hey guys and gals just wanted to let you know i found in a catalog at work a product that sounds just like por 15 for less then half the cost. it only costs $38.50 a gal. unless you buy 4 or more. check it out at www.gemplers.com and key word search for rust converter. i am thinking of trying it, has any one heard off it? they also have lots of other stuff and they offer a free catalog.