"VSC" Caused me to total my LC-100 (1 Viewer)

[Alaskan_IB]

Hey all just a heads up and a warning. If you have no clue how to drive in snow and ice then just ignore this thread. If you do live and drive in snow and ice then listen up if you own a LC-100 or Lexus.

I have lived and worked in Alaska for my whole life and drive in snow and ice most of the year. (work on the north slope as well) I just purchased a 2000 Land Cruiser and love it. The thing I did NOT KNOW is the VSC system. This is a great setup that controls skid or vehicle side movement when the vehicle looses traction and brakes a line per say. If you live in normally cold weather or Arctic conditions this happens all the time. I have not driven this vehicle in ice or snow yet and found out real quick this thing (VSC) thinks it can drive better than I can...

I am here to tell you that if you start to slide you turn your steering towards the direction of your slide and this will level out the vehicle....whatever you do DO NOT BRAKE. So here I am going 45-50 MPH in a 55 and I slip a little (totally normal if you live in Alaska) and I do whats natural......turn towards the slide.

If this sounds nuts to you got to an empty parking lot with lots of water or ice on it and try. It will keep the rig straight and you can correct the slide..

So I turn towards the slip...a very minor slide and the truck brakes and powers up the wheels to the direction of my turn. I didn't realize this but what is a corrective action for me is seen as the direction the vehicle thinks i want to go. Two seconds later BAM into the guardrail.

So here is a recap.....if you are using VSC and are driving in snow and or ice and you start to slip and know how to correct this because you are a great driver and need no computer telling you how to drive then watch out. Otherwise if you start to slide do whats unnatural for us Alaskans and turn away from the slide and let the VSC take over and pray it doesnt brake to hard. I am looking into disabling my VSC without loosing my traction control and activating my diff lock. If anyone has done this by all means let me know.


Robert

 

[BROKEROB1]

So... the way I read your thread, you were either were driving too fast for conditions or (by your account) the most capable vehicles on planet earth made you crash? Are you leaving this up for debate?

Please help the readers understand....

 

[packer]

Sounds like the driver and truck corrected at the same time. NOt too sure, no VSC for me. With VSC, do you need to correct, or just point and hope?

 

[ChuckB]

I'm glad that you are ok. This is probably going to turn into an interesting debate....

 

[Elijah]

I knew there was a reason I didn't buy one with VSC!

 

[1loudLX]

VSC knows who's boss around here.

 

[2000UZJ]

Doesn't the CDL cancel VSC?

 

[1loudLX]

I am looking into disabling my VSC without loosing my traction control and activating my diff lock. If anyone has done this by all means let me know.


Robert

Doesn't the CDL cancel VSC?

yup, but he doesnt want to activate his. I've had VSC kick-in during a powerslide in the LS430 and I already countersteered and fixed it all, then it decided to freak out, didnt hit anything though. I know what Alaska's talking about though. There are times where us people who see snow regularly would like to just have a defeat switch for VSC. Countersteer for life!

 

[Devils Paw 80]

..Otherwise if you start to slide do whats unnatural for us Alaskans and turn away from the slide and let the VSC take over and pray it doesnt brake to hard...

Easier said than done. Turning into the slide is practically an instinctive reaction for me.

 

[1loudLX]

Easier said than done. Turning into the slide is practically an instinctive reaction for me.

likewise.

 

[farinvail]

Sorry about your truck, glad your alright. I drove a Lexus 300 with VSC. I kind of agree with you. If you know how to drive in snow and ice it totally sucks. But I guess if you are useless then it probably helps a lot. I'm not convinced that VSC caused your accident. The worst is if you start sliding and you want to gas is more. That's when it totally blows. But yes, if my truck had it. I'd find a way to disable it.

VSC point and hope. No VSC, bring on the power slide. Maybe search with the drifting crowd. I don't imagine you can drift with VSC. Anyone with VSC ever grab a handful of parking brake while turning? What happens?

What we can all learn from this is to practice and become familar with the behavior of your rig in a controled environment.

I'm from Minnesota.

 

[LandCruiserPhil]

I dont see myself driving in snow but if it starts to slide with VSC just close my eyes hold my line and hope for the best.
Didnt Shotts say without VSC you will die!

 

[1loudLX]

I'm from Minnesota.

...and live at the bottom of a world famous ski-mountain


I cant comment with certainty since I dont remember the effects, but I'm pretty sure e-brake sliding with the VSC it didnt like that either. CDL is my friend in the snow anyways. Pretty sure Colorado SP is still looking for that freak drifting thru I-70 traffic in a blizzard


A-TRAC is nice to have offroad, however if someone took my VSC and disabled it forever I'd be quite happy, it's never "saved me" and only prevented me from having fun.

 

[OursSauvage]

Easier said than done. Turning into the slide is practically an instinctive reaction for me.

And it's a way of life for riders

 

[re_guderian]

Hey all just a heads up and a warning. If you have no clue how to drive in snow and ice then just ignore this thread. If you do live and drive in snow and ice then listen up if you own a LC-100 or Lexus.

I have lived and worked in Alaska for my whole life and drive in snow and ice most of the year. (work on the north slope as well) I just purchased a 2000 Land Cruiser and love it. The thing I did NOT KNOW is the VSC system. This is a great setup that controls skid or vehicle side movement when the vehicle looses traction and brakes a line per say. If you live in normally cold weather or Arctic conditions this happens all the time. I have not driven this vehicle in ice or snow yet and found out real quick this thing (VSC) thinks it can drive better than I can...

I am here to tell you that if you start to slide you turn your steering towards the direction of your slide and this will level out the vehicle....whatever you do DO NOT BRAKE. So here I am going 45-50 MPH in a 55 and I slip a little (totally normal if you live in Alaska) and I do whats natural......turn towards the slide.

If this sounds nuts to you got to an empty parking lot with lots of water or ice on it and try. It will keep the rig straight and you can correct the slide..

So I turn towards the slip...a very minor slide and the truck brakes and powers up the wheels to the direction of my turn. I didn't realize this but what is a corrective action for me is seen as the direction the vehicle thinks i want to go. Two seconds later BAM into the guardrail.

So here is a recap.....if you are using VSC and are driving in snow and or ice and you start to slip and know how to correct this because you are a great driver and need no computer telling you how to drive then watch out. Otherwise if you start to slide do whats unnatural for us Alaskans and turn away from the slide and let the VSC take over and pray it doesnt brake to hard. I am looking into disabling my VSC without loosing my traction control and activating my diff lock. If anyone has done this by all means let me know.


Robert

I'm with Phil down in PHX, so rarely drive in the snow anymore (except for bringing home my truck in a blizzard from Denver 3 weeks ago), but have driven plenty of miles in the snow when I lived in UT.

I'm having a hard time deciphering from your post exactly what happened, and how VSC put you into the railing. You were headed straight, and rear end started to come around? then when you turned into it, VSC made the car over-correct?

 

[pman]

I'm having a hard time deciphering from your post exactly what happened,

X2

I don't mean this personally, but I think blaming the truck for an accident is kinda lame......especially if nothing failed to function as it was intended to in the first place

Sorry about your 100

 

[Topoguide]

I think I can offer an explanation of why Alaskan is saying VSC caused his wreck… Since I had the experience, nay the privilege, of having the VSC save me from an unkindly little drop off whilst driving in mud (you remember Rob) I know exactly what Alaskan is referring to. And yes I am here in Phoenix now too, but like others have plenty of experience from living where it snows.

Anyway, it was my first time in mud with this LC an I was trying to go left on a very muddy road, my Michelins were loaded up (big surprise), and my CDL was not engaged.:whoops: So the VSC kicked in and decelerated the engine for me, and I mean fast; with the cut in power and possible braking only to the appropriate wheel the truck jumped left VERY rapidly. Of course I then turned the CDL on and it acted more like what I was expecting in the first place.

In the situation I was in the VSC worked phenomenally, but if I was in snow traveling at a much faster rate and trying to maintain a straight path the last thing I would want would be to have the VSC kick in. By turning the wheel in the proper direction to correct a slide (if you didn’t have VSC) the VSC thinks you want to go in that direction and corrects improperly. For example the rear end starts to pass you on the right, you turn wheels to the right to correct, you start to straighten out, then VSC kicks in and… BAM into the guard rail!! At least from my experience with VSC I would say that when it kicks in it will do so ferociously and could quite possibly send you careening towards the guard rail.

If you did not have prior experience in snow you would probably be grateful for VSC, but after driving for years correcting slides yourself… not so much (unless you remember to correct what seem like the wrong way).

Of course I can't say for sure that's what happened 'cause I wasn't there. But I will say that I had a truck that put me into a fence and it functioned how it was designed... of course it was a Ford It had the early anti-lock brakes and they wouldn't "lock" in the snow... I was doing 5 mph and they didn't even slow me down!! The true definition of anti-lock means they won't stop you because to stop they have to lock at some point. So after the fence stopped me I pulled the fuse on the ABS and no more problems. Sometimes technology gets in the way of a good driver.

 

[nuclearlemon]

i don't think i'll ever understand the trend to keep people who don't know how to drive from getting in accidents. i also grew up driving in the snow (the midwest and, now, colorado) and i don't want any computer to tell me how to handle the conditions. my 80 will never have the abs hooked up because i almost wrecked when i used the abs for the first time on a ford i had....i did everything i should have, the abs kicked in and it just started sliding. if i had done a brake release thing, i could've stopped long before the vehicle actually did. now there's something that won't let me point my rig where it needs to be

 

[OursSauvage]

Why don't just put CDL on when off pavement ? (I mean mud and snow... not on rock)
It's not an honor lost and no more ABS or VSC or Idontknowwhatelse issue

 

[CrusrDug]

Too bad this happened. Definitely a different animal if you have never experienced it. Luckily for me I was in a parking lot playing and figured it out because otherwise I probably would have lost the battle as well. It assumes you do not know how to counter steer because most people don't. For those who get a chance, lock the center diff and play around. It will be like the old days- woohoo!!