boiling issues

 

[linuxgod]

My bad, LRA on the brain.

I didn't think the little inline filter box has an entry point? Did your gas fill compartment have any traces of muddy water?

Ultimate mod would be to flash the ECU with a rest of world tune so we can delete the EVAP contraption. Seems far fetched, but in Porsche land, I can flash tune to remove things like air injection and evap. CA makes it difficult as CARB now reads checksums on the ECU which would only match the factory tune.

Yeah I climbed underneath this weekend and traced the tubing and you’re correct, the filter goes to the filler neck. There was (is still) dirt a bit of dust around the filler neck but I don’t see how it after would’ve gotten into the lines that way since the gas cap seals the tank. Maybe if the pressure relief was bad (which seems unlikely) but even still how much water would it have taken on in a few seconds of crossing?

 

[Musubi]

the dreaded series of codes that signify a bad canister.

What is the dreaded series of codes? I'm at 250k miles. And occasionally get 5 EVAP codes upon start up. Was going to replace the CC last year when I did the LRA, but couldn't pull the $600-800 price tag. I've been clearing and ignoring those EVAP codes. Will it do any harm if I continue to ignore it? Also what's your plan to find the CC from wrecked vehicles? off an LX570?

 

[linuxgod]

What is the dreaded series of codes? I'm at 250k miles. And occasionally get 5 EVAP codes upon start up. Was going to replace the CC last year when I did the LRA, but couldn't pull the $600-800 price tag. I've been clearing and ignoring those EVAP codes. Will it do any harm if I continue to ignore it? Also what's your plan to find the CC from wrecked vehicles? off an LX570?

These. Might have a P0441 as well.

 

[linuxgod]

What is the dreaded series of codes? I'm at 250k miles. And occasionally get 5 EVAP codes upon start up. Was going to replace the CC last year when I did the LRA, but couldn't pull the $600-800 price tag. I've been clearing and ignoring those EVAP codes. Will it do any harm if I continue to ignore it? Also what's your plan to find the CC from wrecked vehicles? off an LX570?

I found a used CC supposedly from a wrecked LX570 with 75k miles. $200 delivered including the separate filter housing. I’m going to swap it this weekend if the weather permits it. Hopefully this canister is good but at least it’s easy to access if it’s not.

 

[Musubi]

These. Might have a P0441 as well.
View attachment 4184317

WOAH, this is how I find out the 200 can read CEL from factory?? Or is this an aftermarket unit.

Mind sharing where you find that CC? eBay? at $200 might be worth parts cannoning it.

 

[linuxgod]

WOAH, this is how I find out the 200 can read CEL from factory?? Or is this an aftermarket unit.

Mind sharing where you find that CC? eBay? at $200 might be worth parts cannoning it.

I picked it up off eBay. This one also came with the filter which is recommended to replace at the same time as they apparently can get dusty and clogged, though given the filter line feeds back into the filler neck I don’t understand how.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/168242443687?mkcid=1&mkrid=711-53200-19255-0&siteid=0&campid=5337589904&customid=&toolid=10001&mkevt=1

The display is OBD Fusion which is running on an aftermarket Grom VLine installed behind the factory unit. The Grom is about $600 but provides CarPlay and can run any Android apps (though most Android apps kind of suck to use on the resistive touch screen).

You can buy a $20 OBD2 Bluetooth dongle and the $15 OBD Fusion app for your phone and it’ll work just as well for clearing codes. Everyone should have that IMO