BC government is at it again (1 Viewer)

http://www.cbc.ca/consumer/story/2006/12/22/japanesecars.html

they admit no evidence but are requesting it anyway...

boys, you keep sitting on your hands and the door for BC will close...
it is time to take action NOW...

Wayne, what in your opinion is the probability that this is actually going to happen? Or is this just another request on a government list? Would this not effect the national scene rather than B.C. only? What do you think the effect would be on pricing? Would they grandfather? I know you don't know the answers, but your educated opinion would be very interesting. What, if anything, can be done in terms of action?

I can't imagine them not grandfathering. It's the only way to not cause a huge protest. It's the same way they've been chipping away at the grandfathered gun owners. Set it to a finite number, and then wait for attrition to dwindle it to zero. It's passive but it still does what they want, and they don't have to deal with compensation or property rights challenges in court.

Hopefully this is just a whine from the dumb liberals here. I'm very close to signing on the dotted line for a Feb'92 Pajero with 61K on it, air shocks, a snorkle, and a Warn winch . I can't imagine these beaurocratic idiots could get anything done in time to submarine my deal... HOPEFULLY!

Martin,
You are asking some very good questions.

To be bluntly honest I feel they have just shot themselves n the foot. We now know that just because they have taken a step back on enforcement of the SAE/DOT compliance random inspection, which gave the BC persons a false sense of hope, was just a ruse so they could try a different angle.
With this information reaching the headlines there is hope that finally the owners of RHD cars and trucks will rise up and fight this movement. A call to action per says.

Even though a request has been made, and we know already that BC had initiated a request long before now, Transport Canada confirmed that it would be a minimum of 2 years to implement. To add to the situation the other provinces do not back the feelings of the BC government mostly because THERE IS NOT PROOF as admitted in the link above by the BC government.

IF they had proof then their case would be much stronger, what we need to do is get motivated to take action to stop this movement in its infancy. (Actually we should have started 2 years ago but the fear and hope that the BC government would come to its senses kept many from doing so) If we can petition the Canadian Government to gets proof that the RHD units accident rate is smaller per capita than LHD units we will be able to squash this.

Alberta has stood up to the movement by BC (for now) but there are no guarantees in life. This might take another reversal again so to assume Alberta is risk free is foolishness. But this being said we have a province that is one our side (for now) and we should take advantage of this while we still can.

The government cannot outlaw the RHD units that have already made it to Canadian soil but the government insurance run provinces could make the premiums too high to actually insure the units or they might put a ban on insuring the units at all. The private brokers on the other hand will still insure the units till there is proof they are more of a risk than the LHD counterparts.

What can we do?

Drive responsibly would be the first and easiest action we can take.

Organize ourselves into a group that is working together, a group of RHD owners, not as a group of importers. A nation wide club, I have lawyers, cops, forestry, oil workers, Geological Engineer, Park Warden, Doctors that I have sold trucks to that would come on board if there was such a group started. I have a lawyer that is willing to take on a case to fight this. We could become a force to be reckoned with, one thing the government loves is apathy and Canadians in general are apathetic. If this was happening in America there would be action taken a year ago, here they are counting on us to sit back and go "Oh Well"

DON”T PANIC, if we panic then all rationality heads out the door and they have won. It will be 2 years before they will be able to have the door shut IF they can but if we panic then irrational behavior will result. All this post does is alert us that the BC government DOES NOT HAVE PROOF of what they are applying for. If they could have kept this under wraps until they blind-sided us with the actions it would have been much easier for them.

Don’t panic buy, NOTHING HAS CHANGED. There are going to be Importers that are going to use this information to “Pressure Sell” to the public. DO NOT SUCCUME to the pressure. We will get more accurate information over the next 2 years, hearsay and rumors will abound and get blown all out of proportion especially by importers trying to fuel the fire to instill fear into the buying public.

What will this mean to value of the RHD import? IF the BC Government operated insurance company did decide to stop insuring RHD units then the value of course to a BC resident is minimal but to the other Canadian provinces with independent brokers the RHD value will still be a constant. The government will not be able to stop the sale of DOT/SAE compliant vehicles but the ones that were registered illegally then these will need to be made to comply or once again there is a fear of a very expensive front lawn ornament.

If you are in the position to buy and want a RHD unit then do so but if you need to put your families happiness in jeopardy or make your families budget too tight then DO NOT BUY at this time. There is still 2 years before we have anything to worry about. Once we feel there is urgency we will let the buying public know WITH FACTS not hearsay. This letter is a wake up call, nothing else. There are no new facts contained in this posting.

Once again, we need to DRIVE RESPONSIBLY, ORGANISE and DO NOT PANIC.

The BC government never did back down but we can make it extremely hard for them to proceed if we group together. Do not wait for your buddy to make the decision for you, it is your enjoyment that the government is trying to take away, your freedom of choice is being threatened so do something about it.

As more information cone to light we will be posting it up.

Cheers and Happy Holidays

article copied

B.C. tries to put brakes on right-hand-drive cars
Last Updated: Friday, December 22, 2006 | 4:44 PM ET
CBC News
They are in excellent mechanical shape with low mileage, but used right-hand-drive vehicles from Japan are raising safety concerns in British Columbia.

Provincial officials are concerned the vehicles might be dangerous in passing situations and have asked Transport Canada to step in.

Mike Woods, manager for vehicle inspections in the province, said that while there's no evidence of accidents caused by right-hand-drive vehicles, officials need more time to determine their safety record.

"There is some concern, and the Insurance Corp. of B.C. is probably looking at that quite closely, and I'm certain that the Insurance Bureau of Canada is also looking into it," Woods said.

Some officials worry the cars may be dangerous when passing because the driver's range of vision is limited on the outside of the road.

All cars imported from Japan —where motorists drive on the left-hand side of the road — are at least 15 years old because federal laws place restrictions on newer cars.

However, B.C. officials have asked Transport Canada to extend that to 25 years in an attempt to reduce the number of right-hand-drive cars entering the province.

About 175 Japanese right-hand-drive cars are registered in B.C. every month — a number that has grown steadily, provincial officials say.

One of them is owned by Thomas Nottelman, who imported his 16-year-old Toyota Corolla and several other cars from Japan. Because Japan has tough mechanical regulations and regular inspections, he said, its second-hand cars are prized.

Many of them have "never seen an accident, they've never seen dirt, they certainly don't have any rust, and they're exceptionally low mileage," Nottelman said.

"So you can't buy anything comparable here, unless you happen to find a little old lady's car."

I read this article this morning. I love the "we're not sure if they are more or less dangerous, but lets change it to 25 years anyway just to be safe." approach. I can't see them doing anything without going through several studies so it will probably take some time. And I also cannot see them not grandfathering the existing ones..And since they are asking Transport Canada to step in, if anything happens, it will likely be nation wide, not just for us "BC boys." I am not too alarmed by this article (knew it was coming already) but will now be watching the issue even more closely

But who out of any of the provinces would you have guessed to raise this issue!

If they enforce the 25 year and older on RHD imports like the States, are they also going to enforce the 25 year on LHD like BMW's and Mercedes? Or are they going to be exempt? I think not. This has nothing to do with safety, BUT ideological differences, i.e. "I don't have a right hand drive. I don't want a right hand drive, I don't think you should have a right hand drive..." Government thinking...big brother is always watching.

Wayne who is behind the push to ban imports? In oz it was the car dealers lobbying their politician mates because it was pushing the price of used cars down which made to harder sell new cars because they couldnt offer inflated trade in prices on used local cars

A 175 cars a month can make a big difference to demand and most of them are probably small to medium sized cars which would be a real flea in a car dealers balls.

were can we get the facts that rhd are safe and don't cause any more accidents than lhd? how many rhd in canada were in at fault accidents in canada?

roscoFJ73 said:

Wayne who is behind the push to ban imports? In oz it was the car dealers lobbying their politician mates because it was pushing the price of used cars down which made to harder sell new cars because they couldnt offer inflated trade in prices on used local cars

A 175 cars a month can make a big difference to demand and most of them are probably small to medium sized cars which would be a real flea in a car dealers balls.

Click to expand...

it is one of the head guys that works at transport Canada. too bad he doesn't have the balls to post his name... but like most trouble makers, they hide and fight from obsurity...

contact the insurance companies... there is one guy that works for BCIC here on the forum but i do beleive his hands are tired...now if he was to drop the states into my email box by accident, i could see to it that they made it to the forum anomiously...

;^)

The Cougar Ace that rolled in the Gulf of Alaska has space for over 5200 vehicles. When it rolled it was only carrying about 4800. Do shipping companies usually sail with empty space if they can sell it? Why are people waiting 2 to 4 months for Ro-Ro space if ships are sailing with empty spaces? 1. Someone is pressuring the shipping lines not to accept as many used vehicles as they could. 2. Someone has bought the spaces but is not using them 3. Someone has bought the spaces simply to exclude ‘grey-market’ imports. I can think of a few ‘stakeholders’ who have the clout to do all or any of the above.

So, they’ve tried to cut off the flow that way, but it hasn’t worked. Vehicles are now coming in containers. This is no doubt the next step.

I have spoken to several senior people at TC several times and although they were always polite, it was very clear that they would like to move to a 25 year exclusion. Why?

1. 'Harmonization' with US regulations. If you're not sure why they'd want to do that, Google "North American Integration" and "Beyond NAFTA". Basically, they are going to formalize our colonial status by the back door: regulatory changes with no public discussion or debate.

2. Bureaucratic control impulse: they don't like people 'getting around' their authority/regulations. The use of large numbers of vehicles that don’t meet their standards, without any safety problems resulting, calls into question the validity/necessity of those same standards. They are waiting for that first fatal accident where someone dies in a micro Suzuki or whatever. I was told that is all it would take to shut down importing. I guess they’re tired of waiting.

3. Pressure from NA car manufacturers/sellers (this is a logical assumption) They seem to think that if we can't buy imports we'll buy some of their junk instead.

4. Liabilites, headaches, etc. Bureaucrats at all levels from CVSE to TC, naturally like the quiet life and imports just add another layer of complication without offering the potential to enlarge the bureaucracy significantly. They have their regulations and routines in place and imports open a set of issues they’d just rather not have to deal with/learn about.

I was told by people at TC that BC and Alberta are the major complainers and BC in particular. Pressure is being exerted by the ‘stakeholders’ mentioned above and CVSE is the mouthpiece for obvious reasons of ‘optics’. If TC is (also) the source of the pressure, they are covering their trail/tail and improving their chances of getting what they want past the politicians by getting the provincial authorities to raise the matter first. This is tailored to appeal to the Conservatives obviously, as coming from the western provinces, rather than an Ottawa bureaucracy inherited from the Liberals.

If TC does move to a 25 year exclusion they can do this through a change of regulations, not an act of parliament, I was told this very clearly.

Such a ban, being a change in federal regulations, will be enforced nation-wide. This is not just a “BC issue”.

I can't see them doing anything without going through several studies so it will probably take some time.

Click to expand...

Don't count on it, this could happen very quickly indeed. Those pushing have every incentive to make it happen before opponents can get their act together. Do you think it is coincidence this has come out just before Christmas?

TC prepared a study at least 18 months ago to support this move. The study of course is based on the irrelevant conclusion that lower-priced vehicles are involved in more accidents! A large part of the reason of course is that lower-priced vehicles tend to belong to younger, more irresponsible, careless drivers and the 'marginal' segments of the population who have a similar accident rate, as well as being more prone to mechanical failures.

As we all know, even the rewound imports are in better mechanical (not to mention cosmetic) condition than most of the domestic used vehicles, and certainly better than all the NA beaters we see driving around.

Previa Diesel said:

I was told by people at TC that BC and Alberta are the major complainers and BC in particular.

If TC does move to a 25 year exclusion they can do this through a change of regulations, not an act of parliament, I was told this very clearly.

Such a ban, being a change in federal regulations, will be enforced nation-wide. This is not just a “BC issue”.

Click to expand...

first, Alberta does not have the same feelings as BC as shown by the relaxation of the inspection codes. BC is anal, Alberta is safety compliant.

interesting since i was told the opposite, it is an act that MUST go through Parliment and that it would take a minimum of 2 years to impliment even if it did pass tomorrow... interesting. where you talking to someone in Ottawa or some pee on in BC? we already know the pee-ons in BC contradict even each other.

it will be nation wide but it will start with the bone heads in BC.

either do something or crawl back into your holes and watch your RHD sit on your lawns in 2 years... choice is yours.

So.....should there be an a place where all RHD owners in Canada can put their name in so that we all know what's going on, or at least be able to ban together? Has anyone done anything about this or to promote this?

I think that perhaps we're all a bit scattered here and Mr. Jim Pattison is a bit more organized than we are.

How do I help to try to keeep RHD's legal in Canada?

I have been approached to help organize a petition (which is AN EXCELLENT start), this Petition will be hosted on my Luxury site once we get the ball rolling here on mud.
the suggestion was a simple one. we need your email address and a signature. for now that would be it. similar to all that spam mail you get monthly.
we let it run for a month, analize whether we have enough names to even bother going any further.
if we have enough names then we can forward this to the bloke in Ottawa that has the power to do something.
I have his name and office mailing address.

here is what was suggested to me:

<quote:>
think you should host a webpage inconjuntion with Luxury imports site. Make it dedicated to proving the safety of RHD, with a place people can sign the petition.
Then you and others could join every forum known to get people to aware of the petition, also send a link/fax to the other importers in Canada with a address for your site so theu too can sign and get their customers all the way back to sign.

Send it to all your customers and so on.

Start on Mud with the link. But someone needs to host it. But not in forum format, someting simple where they enter there email address and then sign there name.

Get as many owners of RHD to ask "show me the proof" and then after it has collected signatures for a month or two forward it to Transport Canada and all the provinces.

<end quote>

Greg approached me to remind me we also have the Yahoo RHD group. sad to say any attempts we have tried to use to organise has shown very dismal response.

what i want is someone to make a template, something i can post to my site. i will get the emails and "signature" sent to my email address then i will move it over to the site OR if anyone has a better idea i am open to it. we do not need an address or phone number but if you want to send that i can keep it private for full contact should we need more support.

Remember, this is YOUR fight to keep the RHD society moving. we need to start this fight NOW. RIGHT NOW. if we can get organized quickly then maybe we will have a fighting chance to put a stop to what i feel is a threat to our freedom of choice.

i have watched as other grops fail when it came to fighting a goverment decision, the goverment won by keeping the different factions fighting against each other. i have seen the faces of the goverment people when a vebal fight breaks out, and the look is success. i have watched as the goverment drag their heals at responding to be able to get their act together. and finally i have watched as the goverment lied to the people about what they were and were not going to do. i have very little faith in some members of our goverment to work for our best interests.

here is the difference, the goverment themselves have no problem with the right hand drives, many of the Transport Canada workers have nothing against the RHD units BUT there are some that have in their heads that it is better for the populace in general if these were removed from the highways. these are the ones we need to stop. we need to get as many groups notified of the fight and not just the RHD owners, ANYONE that likes to drive a 15 year old import be it a Rover, MGB, BMW, Benz, VW... anyone that has a yearning for the unique is encouraged to add to the petition.

Peeps, this is YOUR petition. YOUR fight for the freedom to own what you like to enjoy. YOUR last chance to act is now.

we have dragged our heals for over a year and those people that feel it is unsafe to drive a RHD are organising as we speak.

Let's turn our backs on the traditional Canadian way, let's do something.

In the end we need to work together. this petition is for the average 15 year old owner and want-to-be owner.

OH WOW, what a way to kick out the old year and welcome in the new.

cheers and seasons greetings

Hi Guys,

I have also heard that in less than 2 years the doors could be closed - I used to work for TC and still know a bunch of people there. I find it hard to believe that the person who told Wayne that nothing was in the works a couple of months ago didn't know about anything.

Anyway, if you are planning on buying a cruiser or importing one you should budget to have one purchased in the next couple of years - just my opinion.

The Yahoo group RHDTLC has 62 members now and although it is fairly inactive it still has 62 confirmed members - more than any other group with the same interest - if there is one.

I like Waynes freinds idea - but believe it shouldnt be attached to his website as it could be seen as too much of a commercial interest - although allowing RHD 15 year old imports to keep coming in is in the best interest of us importers of course. I suggest a blog page or separate site - just my opinion.

I am sure you will have 62 signatures from our group.

I suggest that anyone in BC contact all the dealers who sell RHD, have them contact their customers (they have the contact info) and get them to sign the petition.

Also, one of the best resources would be the customs brokers in BC - they know who and how many cars have actaully been sold to canada - and who owns them. I know for a fact that the Brokers are crapping over this BC nonsense and I am sure they would be happy to make a mass emai/letter campaign to their customers about the situation.

I will contact my customs broker to see what they can do.

Just some thoughts.

Merry XMAS!

Louis

This will cause a rash of buying, less scrupulus importers to "pressure sell" to a panicy public.

AT THIS POINT THERE IS NOTHING HAPPENING>

there is talk, it is the same talk that has been going on for quite a while. all this post did was bring it to the fore again. it did not bring any new facts to the surface.

curious as to why we need a blog when you already have started the RHD board on Yahoo, i am trying to understand the difference...

we need to emphasis the "COULD HAPPEN" in the post above. at this point we have done NOTHING and if we keep on DOING NOTHING then it WILL happen. at this point we have a very good chance to stop this from happening if we work together.

the person i talked to did not say they did not know about the push, they said there was nothing in the works. they also said it would take years to have it changed. does this mean we can keep on sitting on our hands? no. but it does mean we do not have to panic people into buying from us. it does mean if we get motivated we can do something.

what commercial aspect would there be for me to post this as a link to my site? i DO NOT do quanity sales. i WILL NOT do quanity sales.
so for the general public my site is not appealing for purchases, but many people turn to my site for the latest infomation of what to watch out for, what is happening with the importing situation.

one thing we don't need is someone screaming "THE SKY IS FALLING" as a leader. we need someone that can motivate without using fear mongering. we also need someone that has earned a trust with the RHD public.

I can think of a few that fit this bill but only a few. Greg and Sheldon, myself, Marco, Dan and Kevin these all have an interest in what is happeing. If anyone of these can spare the time that will be the question. These ones have been around for at least 3 years and have a good to excellent reputation with the RHD community.

I agree we need to contact as many people as possible both inside and out side of the RHD community, ANYONE that wants the 15 year rule to stay in effect should be entitled to join. remember this is not a RHD only issue.

just my thoughts

Wayne,

It isn't fear mongering - I am simply stating what I am doing - I will have my own trucks purchased by then - my keepers. And, I suggest that since there is more than just rumours about this that aynone who wants a JDM should plan on buying one in the next 2 years. You think this will cause a rash of buying?? I don't think so. Most of the guys on this board import their own cruisers, I am not looking to fear monger people into buying from me - or you - or anyone else. I am a dealer and I am also a realist and a cruiserhead.

This is not the same talk that has been going on for years by the way, I suggest you make new contacts at TC, more relaible contacts.

To say that nothing is happening at this point is false - something is happening - you were the one who posted the article. Meetings are taking place - something is happening - I am sure you read the article. You tell people to be more active in this cause, that nothing is happening, then saying that people are doing nothing and they should do something about it, and in the same breath you say that anyone who says this importing is coming to an end is a fear mongerer - who is the messenger and who is doing the fear mongering?

When I say use a blog and not your site - it is for the image to the gov't who might be looking at it as lobby group basically. Do they take it more seriously coming from a commercial importer site or from a group of people interested and fighting for a cause. I have been involved in this type of thing before and have some experience with it so I am just offering suggestions. Take em or leave em. The commercal aspect is the view from the gov't - not from a point of view of increasing your sales in short.

THE RHDTLC group although is open to anyone is not as easily accecsed as a webpage or blog. Check out the blogs and you will see what I mean.

LOL, I don't think anyone is screaming that the sky is falling, and I don't think that we need a holy person reveared by the RHD community as a spokesperson. No one in the skyline community knows anyone from the cruiser community - no one from the kei car community knows anyone from the skyline community, see what I mean? Someone who is intelligent, well spoken, has ties in Gov't etc etc etc is needed. One of the first people to be contacted should be the Members Legislative Assistants (MLA) in everyones area, these are the people who lobby on behalf of individuals - a place to start atleast. They also have direct access to all of the provincial depts.

Just my thoughts, have a great xmas day.

A lobby groups main purpose is to show the gov't how important an industry or cause is to that gov't - mainly finanically. It is not to respond to what might be rumours, articles etc etc.

The bottom line is that the importation of the JDM's creates jobs, businesses, tax revenue etc etc. Revenue is generated for the gov't on all levels from Federal tax, provincial tax, provincial emissions testing, provincial registering, CFIA fees, and down to parts revenue, vehicle maintenance, vehicle painting, dealerships, staffing, broker revenue etc etc.

The other thing they have to be convinced of is that the owners of JDM's would most likely have not bought CDM vehicles if the JDM's weren't available. This is a very niche market and vehicle specific.

In a nutshell you have to show the Gov't that it is not in their best interest to stop the importation - or change the year rule.

Don't get me wrong, wayne's ideas are great, and it is a good thing that someone is doing something, people just need to pull out all their contacts and resources and define a clear path that the group of jdm owners and importers need to take.

Just my opinion and experience.