BJ42 - Electrical system woes (24v)

[lostmarbles]

Normally if the batteries are not equal as in bought at the same time and same cranking amps and same brand I have found it leads to the problems you have mentioned that is just my experience with 24V cruisers such as the BJ42 and the HJ61 ....

It is not my experience .... but I'm sure that's only because I don't have a 24V cruiser..

However everything I know about electricity (and numerous threads I've read on ih8mud) says that owners of 24V vehicles should strictly follow Dieseler's advice here.

 

[SteveTheDog]

I am having a similar issue with my 85 BJ74. All of a sudden the lights in the picture came on along with the Filter light too. I looked at my VR and the wires going into it looked quite dodgy. Using the voltmeter I was only getting 23.3v when i had the positive on the battery and grounded it on the truck and only 11.2 when i was checking at the battery.
I cut all the wires out of the VR and resoldered them then plugged them back in. The lights on the dash went out but nothing really changed in the system volts.
I ordered a new VR from toyota however the date it was suppose to be in my hands keeps getting pushed back. Suppose to be here next Wed which will be 2 weeks from ordering.
I searched all over to find a non OEM IC replacement but it's like finding a pink mongoose. I did find a used one that i slapped in today along with two brand new batteries. All systems go, except for the lights came back on.
Now i am getting 24.6v when i am on the battery and ground is to the truck and 24.4v on the alt.

So, I don't know if the used VR, which looks a bit rough, is faulty as well or if the alt is going out. I guess i can limp around until the new VR comes in then make more decisions.

however on a side note. does anyone know where i can get a 24v IC VR for a 13BT or a high output atl that would be a plug and play

 

[SteveTheDog]

It is not my experience .... but I'm sure that's only because I don't have a 24V cruiser..

However everything I know about electricity (and numerous threads I've read on ih8mud) says that owners of 24V vehicles should strictly follow Dieseler's advice here.

I found this out to be true. one battery was new the other was not and drained a bit. The truck would show charge but when I turned the key it acted like it had no ground.

 

[Snow Peak]

It is not my experience .... but I'm sure that's only because I don't have a 24V cruiser..

However everything I know about electricity (and numerous threads I've read on ih8mud) says that owners of 24V vehicles should strictly follow Dieseler's advice here.

There are MANY people on here that I truly respect for their knowledge, hel

I am having a similar issue with my 85 BJ74. All of a sudden the lights in the picture came on along with the Filter light too. I looked at my VR and the wires going into it looked quite dodgy. Using the voltmeter I was only getting 23.3v when i had the positive on the battery and grounded it on the truck and only 11.2 when i was checking at the battery.
I cut all the wires out of the VR and resoldered them then plugged them back in. The lights on the dash went out but nothing really changed in the system volts.
I ordered a new VR from toyota however the date it was suppose to be in my hands keeps getting pushed back. Suppose to be here next Wed which will be 2 weeks from ordering.
I searched all over to find a non OEM IC replacement but it's like finding a pink mongoose. I did find a used one that i slapped in today along with two brand new batteries. All systems go, except for the lights came back on.
Now i am getting 24.6v when i am on the battery and ground is to the truck and 24.4v on the alt.

So, I don't know if the used VR, which looks a bit rough, is faulty as well or if the alt is going out. I guess i can limp around until the new VR comes in then make more decisions.

however on a side note. does anyone know where i can get a 24v IC VR for a 13BT or a high output atl that would be a plug and play

You're lucky you can still buy a new OEM VR! If there were new ones available for a Canada spec BJ42, I would have bought one right away.

 

[SteveTheDog]

i bought two of them, however, I really want to find another solution if possible.

 

[Snow Peak]

Are you looking for a cheaper solution? Or a solid state alternative? Or?

 

[SteveTheDog]

Are you looking for a cheaper solution? Or a solid state alternative? Or?

solid state..

 

[Snow Peak]

Ah I see. Unfortunately I can't help you there. I'd like a solid state alternative too!

 

[Greg_B]

Nathan at ASI Rebuilders in Abbotsford has been able to source electrical bits for us from time to time. And also in the past has sourced the correct splined armatures for oil fed vacuum pumps alternators he has rebuilt for us in the past. He might be worth a call.

hth's
gb

 

[Snow Peak]

Nathan at ASI Rebuilders in Abbotsford has been able to source electrical bits for us from time to time. And also in the past has sourced the correct splined armatures for oil fed vacuum pumps alternators he has rebuilt for us in the past. He might be worth a call.

hth's
gb

Thanks for the tip Greg! I'll give him a call if all else fails.

I stopped by the ATEB shop on Saturday and had a chat with the guys there. They said that there is also a possibility of special ordering a VR directly from Japan. May be another option too. Though, I thought that only the BJ42s destined for Canada had the round green plugs (for the VR), while every other market, had square plugs? Perhaps I am wrong?

 

[MatS]

Have you tried http://www.rareelectrical.com/c-48-voltage-regulator.aspx ?

 

[SteveTheDog]

Have you tried http://www.rareelectrical.com/c-48-voltage-regulator.aspx ?

they have nothing....

 

[bj40green]

I think you're looking for this aftermarket VR

The big question is... who is selling this brand?
Manufacturers / Brand name is New Era.

Rudi

EDIT: Note that you now have all the Toyota replacement numbers but also all Nippo Denso numbers. Google and Ebay are your friends.

 

[TLC Norway]

I went trough two of the new era VR's before I got my hand on a working used oem VR.

Also, the low side battery having lower voltage than high side battery is often a symptom of a link cable with resistance.
I had that with new batteries, with same build batch.
Replaced the link cable, and charge was more even on the two batteries.
Of course, two different brand/aged batteries are a source of issues. They all have different internal resistance, and therefore charge differently.
Keep them similar, and check resting voltage from time to time to be ahead of issues.
Also a good idea to swap them around once or twice a year.

 

[Snow Peak]

I think you're looking for this aftermarket VR
View attachment 1032707

The big question is... who is selling this brand?
Manufacturers / Brand name is New Era.

Rudi

EDIT: Note that you now have all the Toyota replacement numbers but also all Nippo Denso numbers. Google and Ebay are your friends.

Turns out the part# for my VR is 27700-57030. Hmm, wonder if any of those would work?

Going to be getting new batteries sometime this week. Hoping the issue will be fixed. Got a little road trip planned for this up coming weekend...so It'll be a good test to see if everything is running okay. Picked up two trickle battery chargers today so I can fully charge the new batteries before installing them as well. Might even run some leads into the engine bay and mount my multimeter on the dash so I can keep an eye on the charging state.

I went trough two of the new era VR's before I got my hand on a working used oem VR.

Also, the low side battery having lower voltage than high side battery is often a symptom of a link cable with resistance.
I had that with new batteries, with same build batch.
Replaced the link cable, and charge was more even on the two batteries.
Of course, two different brand/aged batteries are a source of issues. They all have different internal resistance, and therefore charge differently.
Keep them similar, and check resting voltage from time to time to be ahead of issues.
Also a good idea to swap them around once or twice a year.

I'll have to ohm out the link cable and see what it's at. Any idea what the max ohm reading should be, before it needs to be replaced? Went and looked at some batteries today. Found one that will fit my battery tray with 950CCA, but they did not have two that are the same MFD. I'm going to try a different location this week.

 

[bj40green]

I'll have to ohm out the link cable and see what it's at. Any idea what the max ohm reading should be, before it needs to be replaced?

You can't "ohm it out" because if even one strand from the 200 strands is ok your reading will be 0 ohm.
But............. you can measure the voltage drop over this cable when you crank the engine. Voltage drop should be less then 0.5 volt.

Turns out the part# for my VR is 27700-57030. Hmm, wonder if any of those would work?

The fact that this VR was exclusively used only in Canadian BJ42's tells me that the only difference with 24V VR's posted above is the connector.

IIRC your connector is green and round, right?

Rudi

 

[SteveTheDog]

are these more readily available?

 

[Snow Peak]

@bj40green I do indeed have the round green connector. I've been trying to find a thread on here where another member had an issue with his 24v regulator. He got one from SOR but of course it had the square connector. His cut off the connector and rewired it; it didn't end up working though. He ended up finding a used oem and that's the last I heard. I can't for the life of me find that thread though...

Update:

This issue is still kicking my butt. I found a used VR from a reliable local source. Also got two new batteries. They are group 34/78DT, 960 CCA.

I put both batteries on a trickle charge the night before install. Installed the "new" VR. Fired her up aaand...still wasn't getting full output! With headlights on, max output I've been getting is 25.3v from the alternator. Swapped in the original VR and same number. Low side battery doesn't go higher than 12.2v and the high side doesn't go higher than 12.3v. This is with just the headlights/marker lights on and with throttle pulled.

I've been going back and forth to the shop. Alternator has been checked out multiple times and everything checks out fine they say. The noise coming from it is still there though. Today they said that the noise may be coming from the vacuum pump instead.

They're thinking that maybe the batteries are too large for the alternator to fully charge. Could this be a possibility? Even if they were to big, the output from the alternator should still be 28V or so, right?

Any further help would be super super helpful!

Thanks everyone!

 

[bj40green]

Output voltage on the alternator +B stud at:
1. Idle, no load should be: 25 - 26V
2. High idle (1000 rpm and up) no load should be: around 28V (27.5 - 28.8V)
3. High idle under load (headlights etc.) should be 25 - 26V

If the voltage at "high idle under load" is more than 24V (25.3V in your case) it means that the main part (90%) of alternator power is going to the headlights and that a little part (10%) of the power goes to the battery. In other words all energy users are fed by the alternator and what's left goes to the battery.
The crucial measurement is: High idle, no load, just the engine running, should be around 28V.

If all of the above numbers are correct you can do the same measurements on the Battery + stud. The readings should be:
1. 25 - 26V
2. around 28V
3. a half volt lower, so 24.5 - 25.5V
This is caused by the resistance and length of the cables/wires and the fusible link.

The batteries are not too big. It only takes more time for a full recharge.

Rudi.

 

[Snow Peak]

Output voltage on the alternator +B stud at:
1. Idle, no load should be: 25 - 26V
2. High idle (1000 rpm and up) no load should be: around 28V (27.5 - 28.8V)
3. High idle under load (headlights etc.) should be 25 - 26V

If the voltage at "high idle under load" is more than 24V (25.3V in your case) it means that the main part (90%) of alternator power is going to the headlights and that a little part (10%) of the power goes to the battery. In other words all energy users are fed by the alternator and what's left goes to the battery.
The crucial measurement is: High idle, no load, just the engine running, should be around 28V.

If all of the above numbers are correct you can do the same measurements on the Battery + stud. The readings should be:
1. 25 - 26V
2. around 28V
3. a half volt lower, so 24.5 - 25.5V
This is caused by the resistance and length of the cables/wires and the fusible link.

The batteries are not too big. It only takes more time for a full recharge.

Rudi.

I continually appreciate your help Rudi!

I made the last post after I returned from the shop. I ended up leaving the LC there. From what I can remember:

1. No higher than 24.2v
2. No higher than 25.3v
3. Can't remember what the numbers for high idle and under load

I did get a call from the shop yesterday. After a lengthy time working on it, they found a melted wire. Between the alternator and VR. I'm not exactly sure where the melted wire is located, didn't get much info. He said he would send some pictures, but haven't received them. I'll hopefully get more info tomorrow. Any ideas on what would cause this?