Underhood Shower

Discussion in '80-Series Tech' started by MTNRAT, Aug 5, 2005.

  1. MTNRAT

    MTNRAT

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    I am going to install a shower in my 80. Instead of using a heat exchanger, I am going to wrap copper tubing around the downpipes. Anyone know about how many wraps around the pipe I will need to get the water hot enough. Also what diameter pipe should I use. It cannot be too big or I will not be able to bend it around the downpipe. I am using a 2.8gpm shurflow pump.
    Thanks,
    Sean
     
  2. lx450landcruiser

    lx450landcruiser Moderator

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    please please please do a full write up on this

    very intrested
     
  3. MTNRAT

    MTNRAT

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    I will. i just want an educated guess on the number of wraps as that will determine the temperature rise from the lake, stream, bucket to the shower head.
    Cheers,
    Sean
    PS. I am going to do one one my boat as well. Already have both pumps.
     
  4. lx450landcruiser

    lx450landcruiser Moderator

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    where did you get your pumps and how much?

    mike
     
  5. MTNRAT

    MTNRAT

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    I just picked them up at the local RV and welding shop. $110cdn. Could have got them cheaper, but livin in a small town you got to shop local.
    Cheers,
    Sean
     
  6. landtank

    landtank SILVER Star

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    I have that pump in my camping trailer and it really moves some fluid. You do realize that you will not be able to let the water sit idling in those pipes as it will likely burst sending scalding water everywhere.
     
  7. tarbe

    tarbe

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    Smaller tube and more wraps will get the temp higher...greater % of the water will be close to the header pipes.
     
  8. lx450landcruiser

    lx450landcruiser Moderator

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    out of curiousity are you planning on controling this temp? or just trun on the engine and punp the water till its good? im afraid i dont see how youll be able to control the temp?

    mike
     
  9. alkaline747trio

    alkaline747trio

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    1/8 or 1/4" copper pipe. Number of wraps depends on how much pressure you want and how much time you're willing to spend bending it aroung the exhasut; if you're pump pushes enough water for you with 100 wraps, and the water isn't too hot, then go with it, if insufficient pressure or warmth, then add more wraps. The problem I foreshadow is the copper being heat-cycled and cracking with the cold water hitting it when the metal is hot. Also, I don't know what kind of temps copper tubing can handle.



    Controlling the temp would either be ambient and engine temp based, or have a wye-connector feeding as much or as little cool/ambient water into the final water as needed, just like a normal shower.
     
  10. gbell210

    gbell210

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    Just an idea.. dunno if it would work or not since I'm more a computer engineer... but.. if you had a 1 way valve, and while not using the shower or pump, let the water sit in the copper pipe and cycle back into the reservoir. When it heats up it should push the hot water/steam into the reservoir and force colder water from the reservoir into the pipe. So the water would be circulating by itself, heating up for when you need it, but preventing a pipe rupture since it will not be a closed system?? Have return line come into the reservior at the top and the supply line at the bottom. Also, this would prevent the extreme heat cycling. Then when you do need the shower.. the reservoir should have hot water in it and have a seperate tap into the reservoir, or you could have it off the heating line? Is there anything incorrect with the thinking and am I missing something?
     
  11. cruiseroutfit

    cruiseroutfit Supporting Vendor Moderator

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    I would just get in on the Helton heat exchanger group buy ;) :D

    Great idea, and if I had my Thermodynamics & Heat Transfer books here with me (and some time) I would tell you exactly how much tube you would need (assuming we knew the input water temp) and the heat properties of the exhaust pipes.

    Helton ;) Group Buy ;)

    :D
     
  12. MTNRAT

    MTNRAT

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    Hmm, The melting point of copper is 1981.4 F. I was just planning on running water through till it was good. Have been doing a search and found these http://www.doucetteindustries.com/coaxial.html . Pismo Jim uses one in his set up. Just have to find out what size. That of course would mean running it through the heater return line. Might go that way as The number of wraps etc would be a guessing game. Oh, and i want to have it done by the end of next week, so no group buy for me.
    Cheers,
    Sean
     
  13. alkaline747trio

    alkaline747trio

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    Number of wraps isn't really a guess, it would take A WHOLE LOT to heat water as rapidly as you're wanting to with just 100-300º exhaust pipe temps. Anything less than 35 probably would only raise the temp of the water about 5-10º. I was thinking you could add a parallel path with the heater core water and feed in fresh and take out warm. This could be problematic if the water using was acidic or extremely mineral laden though.
     
  14. Kalawang

    Kalawang

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    You might spend less fuel with a really big inverter and a dip in water heater. Even cheaper would be a gas stove to boil the water. It could also be used to cook your food.

    I don't mean to be a put down but all those copper wrappings are bound to be noisy on trips and would pretty much be a whole lot of trouble to maintain. I doubt anybody could wrap them tight enough to keep them from clanging, and when they do clang, there's bound to be some wear and therefore leaks in time.

    A PTO to a generator might do better and also give power to other electrical needs. However that uses up precious fuel, so we might be all the way back to a wood fire to heat the water.


    Kalawang
     
  15. landtank

    landtank SILVER Star

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    I would think that an insulated holding tank with a coil inside similar to most water heaters where a thermostat would control water flow from the cooling system to maintain it's temp. The water heater would not cost anything to run as it would function during driving.

    Building a tankless system like what is on some boilers would be a little tricky and require the engine to be running and up to temperature to function.
     
  16. Kalawang

    Kalawang

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    Water's heavy. I'd rather carry fuel. Besides, he has a river at the other end. I still vote for the wood fire and a kettle.


    Kalawang
     
  17. landtank

    landtank SILVER Star

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    Well some people figure all the fuel in the world ain't going to help move a broken down truck and since you can't drink it they bring along some water to survive.
     
  18. MTNRAT

    MTNRAT

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    Well I have decided to ditch the wraping around exhaust idea. I remembered I had an old ice machine that had leaked all its freon and was no good anymore. I removed the coaxial coil. It is too big for the cruiser so I am going to install it in my boat. Here is a pic. I am sure it will be binford grade.
    Cheers,
    Sean
     
  19. WildYoats

    WildYoats SILVER Star

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    I have pondered doing this too. I thought of using the heat wrapping (as they use for racing) around the tubes and exhaust. Would probably heat the copper faster. May assist in the vibration as well. :dunno
     
  20. sleeoffroad

    sleeoffroad Supporting Vendor

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    Sean, might make it easier for you. We have the underhood shower heat exchangers in stock. Easy to install and it works good. I have a customer that added a tank and pump and circulates the water through the exchanger into the pump when driving. Then when he stops, he has a whole tank of warm water for showering.
     
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