Vague steering and lift question (1 Viewer)

[GerhardUngerer]

When I brought Dobbie (Green 1997 FZJ80 - see Dobbie) home, about a month or so ago, I had vague steering and a puddle under the left rear shock. I bought new shocks, installed them, and did a bunch of other work (including swapping springs left to right because they were installed wrong).

When I took it for a test drive, the steering was very vague. VERY vague. Recently someone asked me if I had a lift on it or not. I had not installed a lift kit, but I remembered capturing the spring codes when I was trying to address the lean (see Lean Much?).

It seems I am running OME 850 X in the front and OME 860 X in the back. I tried to look it up on the OME site, but could not find references. Where/how can I see what kind of lift (or not) that is? Also, since I put standard shocks in there, would that be why I am seeing strangeness? How about castor correction, etc etc etc?

I am in the process of changing brakes (the others were badly grooved) and will then check tie-rod ends and radius arm bushes (not sure how).

Help?

 

[sxp]

Your coils provide 50mm of lift.

Compiled 80 series suspension component spec thread... shocks, coils & more.

Your steering probably feels vague due to lack of caster.

 

[ERG80]

I’d try to:
Check caster
Check knuckle stud torque
Check wheel bearing preload
Check tre’s
Check toe-in

Alignment Setting Toe

On the ’80, toe is the only thing easily adjustable. It can be knocked out from wheeling, impact, so should be occasionally checked. For something that looks deceptively simple, vehicle handling is a complicated subject, there are great books on the subject, this will be the simple version...

forum.ih8mud.com

I’d check the panhard bushings too.

All could cause vague wandering feel.

 

[GerhardUngerer]

After I do the brakes, I was planning to check the usual stuff (tie-rods, etc). But then I need to decide whether to keep chasing. With other words, if I am facing caster bushings (or plates), shocks, etc.... would it be better to just go back to stock coils? She is not going to be an off-roader.

Or is this not as big of a deal as I think?

I remember, back in the day, caster settings was fairly easily done by control arm adjustments. Not so much anymore?

 

[GerhardUngerer]

I’d try to:
Check caster
Check toe-in

Is there a way to do it myself or do I just take it to the alignment shop?

I’d try to:
Check wheel bearing preload

The front left wheel had some play in it top to bottom. Since I know nothing of the history of this vehicle, I replaced the inner and outer bearings. Will see if that makes a difference.

I’d check the panhard bushings too.

All could cause vague wandering feel.

It is hard to describe. When I drove off, I felt a little sway and then it got worse. It swayed left and right. Not death wobble, just all 4 wheels felt like it was going left and right in the road. When I decelerated, it would sway also (something like a torque induced oscillation). Weird. But this was only after I had the wheels rotated and balanced.

 

[ERG80]

Is there a way to do it myself or do I just take it to the alignment shop?


The front left wheel had some play in it top to bottom. Since I know nothing of the history of this vehicle, I replaced the inner and outer bearings. Will see if that makes a difference.



It is hard to describe. When I drove off, I felt a little sway and then it got worse. It swayed left and right. Not death wobble, just all 4 wheels felt like it was going left and right in the road. When I decelerated, it would sway also (something like a torque induced oscillation). Weird. But this was only after I had the wheels rotated and balanced.

The link I posted has procedures for setting toe. Caster has to be measured at a good tire shop.
How old is your steering dampener?

 

[baldilocks]

The OME 850 coils are marketed as a heavy coil providing 2.5” of lift. They are not the most heavy duty coils for the 80 but will lift your vehicle more than 2.5” If you have not added weight with bumper, winch and such. You haven’t provided much info about your 80 like, how many miles on it? It’s general maintenance condition at the time of purchase? I’m assuming the previous owner was a hack who did things half assed and neglected maintenance and upkeep based on your remark about the condition of the brakes.

I’d bet you have three inches of lift up front with zero or negative castor angle combined with the cumulative affects of worn suspension bushings, tie rod ends, perhaps a sloppy steering gear box, misalignment, worn grunion bearings, etc. The possibility of loose knuckle steering arm studs is real and dangerous.

Owning an older vehicle like the 80 will be a frustrating, expensive experience if you don’t have the wherewithal to do a lot of or all the work yourself.

 

[Heckraiser]

Yes, you could put stock springs on (or both OME and Dobinsons make "stock height" replacement springs) and that would help your caster. I would lean more towards the aftermarket replacements because any stock springs you might find likely have 200k miles on them and are already worn out. I can't guarantee that's the entirety of your problem, but it would definitely help. Then move on to alignment, bushing condition, steering components, etc, if necessary.

 

[GerhardUngerer]

You haven’t provided much info about your 80 like, how many miles on it? It’s general maintenance condition at the time of purchase? I’m assuming the previous owner was a hack who did things half assed and neglected maintenance and upkeep based on your remark about the condition of the brakes.

I have two 80's. This one has about 270k miles. The other has about 190k. No winch, no oversized bumpers. I found a receipt in the glove box stating that fluids were changed about 5 years ago, an exhaust leak was fixed and the rest of the vehicle "checked". I don't know more than that. But they missed the fact that A and B coils should have been swapped. The PO didn't do anything to it but drive it for a short while. The wheels, coils, etc were all done before him.

Owning an older vehicle like the 80 will be a frustrating, expensive experience if you don’t have the wherewithal to do a lot of or all the work yourself.

I dont mind the frustration or expense. I aim to build the wherewithal as I build experience. I also want to make sure that I know what work to rather let others do.

 

[GerhardUngerer]

My biggest concern is safety, since my 16 year old is eyeing Dobbie as her DD.

 

[GerhardUngerer]

I’d bet you have three inches of lift up front with zero or negative castor angle combined with the cumulative affects of worn suspension bushings, tie rod ends, perhaps a sloppy steering gear box, misalignment, worn grunion bearings, etc. The possibility of loose knuckle steering arm studs is real and dangerous.

I will have to either get the castor fixed or go back to OEM coils. All the other stuff will have to be checked and repaired. I will try to do as much of it myself, but things that I cannot do, or should not do, I will leave for the professionals.

 

[Nframe]

Check your Panhard bushings as well.

 

[DSRTRDR]

My biggest concern is safety, since my 16 year old is eyeing Dobbie as her DD.

80s are strong dude magnets, just sayin' - I get comments every time I take one to the gas station

 

[baldilocks]

I will have to either get the castor fixed or go back to OEM coils. All the other stuff will have to be checked and repaired. I will try to do as much of it myself, but things that I cannot do, or should not do, I will leave for the professionals.

The chief complaint of “vague steering” and “all over the place” Especially after the tire pressure was set correctly at a lower pressure is not so much related to lack of castor angle. If anything, lack of castor will make it feel more twitchy. With basically no maintenance records, 23 years and 270k miles, she’s ready for a thorough going through below the belt line and from bumper to bumper.

 

[GerhardUngerer]

80s are strong dude magnets, just sayin' - I get comments every time I take one to the gas station

Somehow, I think my daughter already knew this. I might need to reconsider.

 

[Heckraiser]

Haha, I let my daughter drive my 60 to high school a few times... big mistake.

 

[alia176]

My 14 yo daughter "thinks" she can have my 80 for college. I believe I said something about "prying out the keys from my cold dead fingers...." or some such thing