MAMBA CT12B Turbo Upgrade for a 1KZ-TE

GTSSportCoupe

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Does anyone know if this Mamba CT12B can bolt right up to a Prado J78 with a 1KZ-TE engine?

MAMBA Upgrade Turbo CT12B TOYOTA 1KZ 3.0L Hilux Land Cruiser +35
MAMBA Upgrade Turbo CT12B TOYOTA 1KZ 3.0L Hilux Land Cruiser +35

Has anyone tried?


New guy Adam
Why do you want to upgrade? Are you looking for more performance or replacing a failing turbo?

You know the stock CT12B is a pretty darn fine turbo right? Have you played with the tune of your motor at all? Have you reached the limits of the CT12B? Do you know how to tune your 1KZTE and surpass the factory fuel cut that occurs at 15psi?

I can give you some ideas if it's power you're looking for....
 
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I’m looking to replace the turbo because my mechanic has told me That the Turbo has failed and is likely the cause of all the black smoke and poor performance

I believe I have a CT 20 in there now and it appears as though the CT 12 B would give me 35% more horsepower

And no, I have no idea how to surpass the 15 psi fuel cut off.

I figure if I’m going to replace the failed turbo I might as well get one that gives me a little bit more power

Any help would be greatly appreciated
 

GTSSportCoupe

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I’m looking to replace the turbo because my mechanic has told me That the Turbo has failed and is likely the cause of all the black smoke and poor performance

I believe I have a CT 20 in there now and it appears as though the CT 12 B would give me 35% more horsepower

And no, I have no idea how to surpass the 15 psi fuel cut off.

I figure if I’m going to replace the failed turbo I might as well get one that gives me a little bit more power

Any help would be greatly appreciated
I'm pretty sure that all 1KZTE's came with the CT12B, not the CT20. CT20 was on the 2LT engine. But I could be wrong.

Before you drop money on a new turbo, you should make double sure the turbo really is your issue. Usually when they fail they start leaking oil into the intake and/or exhaust. In your case, it may not be spinning properly (not producing much boost). It would be a good idea to remove the intake hose off the compressor inlet, and inspect the compressor. Check that the turbo spins freely. Move the shaft side to side and in/out to check for excessive play. This will indicate internal wear. You should also check that the waste gate is closing/opening properly, as this would also prevent boost from building.

If you're not planning on big exhaust, an intercooler and a different tune, I personally don't think there is any point in upgrading to a higher flow turbo. The stock CT12B is a pretty nice little turbo which spools quick and can support higher boost/fuel. I'd recommend just buying a new CHRA (the part of your turbo that will be worn out). A high quality CHRA can be bought from Melett (distributor/Ebay).
 
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You are probably right that the engine came with a CT12B not the CT20. My Bad....

I am not planning on upgrading the exhaust or adding an intercooler but if the turbo is actually ceased then would that Mamba fit and if so would it actually produce more power than a stock CT12B in good working order? Or is there claim of 35% power power BS?

I am soooooooo grateful for your input! Thank you!

(This all started because a major lack of power and huge plumbs of black smoke under any load. I changed the air filter, fuel filter and I have ordered replacement fuel injectors. I am learning all this on the way. Not my area of expertise.)

Adam
 

GTSSportCoupe

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You are probably right that the engine came with a CT12B not the CT20. My Bad....

I am not planning on upgrading the exhaust or adding an intercooler but if the turbo is actually ceased then would that Mamba fit and if so would it actually produce more power than a stock CT12B in good working order? Or is there claim of 35% power power BS?

I am soooooooo grateful for your input! Thank you!

(This all started because a major lack of power and huge plumbs of black smoke under any load. I changed the air filter, fuel filter and I have ordered replacement fuel injectors. I am learning all this on the way. Not my area of expertise.)

Adam
The way you make more power is by increasing your boost, and adding an appropriate amount more fuel. Just swapping on a new turbo won't change much, except for spool time perhaps. The stock boost on the 1KZTE is probably around 10psi. I'm pretty certain the stock CT12B can support up to 20-25psi. This would be good for another 30-50% more power. So you don't need to upgrade your turbo to achieve more power. The turbo is probably one of the last things you would need to upgrade. You'd first want an intercooler and exhaust upgrade.

Up to about 14psi the computer will add proportionally more fuel, so there is no need to adjust the injection pump or anything else. All you need is a manual boost controller. Beyond 14 psi, you will want to intercool the engine and upgrade the exhaust. At this point you also need a way to bypass the fuel cut that occurs at 15psi. You will also want to adjust the spill control valve on the injection pump. If you decide to do these things, I can tell you how to get around the boost cut etc. I've been running my y LJ78 at the limits of the injection pump and turbo (19psi) for the last four years, and the ECD system is the same, so the same tricks will apply.

I think your first task is to sort out what is wrong with your turbo. You need to confirm what the problem really is. You could ask your mechanic for more details.

Did you buy the truck this way, or is this problem something that has recently happened?

Just to prove you don't need a different turbo to make more power, have a read through this thread. This fellow (also on ih8mud) achieved some ridiculous power with the 1KZTE with the STOCK turbo. He made 152 rear wheel hp and 277 ftlb rear wheel torque!! Partially ROM tuned 1kz-te

OEM VS sorta tuned.jpg


Here are specs of his setup:

"
RED is the current tune, BLUE is the OEM tune. I still have some room for improvement but I was running out of time. Also I'm somewhat unsure where the limits are and how to find them. I don't want to blow it up! I will definitely get the area at 2500 rpm raised up into the 275ft/lb range and try to further smooth out a few of the other dips. That will come later, for now I'm going to drive it!

Current mods:
Full 3" exhaust
Front mount intercooler
Re-routed the intake to get fresh cool air.
Techtom Rom board
Manual boost controller set to 17 PSI
"
 

GTSSportCoupe

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I should add, that an upgraded turbo can actually be detrimental to performance if you don't do other performance modifications at the same time. So although the Mamba turbo would likely bolt onto your engine and work ok, the stock turbo might be more ideal for daily driving and your particular performance goals.

You could do some research on other forums where more people have upgraded their 1KZTEs. Personally I'd want to hear of someone else's experience before buying an upgraded aftermarket turbo. There can be subtle fitment differences, and perhaps the larger compressor is not well suited...
 
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I should add, that an upgraded turbo can actually be detrimental to performance if you don't do other performance modifications at the same time. So although the Mamba turbo would likely bolt onto your engine and work ok, the stock turbo might be more ideal for daily driving and your particular performance goals.

You could do some research on other forums where more people have upgraded their 1KZTEs. Personally I'd want to hear of someone else's experience before buying an upgraded aftermarket turbo. There can be subtle fitment differences, and perhaps the larger compressor is not well suited...


Got it! Fix what is broken and tune there after. Thank you for the expedited learning curve. I will be taking a closer look at the turbo this weekend and seeing if there is any obvious deficiencies.

I will be sticking to the 2 1/4" exhaust with a free flowing muffler for now. perhaps an intercooler if I decide to go beyond the 15PSI mark you have set.
 

GTSSportCoupe

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I hate to kill a dead horse but.......... A new Mamba CT12B would have no better performance than the stock CT12B?
If you have the cash burning a hole in your pocket and want to give it a try, go for it! I took a closer look at the specs, and what they have done is increased the inducer size of the compressor and added more blades. Everything else is stock size (compressor exducer and turbine inducer/exducer). In a perfect world, this might give you a bit quicker spool, and flow a bit more at high rpms and high boost.

I still think it would be nice to find someone else who has actually run it and could tell you what it's like compared to the stock turbo.

Nice that it comes with new hoses etc.

I'll buy your old worn out turbo from you...LOL
 

roscoFJ73

 
 
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I hate to kill a dead horse but.......... A new Mamba CT12B would have no better performance than the stock CT12B?
Probably would , but as I said ,for the year they were produced Toyota sourced turbos were usually the best. And it depends on your definition of best. Toyotas main aim is probably getting the engine to hold together.
 

roscoFJ73

 
 
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I hate to kill a dead horse but.......... A new Mamba CT12B would have no better performance than the stock CT12B?
Probably would , but as I said ,for the year they were produced Toyota sourced turbos were usually the best. And it depends on your definition of best. Toyotas main aim is probably getting the engine to hold together.
 
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The way you make more power is by increasing your boost, and adding an appropriate amount more fuel. Just swapping on a new turbo won't change much, except for spool time perhaps. The stock boost on the 1KZTE is probably around 10psi. I'm pretty certain the stock CT12B can support up to 20-25psi. This would be good for another 30-50% more power. So you don't need to upgrade your turbo to achieve more power. The turbo is probably one of the last things you would need to upgrade. You'd first want an intercooler and exhaust upgrade.

Up to about 14psi the computer will add proportionally more fuel, so there is no need to adjust the injection pump or anything else. All you need is a manual boost controller. Beyond 14 psi, you will want to intercool the engine and upgrade the exhaust. At this point you also need a way to bypass the fuel cut that occurs at 15psi. You will also want to adjust the spill control valve on the injection pump. If you decide to do these things, I can tell you how to get around the boost cut etc. I've been running my y LJ78 at the limits of the injection pump and turbo (19psi) for the last four years, and the ECD system is the same, so the same tricks will apply.

I think your first task is to sort out what is wrong with your turbo. You need to confirm what the problem really is. You could ask your mechanic for more details.

Did you buy the truck this way, or is this problem something that has recently happened?

Just to prove you don't need a different turbo to make more power, have a read through this thread. This fellow (also on ih8mud) achieved some ridiculous power with the 1KZTE with the STOCK turbo. He made 152 rear wheel hp and 277 ftlb rear wheel torque!! Partially ROM tuned 1kz-te

View attachment 1650207

Here are specs of his setup:

"
RED is the current tune, BLUE is the OEM tune. I still have some room for improvement but I was running out of time. Also I'm somewhat unsure where the limits are and how to find them. I don't want to blow it up! I will definitely get the area at 2500 rpm raised up into the 275ft/lb range and try to further smooth out a few of the other dips. That will come later, for now I'm going to drive it!

Current mods:
Full 3" exhaust
Front mount intercooler
Re-routed the intake to get fresh cool air.
Techtom Rom board
Manual boost controller set to 17 PSI
"
Hi,

I am very interested to find out more about your setup. I have a very similar set up to you in terms of upgrade but would like to know more about the cut off etc. If you are willing to share.
Cheers
 

GTSSportCoupe

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Hi,

I am very interested to find out more about your setup. I have a very similar set up to you in terms of upgrade but would like to know more about the cut off etc. If you are willing to share.
Cheers
Read post #9 in this thread for tuning details. Tuning should be similar for the 1KZTE as it is for the 2LTE (definitely the early 1KZTE anyhow). Opinions on this water to air intercooler for LJ78 / 2LTE? Just make sure you have done the supporting upgrades before you tune for more power. Make certain you have a good pyrometer and water temp gauge.
 
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When my CT20 needed a rebuilt I opted for an ebay item since they're so cheap. I also had the compressor wheel changed for a slightly larger billet one and entire core re-balanced at a turbo specialist. Heck I spent more on the turbo then I actually bought it for 😅 yet all in all it cost me about €400. I'm quite happy with it, it keeps boost better at high rpm and also dropped my egts. Also think it spools abit faster. I looked at the Mamba you linked and I think the 35% increase in hp is a typo for this (copied from link) : "Bigger compressor wheel that would make it spool as fast as factory one, but with additional 35% airflow to support higher torque and HP to red line." - that might be true, my CT20 certainly flows better with a similar compressor wheel.

IMG_20180807_170014.jpg
 
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