Tyre / Tire life ? Why does the auto industry keep try to promote that they go 'bad' in 5 years? Especially for very expensive 4wd and similar tyres? (1 Viewer)

[sunrk]

I'm sick of seeing ads for tyre places pushing the view that tyres are only good for 5 years. I'm not aware of any laws mandating a lifespan of automotive rubber composite tyres (mostly j-type) on road-registered motor vehicles.

When good 4wd tyres cost anywhere up to $500 a tyre here in Oz and I'm up for over $2000 to replace the full set of five that's not a trivial purchase and I'd expect that in normal non-abused use that good brand 4wd tyres are not going to go 'off' or 'bad' within just a handful of years.

I've had Cooper AT-3's on my 80 since 2015. They are getting worn now but I rotate them every 10 k km's or thereabouts to spread out the wear. Next year when I finally get access to enough $$$ I will look at replacing them.

 

[gnob]

tires dry out, age and crack just like any other rubber product.
time allows the rubber to get hard making traction dissipate.
its not just some wives tale.
the shop i used to work at tossed new tires at five years and wouldn't touch them over ten.
maintenance and indoor storage helps

 

[sunrk]

But why 5 years like it's a 'hard deadline'? It's like the tyre industry is self-serving.

No dispute that rubber degrades but 4wd tyres cost anywhere up to $500 + per tyre here for the top-end brands so replacing them every 5 years is a big cost.

Ironically the EV fraternity paints EV's as 'zero emission' but they still use rubber tyres and composite brakes. lol

And EV's are heavier than their non-EV brothers and sisters in the same make/model. That makes tyres wear more and do more damage to roads.

 

[gnob]

i assume liability is the determining factor.
if you spent one day working in the tire industry you would understand these guidelines.

and yes EVs are a bs scam

 

[gnob]

regardless of how you feel about it, i don't want some clown crashing into me because they think tire life rules are arbitrary.

 

[sunrk]

But are there Actual Rules (tm) or simply 'industry guidelines'? Does the insurance industry specify tyre life rules? Do any governments? If all of a sudden everyone was told they had to replace tyres after 1 year or 2 years what would happen?

 

[gnob]

wed lay down and eat a dick like we do for every other overreach.
and yes insurance dictates almost everything .

 

[aztoyman]

I finally decided on what tires I was going to get for my build. I was finally going to cough up the big bucks and found they were on back order. They came back in stock with a ridiculous new price so forget those tires. I found my next choice and same thing. Tire choice on hold.

I'm not spending that kind of money as it is and also have them sit for maybe another year before I get my truck on the road. And them have them date out before I get any wear on them. Not sure what I'm going to do the way the prices are going up.

Arizona is HARD on tires and batteries. And don't get me started on the insurance industry dictating numerous things they shouldn't be. Don't want to get banned from this great forum.

 

[sunrk]

Bridgestone D697's in 285/75r16 cost over $400 a tyre here, so it's a minimum A$2000 for 5 new tyres. I'm not interested in MT tyres.

 

[sodafeld1]

Couldn't agree more with everything said here. I get sick of consumption conspiracy bs. We got free government led globe 'upgrades' to save 'power' which don't last 3 months, replacements from the local supermarket cost 5x what the old globes cost and don't even last a week. The better quality globe is 11x the price from hardware store. So who is counting 'power' saving costs upon manufacturing, bs. Use to be a joke about how many people are needed to change a light globe, but now it is no joke and not so simple.

Old valve tv's use to last 30+ years, now the new flat screens get chucked every 3 years, can't repair them. bs again.
Nearly everywhere we turn, throw away 'green wash bs'.

I feel like smacking the next person to say 'sustainable'.

I have done ok with coopers at3 and get close to 100k kms, but dread the next tyre purchase too. Found it interesting that U.S lc folks like the Japanese tyres as gourmet, but often in Oz the coopers are the gourmet ones!


But admittedly, I go by how much tread is left more than anything. $$$

 

[sodafeld1]

that's not cgi either!

 

[sunrk]

Speaking of globes there is the global consumerism con called Earth Hour.... I checked the tyres on my 80 today and they're made in week 17 of 2015. They still have 75 ish pct tread.

And the new frontier of consumerism - electric vehicles. Zero emissions ha ha. But that's because all the 'energy' to 'fuel' them comes from somewhere else. Primarily out of the local power grid (as solar if someone can afford it doesn't work at night). Wind power doesn't work when there's no wind either.

Can't 'recharge' a dead EV by the side of the road where there's no charging station to plug into (which is most likely powered by the grid, or a generator). All the road service mobs will start getting EV emergency generator trucks to cater for all the EV's that die mid-flight with batt flattery.

Also remember that recycling only exists if it's seen to be profitable. If there was no perceived commercial pathway to generate profit tyres wouldn't get recycled, and EV battery modules would start being dumped in landfills like tyres often area. Steel and other metals (copper, aluminium, magnesium, etc.) seem to be the only real value-added commodities where materials are *directly* extracted and re-used from end-of-life vehicles. Tyres require huge resources to make, and huge resources to un-make.

 

[sodafeld1]

Mate! you got me on my favourite rant topic.
yeah bloody earth 'one bs' hour, switch em back on day and night for cross eyed christmas after that with bs throwaway christmas lights. tokenism.

No way known yet that they can supply that much electricity. My prediction is enforced nuclear power for all. My more optimistic mates have hopes for hydrogen, I think of explosions with hydrogen and the full on storage vessels to hold it. How much emissions is that going to cost to make that? Hydrogen takes lots of energy to make.

Busted carbon fibre wind turbine blades are buried in the desert at night time when no one is looking.

Let alone batteries..

I couldn't help criticise a mate who got an electric bike from nz. He had to upgrade his solar panels to make enough juice to charge it. At least I get his old panels. But I said he looks like a f# volvo driver, the way the bike is designed, the rider's posture is all upright and pious like. Can't fix those electric motors. $7k for a battery! bs. Mind you he is a good guy, means well for the earth, use to be an ethical investments advisor, but he left the job, jaded that it was not ethical. Counts koala poo to save the koalas...

the worst is where no one looks or visits, they log around my bush block like no tomorrow, whole hill sides cleared in a week for the disposable townhouse..

I wish they would legislate manufacturers to make things which last. Stop the plastic bs already.
At least we all like lc's here because they are well made.

I feel a bit better now. thanks sunrk, that's not from sun ra is it?

 

[sodafeld1]

funny thing too with the search with what to do with all these tyres. One use is is chopping them up and sprinkling on the astro turf soccer pitches for grip. troubles is the fumes from these pitches over 20c gives an unnerving unhealthy feeling, reminds me of a book, 'death by rubber duck'..we are surrounded and entrenched

Now the chinese have built a battery recycling plant 1km away from the primary school on the way to my bush block. brilliant.

 

[sodafeld1]

GDP, gross domestic product, what our politicians and economists rave about to increase, includes rubbish.

I better calm down now, watch the big boys 'colon-ise' mars..

 

[sunrk]

I still wonder where all the 'rubber' comes from to make all the new tyres, since the 'old' rubber is oxidised/vulcanised through use/exposure/flexing/abuse/etc. and is single-use-only for original intended purpose. The steel belting can at least be recovered and re-used like most other scrap metals.

At one point in the value chain there is a massive 'loss' in order to fund the massive profits at the end, and then then profits from commercial-scale recycling. With tyres I'd say it's the actual raw rubber production.

As for electric vehicles (of all types) I like the tech, but the only way to make it work at commercial scale is to 'Chinesium' it. Nearly all solar panels are now made in China. Nearly all EV battery cells are made in China. Every mobile phone is made in China. Tesla doesn't own the battery tech - it's mostly Panasonic cells used in it's battery modules. Things like e-bikes (bicycles), electric scooters, even drones, are all made as throw-away items with lithium batteries made (at present) primarily from cobalt and lithium 'conflict minerals'.

Imagine if motor vehicles in the main were designed and built like that to be 'thrown away' after 5 to 20 years? But that's how they're going, especially current EV's which are very much 'immature' examples of future tech.

 

[sodafeld1]

I still wonder where all the 'rubber' comes from to make all the new tyres, since the 'old' rubber is oxidised/vulcanised through use/exposure/flexing/abuse/etc. and is single-use-only for original intended purpose. The steel belting can at least be recovered and re-used like most other scrap metals.

At one point in the value chain there is a massive 'loss' in order to fund the massive profits at the end, and then then profits from commercial-scale recycling. With tyres I'd say it's the actual raw rubber production.

As for electric vehicles (of all types) I like the tech, but the only way to make it work at commercial scale is to 'Chinesium' it. Nearly all solar panels are now made in China. Nearly all EV battery cells are made in China. Every mobile phone is made in China. Tesla doesn't own the battery tech - it's mostly Panasonic cells used in it's battery modules. Thinks like e-bikes (bicycles), electric scooters, even drones, are all made as throw-away items.

Imagine if motor vehicles in the main were designed and built like that to be 'thrown away' after 5 to 20 years? But that's how they're going, especially current EV's which are very much 'immature' examples of future tech.

too true brother, ahmen!
palm oil for example is farmed on mass , forests are cleared to grow palm trees in malaysia. Much the same for rubber trees.
The massive loss is the environment.

I hear folks complain about the chinese. But they only want what other's have had the good fortune to have, car, fridge colour tv. First world nations could exploit the environment 'scot free' in the 50- 60's - 70s, no questions asked. Jacques Cousteau , ocean environmentalist honestly believed that the sea was an unlimited resource. Bob dylan, 'good time to drive a cadillac..after a war'
There is a good documentary series called 'the china century' abc, explains really well, why china is doing what it is doing. I do not know if this can be helped.

But we are in history in the making. After all, imagine if Napolean kept half of the north U.S. in French possession, instead of selling it for 4cents an acre to Jefferson, clever fella! That would have made a different world. The 'Louisiana purchase'.

To be constructive and to have any hope of positivity for the future is to aim at the causes of this short term-ism. Short term-ism is prevalent in our society.
Economists, manufacturers and businesses need to be environmentalist too. I think toyota was good holding back on ev's as they simply considered the tech not to be there. But they have to bow to what the market think they wants unfortunately, if they want to stay in business.

Media has a bigger influence than ever with leading down the wrong roads and mis-information. They aim at lots of quick hits until the next sensation.

Politicians which look longer than their own term need to be chosen.
Think of a gothic cathedral which took at least 3 generations to build, not short term quick buck, they had a bigger reason to make something.

We have to think and pause before consuming anything.

I was looking into tyre recycling machines for awhile, it is not easy or cheap.

Truth is, steel on steel transport is one of the most efficient, trains that is. General motors had a huge hand in getting rid of that as much as possible, along with standard oil, firestone tyres...

Really good book is called 'the prize' the history of oil, standard oil, shell, bp etc and the rape they have done, everywhere.

Takes someone with big testicles to cut through the bs. Oh jeez..can't thank you enough sun for raising the tyre consumption question.

 

[sodafeld1]

Thailand has the biggest rubber plantation. Michelin had one in vietnam, 31k acres..usually poor countries to supply the rich

 

[Grayscale]

They pack soil in tires, stack them like bricks, and live in them. Very strong and energy efficient.

Now, if they mandated that the tires are up-cycled instead of recycled, it would probably put a whole bunch of people out of business. Could you imagine only just buying a roof, a slab, some infrastructure, a pile of rebar, and a roof.

 

[sunrk]

If structures made from used tyres would be valid in bushfire zones it would wipe out the entire Australian used tyre industry. Oops did I speak out against a commercialised waste business...