Winchin n’ Wheelin in deep snow- who put the grenade in my transfer case? (1 Viewer)

[H E A V Y M E T A L]

During some night time snow wheeling over Judith Peak in Montana. I broke something while going through deep snow drifts, waist deep snow, 200 point turn around or pulling the idiots out of the ditch in a car (because driving late night with no; gear, clothes, cell services, with the intent to walk out at -6°F, is a good idea) but I digress.

I drove my busted Landcruiser all the way off the mountain while towing a car and then drove it home on the asphalt. All the while it sounded like I put a handful of nuts and bolts inside something, banging shuddering crack jumping all the way home in a nasty snow storm, I had to get home, and this thing did it very impressively.

I have some photos and videos of me dissecting the drivetrain, here is a video

Turn volume up, Video starts with;

0-1 second mark- I am driving vehicle forward using 4-hi and center lock on.

1-2 second mark- I come to a stop and turn off center lock (you can hear the click)

2-9 second mark- I shift into neutral and back to drive and give it a little throttle just once.

10-33 sec mark – I shift back and forth D-N-D-N-D-N etc. no throttle.

10-13 sec mark – if you look closely during one of the shifts from N to D you can see the rear drive shaft is not even spinning, no jerking nothing.

34 second mark- I turn on center lock you can hear the click and now I can move again and begin to pull away.




So My engine obviously works fine-the transmission works forward and backwards.

Suspect #1:

The transfer case, has metal shavings in the oil and I only get power out of the front output shaft. With the center lock turned off I go nowhere it just makes noise like you hear in the video. Only when I engage the center locker I can move. So, I only have power to the front wheels??? Does anyone agree with this madness?



Suspect #2:

I drained the oil from the front differential and both the fill and drain plugs are jacked it looks like the ends of both plugs got clobbered by metal chunks, and there are tons of chips n chunks on the magnetic drain plug. This front diff solely pulled me and the person I rescued home that night and I think it gave its life up for it. Judging from the pictures I am replacing the entire thing…

 

[MTKID]

Man, I’m sorry to hear that! However, it sounds like you may have saved some people’s lives had you not gotten them off the mountain... at the expense of your rig

 

[H E A V Y M E T A L]

Well I cannot say what exactly caused this, when you wheel you break. But for sure saved someone. and I would do it again.

 

[MTKID]

Both the front diff and the transfer case could give you opportunities for upgrades if you can justify the cost and it looks like you have a nice workspace to work in. That might be the bright side of it. Hopefully, you don’t have an issue with both, that could get expensive! I haven’t heard of issues with the transfer case before but maybe you’re the lucky one to find that issue. 406 cruisers might be able to also help diagnose.

Edit: my vote is front diff issue since the CDL must be engaged. This makes sense to me, but I don’t know why your transfer case would have metal shavings in it.

 

[H E A V Y M E T A L]

Some good points there. For sure there is an issue with the transfer case rear output side. Probly broke a tooth off. the front output is the only thing that got me home. I will open them up and post pictures for sure. front diff is gonzo

 

[Julian Stead]

Glad you managed to get yourself back, gutting about the issues but it happens.

 

[cmck]

You did the right thing in rescuing the unprepared and uninformed. Maybe a beefy front locker is your payback.

 

[catz]

Not much help but saw this

TJM168PL22-GPTOY100-SELECT-1

There is a promo going on

 

[Trunk Monkey]

Start simple. Highly unlikely you damaged the t-case, they're very beefy and there's plenty of other weaker parts that would break before that. Since you can move with the center diff locked, that also shows your tranny and t-case are likely fine. So move to points away from that - diffs, CVs, and hubs. I'd start easy, check the drive flanges and c-clips. If those are fine, move inboard to the diff.

You're sure with the center locked the rear DS isn't spinning at all? Does the grinding noise sound like it's at the front end of the truck or the back?

 

[H E A V Y M E T A L]

nice good looking out! My front diff housing is destroyed, I'm all in now. Told the wife I need 37" and SAS j/k. I'm looking at one of the supporting vendors for a new diff-holy crap this is expensive. but thank you very much.

 

[Trunk Monkey]

Post some pics. More rare that the later 4 pinions diffs go, but it's happened.

 

[H E A V Y M E T A L]

Start simple. Highly unlikely you damaged the t-case, they're very beefy and there's plenty of other weaker parts that would break before that. Since you can move with the center diff locked, that also shows your tranny and t-case are likely fine. So move to points away from that - diffs, CVs, and hubs. I'd start easy, check the drive flanges and c-clips. If those are fine, move inboard to the diff.

You're sure with the center locked the rear DS isn't spinning at all? Does the grinding noise sound like it's at the front end of the truck or the back?

your are right with starting simple! I drained all oils everywhere hunting for metal chunks- found it in the T-case(little) and mucho chunks in the front diff. I know the T-case is stout-but splain me why I have no rear output power- and it only works when I engage the locker? That tells me half of the T-case is ok, the front output. the rear drive shaft is not spinning (can you see the video, tough to see but there is a shot of the DS not spinning but the T-case is). I will get a better photo but I think all kinds of teeth are missing on the front diff but it still works, barely.

also the grinding noise from the video comes from the transfer case. if you were there in person it is painfully obvious. it sounds so bad.

 

[chuckscap]

So sorry to hear. From the looks of it you needed my long gone (sold it to a friend) 56 Dodge Power Wagon for that job. Unbreakable. Our 100s drive sooo much nicer. Best of luck with the repairs

 

[RyanStl]

Being a Good Samaritan can cost, but hopefully helping will come back your way one night. Your rig is definitely worth fixing, so I like your idea of upgrading while you have to replace parts anyway.

 

[Leandro]

Remember that the center diff is exactly that, an open diff until you lock it, so if the front diff is toasted the center diff will send the power to that one because it hass less resistance, when you lock it, it splits 50-50

 

[Grego]

"I know the T-case is stout-but splain me why I have no rear output power- and it only works when I engage the locker? That tells me half of the T-case is ok, the front output. the rear drive shaft is not spinning (can you see the video, tough to see but there is a shot of the DS not spinning but the T-case is). I will get a better photo but I think all kinds of teeth are missing on the front diff but it still works, barely."

Very rare to damage the transfer case. The rear drive shaft doesn't spin/power the truck with the diff unlocked because it operates as an open diff otherwise. The power will go to the path of least resistance. If you knocked the teeth off of your ring/pinion the engine will spin the front driveshaft, spinning the broken pieces against each other. Same thing happens if you strip out a drive flange at a front wheel. When you lock the front diff, you force the transfer case to split the power 50/50 to the front and rear driveshaft. You can drive the truck this way but as you will probably find out there wont be anything left of the front diff.

Glad you found that you can still get yourself and others out of a bad situation even if it was at the expense of your front diff.


Edit

^^^ just beat me to it.

 

[H E A V Y M E T A L]

Good info, thank you

Diff AND Transfer case. Rare to damage a differential, rare to damage a transfer case I have been told. I have metal shavings out of both sooooooooooooooooo- what do I do?

I pull both and inspect. I just cant ignore the damage I have found. I found metal in both, they both get opened. It would be foolish to not do this. Hopefully it is minor, is it just a gear that needs changing or more? did the diff brake the transfer or vise a versa? I am beating the s*** out of a 13 year old drive-train, it finally failed I know that much. now I chase the extent of the damage.

 

[joshAUST]

Sorry to hear!

When you pulled them out, in the first pic, were you reversing?
I read somewhere that the 100 series should never reverse pull anything, as it can damage the diff/s?
I read it somewhere a few months ago.
I had a quick look but can no longer find the article, but if I do, I'll post it.

Not that it helps your predicament though.

 

[Imwhere]

I would bet front diff is the culprit.

How long has it been since since you checked the TC for metal shavings?

In reverse your driving on the backside of the ring gear which is weaker. I make a habbit of never snatching in reverse for this reason.

IMO i would rebuild front diff, flush TC and refill then see how she drives.

 

[YvesNL]

I had the same occur two days ago, my front differential ring gear is missing some teeth.

When I had CDL NOT engaged:
- The car would not move;
- The rear driveshaft would not move;
- The front driveshaft would move (rotates freely);
- The front drive/cv axles would not move.

Here the transfer case is an open differential and sends all the rotational force towards the broken front differential because it has less resistance that the rear.

When I had CDL engaged:
- The car would move;
- The front & rear driveshaft would move on the same speed (50/50 torque split);
- I could drive the car very slowly 1.6kph/1mph and I had the occasional bang in my front differential.

I took out my front driveshafts, propshaft and differential. It now is a RWD vehicle but I'm not driving it.

I've also posted in "What have you done to your 100 Series this week?" There are a few pictures of the damage.

Were the metal shavings on your transfer case bad?
What is the last time you replaced oil and removed metal shavings from the magnet in the transfer case?