Wheel bearing or Caliper? (1 Viewer)

[Red Merle]

OK, so I noticed some new squeaking while I have been driving and at first I thought maybe it was a driveshaft or a u-joint that needed some grease, but I don't think that is the issue since I also discovered that my front driver's side rotor, and caliper assembly gets fricking HOT in a hurry. I think I might have a caliper dragging which would make since as I foolishly left that caliper alone as it had been recently replaced by the PO when I replaced all three of the other calipers along with new front rotors, pads, booster, master, etc when I first bought the truck.

I also rebuilt the front axle at that time and I did install all new wheel bearings at that time, but I think I decided to not replace the inner race for the inner bearing on that side at that time because I couldn't get it out and it looked like it was in really good shape. That was 20,000 miles ago.

It doesn't squeak when I am just rolling at very low speeds, but if I give it gas, it starts to squeak.

I can't figure out if the brake is dragging and causing the heat or if the bearing is giving up. If I get going and stomp on the brakes, it does pull to the passenger side which would seem to indicate that side is doing the work now. It didn't pull at all a week ago.

I already ordered the new caliper from Napa to match the others that I was happy with but I am wondering now if that corner I cut on the wheel bearing race is biting me.

Any thoughts?

 

[Red Merle]

Also, the knuckle and housing don't seem quite as hot, which makes me think the inner bearing might not be the source of the heat.

 

[jpoole]

I would think that if you lifted that tire/wheel off of the ground and did some shake testing that you'd easily see if the bearing was loose enough to cause brake issues. Spinning the hub and feeling how smoothly/easily it spins would also tell you a lot about bearing condition.

Before (and after) you lift that wheel you can also have someone move the steering wheel back and forth to see if relevant slack shows up that way.

I'd do the above wheel bearing check along with a general inspection for loose bolts/etc. on the caliper/knuckle/etc. before ordering parts.

 

[Red Merle]

If I put the trans in Neutral and raise both front wheels, will I be able to spin them? It's been so long that I can't remember. I can get all four off the ground, but I have company coming tomorrow and any shortcuts would help.

 

[jpoole]

I believe that if you don't have a VC (viscous coupler) that a single lifted tire will spin freely. If you have a VC it will be slightly or much harder to spin depending on the condition of the VC. Shifting the transfer case into neutral may help it spin a touch more easily (no vc) or help you work around a tight VC.

I periodically lift each tire individually on my 80 to inspect or do work on them one at a time and I recall that I can spin them as needed. I don't remember if I shift the transfer into neutral to allow that but in theory I shouldn't have to I don't think as I have no VC. As a rule I don't lift more than one tire unless I have to for safety/laziness reasons.

In any case, you should not need to lift more than just that one tire/wheel for your inspection.

 

[ZackR]

If I put the trans in Neutral and raise both front wheels, will I be able to spin them? It's been so long that I can't remember. I can get all four off the ground, but I have company coming tomorrow and any shortcuts would help.

Yes they will spin unless the center diff is locked but it will be easier with all four off the ground.

For peace of mind when you replace the caliper go back in and redo the bearing preload.

 

[Red Merle]

I do have the VC. I will just get all four off the ground and put everything in Neutral if the caliper doesn't fix the problem.

I am trying to avoid a major surgery here because my folks are coming up and we were going to go canoeing and fishing this weekend, but I can use one of them to bleed the caliper which will be here in the morning.

If that doesn't fix it, I am not sure I should drive it if the wheel bearing is botched somehow. It seems weird that it would be the wheel bearing now, but checking the preload and spinning the tires should give me more info.

Thanks guys!

 

[BILT4ME]

Also, the knuckle and housing don't seem quite as hot, which makes me think the inner bearing might not be the source of the heat.

I'll put money on wheel bearing loose. That causes misalignment and can cause brakes to drag as well as spindle bushings to drag and make noise.

What did you torque your WB to? 35 LB-Ft inner / 45 LB-FT outer

You can actually tighten your WB and not even remove the front tire. Lift one side at a time and rotate. MAKE SURE TO CHOCK ALL YOUR WHEELS!

 

[ZackR]

I'd second @BILT4ME 's recommendation; leave the caliper on the shelf for now until you check the wheel bearing preload. You aren't taking the whole thing apart, just to this point to adjust the 54mm nuts:

 

[Red Merle]

I can't remember what I set them at but I did buy Kurt's fish scale tool and I used that. I will pop the cover in the morning and take a closer look at the 54 MM nut(I also have that tool).

What you guys are saying makes sense. Not sure why it decided to wait until now to let loose, but I agree that it is likely the bearing. I may still put the caliper in, just not tomorrow.


I bet this also explains the weird groaning sound that I have noted in the last few weeks that I swear wasn't there before.

 

[ZackR]

I can't remember what I set them at but I did buy Kurt's fish scale tool and I used that. I will pop the cover in the morning and take a closer look at the 54 MM nut(I also have that tool).

What you guys are saying makes sense. Not sure why it decided to wait until now to let loose, but I agree that it is likely the bearing. I may still put the caliper in, just not tomorrow.


I bet this also explains the weird groaning sound that I have noted in the last few weeks that I swear wasn't there before.

From everything I've read the fish scale method doesn't get them tight enough. 35 lb/ft inner nut and 45 lb/ft outer nut is the new best practice. Good luck!

 

[Red Merle]

OK, so I jacked up the driver's side and put everything in neutral and I can't budge the wheel. Gotta be a seized caliper, right?

EDIT: There is also no side to side or up and down play in the wheel. Unless it's fully seized now, I think I should still be able to feel something in the wheel, right?

 

[ZackR]

Get both front wheels in the air so you can compare sides. Something is not right, just need to narrow it down.

 

[leonard_nemoy]

I bet you got a seized caliper, I think the factory service manual proceedure with the fish scale is the best method for preload if you have the original tire size, but for larger tires than it is not so great.

 

[BILT4ME]

I bet you got a seized caliper, I think the factory service manual procedure with the fish scale is the best method for preload if you have the original tire size, but for larger tires than it is not so great.

Fish scale belongs to fish.

I still had my factory 31's (Michelin LTX's) and they wouldn't stay right on the way to the mall. I used the GM version of the program and it ends up at 35/45 and now they stay. I have not touched the left side in 56K miles, but I have had to do the right side 6 times. I think my RF spindle is jacked from the PO hitting a guardrail.........

I did the fish scale thing on full front rebuild and in less than 5K miles, the front wheels were flopping due to the wheel bearings. I was INCREDIBLY anal about the fish scale tension and following the FSM to a TEE.

Now, it's slap them to 35/45, button it up and away we go!

If @Red Merle can't rotate a tire even a little, then it's either a seized caliper or a seized bearing. I would assume a caliper first. However, remove the caliper THEN check wheel bearing floppiness.......

 

[Red Merle]

I raised the passenger side and that wheel spins just fine and there is no side to side play in the wheel bearing.

I think it has to be a bad caliper. Rust probably got her. Untreated raw steel tends to fail around here.

I will check the wheel bearing when I yank the old caliper in the morning.

I ordered a new set of front pads, but I think I am just going to keep those and use them the next time since the ones in there look fine and are plenty thick still, unless that is a bad idea.

 

[Red Merle]

From everything I've read the fish scale method doesn't get them tight enough. 35 lb/ft inner nut and 45 lb/ft outer nut is the new best practice. Good luck!

I used it more as a check. I know how seated bearings are supposed to feel but I used the spring scale to check how much that was reading versus how much force I was using to manipulate the upper and lower trunion and wheel bearings felt by using my own personally generated force through my arms.

 

[ZackR]

I raised the passenger side and that wheel spins just fine and there is no side to side play in the wheel bearing.

I think it has to be a bad caliper. Rust probably got her. Untreated raw steel tends to fail around here.

I will check the wheel bearing when I yank the old caliper in the morning.

I ordered a new set of front pads, but I think I am just going to keep those and use them the next time since the ones in there look fine and are plenty thick still, unless that is a bad idea.

You can continue to use the brake pads, it won't be an issue.

 

[BILT4ME]

I raised the passenger side and that wheel spins just fine and there is no side to side play in the wheel bearing.

I think it has to be a bad caliper. Rust probably got her. Untreated raw steel tends to fail around here.

I will check the wheel bearing when I yank the old caliper in the morning.

I ordered a new set of front pads, but I think I am just going to keep those and use them the next time since the ones in there look fine and are plenty thick still, unless that is a bad idea.

You should be able to use the old pads if they are in good shape. Just make sure you get them oriented on the same side and direction they came off, so the grooves match.

 

[leonard_nemoy]

Fish scale belongs to fish.

Yeah, I honestly don't have a ton of experience doing knuckle work. I rebuilt the hubs on my fj62 using the fish scale and the factory manual when I was running stock tires and never had an issue. I am lucky and have an awesome landcruiser mechanic that is really cool and close to me. When I bought my 80 with 185,000 on the clock I thought the knuckles looked like poop so I asked him to rebuild them. He did his inspection and said they didn't need work so I ran them to 250,000. Then I had a really long remote camping trip planned so I ordered the rebuild kit from cruiser outfitters and had my mechanic rebuild them because it seems like lots of people who do it themselves on this website have problems with them coming loose and I had no history on the last time my knuckles were serviced. My cruiser mechanic said my knuckles were still fine and he claimed they had never been rebuilt so apparently 80 series knuckles can go 250,000 miles with nothing more than topping off the grease. It makes me think that some people rebuild the knuckles when they don't really need it. 20,000 miles later and no issues after the rebuild.