Cruiser dies while driving

[Oaks]

Oaks, do you have the FSM that covers the Starter System/Circuit for you engine? The 3FE FSM that I have does not include the chapter on the Starter System/Circuit...

I have a PDF version of the FSM. I will see if the starter system circuit is in it.

 

[Slow Left]

I have a PDF version of the FSM. I will see if the starter system circuit is in it.

OK, because if your battery is holding a charge, then as others have noted, the symptoms you are describing are most likely associated with the Starter System, not the Charging System.

Checking for proper functioning of the fusible links is the first step to trouble shooting the Starter System, too.

 

[Oaks]

OK, so all three fusible links that come off the positive terminal of the battery showed 12V on the far side of each of the fuses?

Except for this orange wire, which doesn't appear to be associated with the OEM fusible link connector...but I'll take a look at the wiring diagram to see if it shows up, otherwise might assume for the time being that it is an add on and not associated with neither the charging nor the cranking system.

What is important is that the fusible links associated with both the charging and cranking system (see wiring diagram) are working correctly. Those fusible links should be on the OEM connector.

Yes the fusible links in the factory connector all show 12 volts on the far sides of the fuses.

Thanks for your help on this!

Any idea what terminal I was checking? The diagram of terminal B from the FSM is kinda vague

 

[Slow Left]

Any idea what terminal I was checking? The diagram of terminal B from the FSM is kinda vague

Ha, Ha! Yeah, not the best description in the FSM. No, I can't tell with 100% certainty if you are testing the right terminal. It might be labeled on the alternator itself...or in another part of the FSM in that chapter...or someone else who has that same model vehicle as you might be able to tell you...

Another option is to have both the battery and alternator tested at a local aftermarket autoparts stores...lots of 'em here in the US do that for free...

But like others have suggested, you might focus on the Starter system for now because that seems to explain the symptoms you are having...and then once you are convinced that the Starter system is working correctly, go back and continue with the Charging system...that's how I would approach it at least...

Can you throw up the info on the Starter system? I don't have it.

 

[Slow Left]

Yes the fusible links in the factory connector all show 12 volts on the far sides of the fuses.

OK, so the fusible links appear to be good (meaning that there is continuity, or current can flow, across each of the fuses because you can read 12V reaching the far side when the near side is still connected to the positive terminal of the battery...if a fuse was blown, i.e. causing an open circuit, then it would have read 0V on that far side, since there would be no continuity or path for current to flow).

Have you gone back and rechecked (cleaned and refastened) all those connections/grounds on these battery cables that you recently replaced? A loose or bad contact could cause the intermittent symptoms you are seeing. This would be the next step that I would take, and I would include checking/cleaning/refastening all the beefy ground cables on the starter system, too.

 

[Slow Left]

Pull and check the 'Gauge', 'Engine' and 'Charge' fuses in the main fuse panel in the cabin of the vehicle (to the left of the steering wheel). Are they all good?

 

[Oaks]

Ok there is one alternator test that I have not done yet.

I just went and started the and then disconnected the + battery cable. The truck started surging...does this give any ideas?

 

[Oaks]

Ha, Ha! Yeah, not the best description in the FSM. No, I can't tell with 100% certainty if you are testing the right terminal. It might be labeled on the alternator itself...or in another part of the FSM in that chapter...or someone else who has that same model vehicle as you might be able to tell you...

Another option is to have both the battery and alternator tested at a local aftermarket autoparts stores...lots of 'em here in the US do that for free...

But like others have suggested, you might focus on the Starter system for now because that seems to explain the symptoms you are having...and then once you are convinced that the Starter system is working correctly, go back and continue with the Charging system...that's how I would approach it at least...

Can you throw up the info on the Starter system? I don't have it.

Not seeing any starter circuit info, maybe some here can post it.

 

[Slow Left]

I just went and started the and then disconnected the + battery cable. The truck started surging...does this give any ideas?

That's not a good test.

Are those fuses (see post #26 above) good?

Did you run the On Board Diagnostics test on the 'computer' with the paper clip to see if it is throwing any codes?

 

[Oaks]

Ok there is one alternator test that I have not done yet.

I just went and started the and then disconnected the + battery cable. The truck started surging meaning voltage surging and the RPMs all while in park. does this give anyone ideas?

 

[Oaks]

That's not a good test.

Are those fuses (see post #26 above) good?

Did you run the On Board Diagnostics test on the 'computer' with the paper clip to see if it is throwing any codes?

Checked all 3 Fuses. They are good

 

[Oaks]

Checked all 3 Fuses. They are good

I will go try the inboard diagnostics

 

[Oaks]

OK, so the fusible links appear to be good (meaning that there is continuity, or current can flow, across each of the fuses because you can read 12V reaching the far side when the near side is still connected to the positive terminal of the battery...if a fuse was blown, i.e. causing an open circuit, then it would have read 0V on that far side, since there would be no continuity or path for current to flow).

Have you gone back and rechecked (cleaned and refastened) all those connections/grounds on these battery cables that you recently replaced? A loose or bad contact could cause the intermittent symptoms you are seeing. This would be the next step that I would take, and I would include checking/cleaning/refastening all the beefy ground cables on the starter system, too.

All connections seem tight. Maybe I need to clean and redo them..

 

[Slow Left]

All connections seem tight. Maybe I need to clean and redo them..

I would do that and also do it for the beefy cables that you didn't replace (if any, since when you refer to 'battery cables', I'm not sure if that includes the beefy ground cables and the beefy cable that goes to the starter from the battery).

 

[Slow Left]

Here is a link to download the 3F manual...it should include the Starter system:

http://www.trollholescruisers.com/Tech/Manuals/Engine/1985 2F-3F Engnine FSM.pdf

Also, download the '3FE Schematics FSM' here...

https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/fsms.743084/

 

[Oaks]

I would do that and also do it for the beefy cables that you didn't replace (if any, since when you refer to 'battery cables', I'm not sure if that includes the beefy ground cables and the beefy cable that goes to the starter from the battery).

The beefy cables at the starter were replaced.

 

[Oaks]

Here is a link to download the 3F manual...it should include the Starter system:

http://www.trollholescruisers.com/Tech/Manuals/Engine/1985 2F-3F Engnine FSM.pdf

Also, download the '3FE Schematics FSM' here...

https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/fsms.743084/

Thank you! I am hoping to get this figured out. It's driving me nuts.

Maybe I need to stop thinking about it for a min to clear my head!

 

[Slow Left]

This is from the Starting System section of the '1985 3F Engine FSM' (see link in post #35 above):

If you get a code from the OBD, check it against the codes listed in the '3FE Schematics FSM' (see link in post #35 above) to see if it refers to an electrical component in the Starter, Ignition or Charging systems.

 

[Slow Left]

Maybe I need to stop thinking about it for a min to clear my head!

Yes, resetting the mind is a never-ending task...even the Dali Lama must do this...

Left to it's own devices, the mind only wants to take you into the future (to an anticipated or expected outcome, thereby causing anxiety or fear in the present...due to the discrepancy between that anticipated future state and your current present state...) or it wants to take you to the past (most often to some romanticized, nostalgic state...that probably never existed in the first place).

But the exemplary (fill in the blank...mechanic, warrior, cashier) knows that he exists fully in the present...action can only be in the present so he must continuously bring the mind back into the present.

One trick to reset the mind in an instant, if you don't have the occasion/time to be able to walk away, is to try and guess what the mind is going to do next...what strange thought it will think of next...and you will find that the it will quiet the mind right up...by using the mind against the mind..because the mind can't run on it's own if it is being employed by you.
Buddhist monks will reset the mind by either clapping loudly, effectively startling the mind out of its ruminations...or during mediation, concentrating on either breathing or saying the 'Om'...same principle as above, using the mind against itself...

The past weekend I was peeling potatoes (which would make this a story about exemplary potato peelers, I guess) for a stew (a nice Middle Eastern stew, flavored with lamb and cumin and onions and potatoes...and tomatoes..., you get the point) and I don't like peeling potatoes, so my mind saw the opportunity to hijack me to the future where all the potatoes were peeled, making the potato peeling I was doing in the present insufferable.
Stupid mind.
But I saw it do this, and stopped it by focusing on peeling the potato I had in my hand at the moment trying to make it the best peeled potato that the world has ever seen...and when that one was done, I focused on the next one that I had in my hands, trying to make it better than the first...and by the time I was done, I had a pile of the BEST peeled potatoes that I could do and I no longer had a pile of unpeeled potatoes that were causing me so much anxiety (because, as I told you before, at the time, I didn't like peeling potatoes) and it was a great feeling to have a pile of the best peeled potatoes that I have have ever peeled for this stew!

How is that for a story? Probably just made you hungry, at best...

 

[Oaks]

Yes, resetting the mind is a never-ending task...even the Dali Lama must do this...

Left to it's own devices, the mind only wants to take you into the future (to an anticipated or expected outcome, thereby causing anxiety or fear in the present...due to the discrepancy between that anticipated future state and your current present state...) or it wants to take you to the past (most often to some romanticized, nostalgic state...that probably never existed in the first place).

But the exemplary (fill in the blank...mechanic, warrior, cashier) knows that he exists fully in the present...action can only be in the present so he must continuously bring the mind back into the present.

One trick to reset the mind in an instant, if you don't have the occasion/time to be able to walk away, is to try and guess what the mind is going to do next...what strange thought it will think of next...and you will find that the it will quiet the mind right up...by using the mind against the mind..because the mind can't run on it's own if it is being employed by you.
Buddhist monks will reset the mind by either clapping loudly, effectively startling the mind out of its ruminations...or during mediation, concentrating on either breathing or saying the 'Om'...same principle as above, using the mind against itself...

The past weekend I was peeling potatoes (which would make this a story about exemplary potato peelers, I guess) for a stew (a nice Middle Eastern stew, flavored with lamb and cumin and onions and potatoes...and tomatoes..., you get the point) and I don't like peeling potatoes, so my mind saw the opportunity to hijack me to the future where all the potatoes were peeled, making the potato peeling I was doing in the present insufferable.
Stupid mind.
But I saw it do this, and stopped it by focusing on peeling the potato I had in my hand at the moment trying to make it the best peeled potato that the world has ever seen...and when that one was done, I focused on the next one that I had in my hands, trying to make it better than the first...and by the time I was done, I had a pile of the BEST peeled potatoes that I could do and I no longer had a pile of unpeeled potatoes that were causing me so much anxiety (because, as I told you before, at the time, I didn't like peeling potatoes) and it was a great feeling to have a pile of the best peeled potatoes that I have have ever peeled for this stew!

How is that for a story? Probably just made you hungry, at best...

This stew sounds amazing!

Really like the idea of using the mind against itself! I really believe that!

Thanks for sharing. I am going to have to spend another day troubleshooting my vehicle, as I'm spending it with my boys and my wife. Hopefully by the end of the weekend I can figure it out. And I get away without spending a small fortune