Talk me out of buying a tough dog lift kit! (1 Viewer)

[alwaysbored786]

So i just got my LC about 2 weeks ago, and sadly it wasnt disclosed that most of the bushings are shot, including the shock cushions.

So im changing pretty much every suspension component back to be refreshed. Not a huge deal as I expect to do such on a truck thats close to 200k miles, but didnt expect to do so right away.

Ive searched and searched, and i've narrowed it down to Iron Man Foam Cell Pro Stage 2, or the Tough Dog 41/45mm (rear adjustable) foam cell, with diff drop/upgraded end links.

Im going to be doing 90% road driving, which is where the rear adjustability of the TD seems like a good option. Both seem to be around the same price if i do diff drop and extended beefier end links for both set ups. But sounds like TD is the winner based on what i've been reading.

I guess my only concern is warranty with the TD, Ironman has a 3 year warranty, with US dealers. TD i think has 3 years too, but how quick/easy is a warranty claim if i need to do that?

I think im mostly sold on TD bc of what im reading everywhere, but would love some more input before i drop close to $2k on suspension for this old beast.

 

[Pucker5]

If 90% of your driving is going to be on road driving what are you looking to achieve? A refresh of the factory Toyota’s all around (tokico’s) would be significantly cheaper. If you want some lift and a bit firmer Ride you can get some new springs and make some turns of your factory torsion bars. The difference in cost could go a good way in your baselining which may be a better spend of $$$ initially

maybe start with td or iron man shocks and Maybe springs..Make torsion bars, and diff drop your phase two.

 

[alwaysbored786]

If 90% of your driving is going to be on road driving what are you looking to achieve? A refresh of the factory Toyota’s all around (tokico’s) would be significantly cheaper. If you want some lift and a bit firmer Ride you can get some new springs and make some turns of your factory torsion bars. The difference in cost could go a good way in your baselining which may be a better spend of $$$ initially

This thought has crossed my mind, especially given that oem shocks from McGeorge are super cheap (i think around $40-50 each).

My goal is to have some sliders, and 33" wheels/tires on there, enjoy daily driving and the occasional off road trail here and there once a month or so, no crazy rock crawling.

Im baselining the truck, whats left is all the fluids, and some PS hoses (and of course the lovely worn out bushings). In all honesty, the bilstein 4600's that are on there now, may still be in ok condition, im just of the mindset that if im in there, might as well upgrade. However, that can be a slippery slope that others can talk me out of.

 

[suprarx7nut]

If 90% of your driving is going to be on road driving what are you looking to achieve? A refresh of the factory Toyota’s all around (tokico’s) would be significantly cheaper. If you want some lift and a bit firmer Ride you can get some new springs and make some turns of your factory torsion bars. The difference in cost could go a good way in your baselining which may be a better spend of $$$ initially

Exactly my thoughts. OEM shocks are an awesome value on the 100. Also keep in mind, if you lift enough to need non-OEM shocks, you should also budget adjustable UCAs and a diff drop.

Going to a ~1" lift is really cheap. New springs in the rear and crank the T-bars up front. $500 and you're done.

Going to a 2+" lift (correctly) is expensive. Springs, shocks, diff drop, UCAs, sway bar links. That's a solid $3k.

Do you need to spend all that extra cash? Sounds like not to me based on your quick description of use.

 

[suprarx7nut]

This thought has crossed my mind, especially given that oem shocks from McGeorge are super cheap (i think around $40-50 each).

My goal is to have some sliders, and 33" wheels/tires on there, enjoy daily driving and the occasional off road trail here and there once a month or so, no crazy rock crawling.

Im baselining the truck, whats left is all the fluids, and some PS hoses (and of course the lovely worn out bushings). In all honesty, the bilstein 4600's that are on there now, may still be in ok condition, im just of the mindset that if im in there, might as well upgrade. However, that can be a slippery slope that others can talk me out of.

Hearing just a little more about your use, I would not spend $$ on shocks. If the existing are ok, leave em be. If you need to change them, go OEM.

33" AT tires, sliders and a very mild lift (or no lift at all) can get you up and down most trails without a scratch. It takes a lot of money to eek out a little more off road performance than that.

Sorry for double post, weird timing on our posts.

 

[bobcatag2006]

I am farther along on the same path you're doing.

This spring/summer I replaced all 4 shocks with OEM, front sway bar links, and ball joints. Next I'm planning on replacing the rear springs with OME 860 and crank my torsion bars for the 'lift'. I have 33" tires and my 100 is my DD. I also do family-style off-road driving. Took it to the beach for a weekend this summer and up two trails in New Mexico back in May. I also need to do the bushings, links, or something in the rear after the springs because I get an annoying creak/squeek when going over road bumps.

Other than that irritating noise it rides great.

 

[alwaysbored786]

I am farther along on the same path you're doing.

This spring/summer I replaced all 4 shocks with OEM, front sway bar links, and ball joints. Next I'm planning on replacing the rear springs with OME 860 and crank my torsion bars for the 'lift'. I have 33" tires and my 100 is my DD. I also do family-style off-road driving. Took it to the beach for a weekend this summer and up two trails in New Mexico back in May. I also need to do the bushings, links, or something in the rear after the springs because I get an annoying creak/squeek when going over road bumps.

Other than that irritating noise it rides great.

Hearing just a little more about your use, I would not spend $$ on shocks. If the existing are ok, leave em be. If you need to change them, go OEM.

33" AT tires, sliders and a very mild lift (or no lift at all) can get you up and down most trails without a scratch. It takes a lot of money to eek out a little more off road performance than that.

Sorry for double post, weird timing on our posts.

I think you all just convinced me to not go with TD just quite yet. I may end up doing it 2 years down the road or so.

The stock suspension im reading certainly is quite good, and given im not going to be pushing this truck to its limits at all, should be more than enough for me. Ive already got new stock end links to install too .

I'll keep that money and throw it at any small items i find that need some special attention on this truck. Thank you all for the insight!


Now to search for stock shock part numbers, including bushings/retainers/nuts, etc. McGeorge here i come!

 

[Pucker5]

This thought has crossed my mind, especially given that oem shocks from McGeorge are super cheap (i think around $40-50 each).

My goal is to have some sliders, and 33" wheels/tires on there, enjoy daily driving and the occasional off road trail here and there once a month or so, no crazy rock crawling.

Im baselining the truck, whats left is all the fluids, and some PS hoses (and of course the lovely worn out bushings). In all honesty, the bilstein 4600's that are on there now, may still be in ok condition, im just of the mindset that if im in there, might as well upgrade. However, that can be a slippery slope that others can talk me out of.

If the 4600’s are solid, I wouldn’t replace them, they’re a bit firmer than the factory tokicos but overall a decent shock (less lift tolerance though). Also, pretty sure if they malfunction or break they are guaranteed for life. I could be wrong but bilstein And their customer service stands by their products. You can fit 33’s and sliders on the vehicle as it stands now but if you’re jonesing to spend some dough would make sure my sway bar bushings are new, end link bushings Are new, upper and lower ball joints are good, control arm bushings are in solid order...all the stuff that may be aged Or compromised at 200k miles

 

[nitteo]

33s fit fine in stock. oem shocks are no brainer for non-lift and daily driving. just get OME medium springs ($200) for the rear, crank TBs to match and you are done. have a great daily ride with enough of a "lift" to do 95% of trails out there.

 

[alwaysbored786]

If the 4600’s are solid, I wouldn’t replace them, they’re a bit firmer than the factory tokicos but overall a decent shock (less lift tolerance though). Also, pretty sure if they malfunction or break they are guaranteed for life. I could be wrong but bilstein And their customer service stands by their products. You can fit 33’s and sliders on the vehicle as it stands now but if you’re jonesing to spend some dough would make sure my sway bar bushings are new, end link bushings Are new, upper and lower ball joints are good, control arm bushings are in solid order...all the stuff that may be aged Or compromised at 200k miles

They currently feel ok, but i cant tell too much since the rest of the bushings are shot, so the is kind of all over the place. I do notice some dirt grime on the shock body, so i just assume they're potentially blown and its oil from the shock. ill double check that for sure though.

33s fit fine in stock. oem shocks are no brainer for non-lift and daily driving. just get OME medium springs ($200) for the rear, crank TBs to match and you are done. have a great daily ride with enough of a "lift" to do 95% of trails out there.

This is what i need to hear. Ive never taken anything off road myself, so knowing stock shocks and OME springs can get me through most of the basic stuff that i'll go to, is fantastic.

For the TBs, im reading i should still have some rake in the front to maintain proper steering, without it being floaty. I would rather do a 1" rake in the front, some say 2", do you have any input, i think 2"might look a bit funky.

 

[nitteo]

For the TBs, im reading i should still have some rake in the front to maintain proper steering, without it being floaty. I would rather do a 1" rake in the front, some say 2", do you have any input, i think 2"might look a bit funky.

when you install the new oem shocks, measure for droop and adjust TBs accordingly. 60mm of droop is recommended. also when you do install the new rear springs, allow a few weeks for it to settle. it will ride higher in the back for a bit.

 

[Pucker5]

They currently feel ok, but i cant tell too much since the rest of the bushings are shot, so the is kind of all over the place. I do notice some dirt grime on the shock body, so i just assume they're potentially blown and its oil from the shock. ill double check that for sure though.




This is what i need to hear. Ive never taken anything off road myself, so knowing stock shocks and OME springs can get me through most of the basic stuff that i'll go to, is fantastic.

For the TBs, im reading i should still have some rake in the front to maintain proper steering, without it being floaty. I would rather do a 1" rake in the front, some say 2", do you have any input, i think 2"might look a bit funky.

you won’t need to adjust rake if you don’t touch your springs or change your load. The 33’s and the sliders may require a couple turns. I believe it’s more an issue is ensuring you have the correct droop, not necessarily stance but in general there is a 1” or so difference from front to back on factory suspension and load so folks thumbing it will try to follow that difference. Thumbing something like your suspension is not ideal though. Search droop

 

[loeky]

Save the money, based on what I'm reading. I went with OEM shocks and OME springs on a previous truck and it was great balance of ride without the OME 'bounce'. If you're not going hardcore wheeling or towing or otherwise, put your money towards other toys. You won't be missing out on anything.

 

[jLB]

I've got the Tough Dog kit on two of our three 100 series, and I am a fan, but even I wouldn't recommend dropping ~$2000 on a suspension upgrade (from any vendor) after only 2 weeks of ownership (unless you've done this before, and know exactly what you're looking for).

I haven't had any need to use the warranty, but as responsive as Jason/Trail Tailor has been, I wouldn't expect any issues.

As a number of people have posted above, there are much more economical ways of getting a little lift and/or replacing bushings, and 33" tires fit just fine with the stock suspension.

I am a firm believer in getting out and using your vehicle with minimal modifications (read tires and sliders), and address any shortcomings you run across during use.

 

[alwaysbored786]

Save the money, based on what I'm reading. I went with OEM shocks and OME springs on a previous truck and it was great balance of ride without the OME 'bounce'. If you're not going hardcore wheeling or towing or otherwise, put your money towards other toys. You won't be missing out on anything.

I just priced it out, $323 shipped for all new oem shocks with rubber cushions, and new oem retainers all around.

Which OME springs should i go with, im reading The 2865 spring is good, but not sure exactly what i should do here?

I've got the Tough Dog kit on two of our three 100 series, and I am a fan, but even I wouldn't recommend dropping ~$2000 on a suspension upgrade (from any vendor) after only 2 weeks of ownership (unless you've done this before, and know exactly what you're looking for).

I haven't had any need to use the warranty, but as responsive as Jason/Trail Tailor has been, I wouldn't expect any issues.

As a number of people have posted above, there are much more economical ways of getting a little lift and/or replacing bushings, and 33" tires fit just fine with the stock suspension.

I am a firm believer in getting out and using your vehicle with minimal modifications (read tires and sliders), and address any shortcomings you run across during use.

I agree, thats how i am with my M3's. I usually keep them stock until i track it, then add my mods based on what i need, i should follow that same principle here too. Thank you for the input!

 

[nitteo]

I just priced it out, $323 shipped for all new oem shocks with rubber cushions, and new oem retainers all around.

Which OME springs should i go with, im reading The 2865 spring is good, but not sure exactly what i should do here?



I agree, thats how i am with my M3's. I usually keep them stock until i track it, then add my mods based on what i need, i should follow that same principle here too. Thank you for the input!

lol, i have an e46 m3 with my LC 100.

 

[alwaysbored786]

lol, i have an e46 m3 with my LC 100.

Hah yes! always fun to see forum members with other same toys as myself!


Now you know why im replacing all my bushings, the E46/E36 needed all of those, so im conditioned to replaced any and all bushings now hahaha

 

[loeky]

I just priced it out, $323 shipped for all new oem shocks with rubber cushions, and new oem retainers all around.

Which OME springs should i go with, im reading The 2865 spring is good, but not sure exactly what i should do here?



I agree, thats how i am with my M3's. I usually keep them stock until i track it, then add my mods based on what i need, i should follow that same principle here too. Thank you for the input!

Go for the medium weight springs unless you're planning on a heavy aftermarket bumper or a lot of other stuff [drawers, towing, elephant storage] in the rear. Believe that is the 2865, but please confirm yourself. I went with OME on another truck and frankly just wasn't impressed for the money. It took almost a year to calm down and not shake out my teeth on the road. No comment on Tough Dog as I've no experience [but interested, as I might go that way on my 70 series donkey ]

 

[gatormark91]

I won't talk you out of it, I love my TD bits. Buy with no worries. smooth ride, and if you get the adjustable rears, you will not regret it.

 

[jonmangelo]

I just priced it out, $323 shipped for all new oem shocks with rubber cushions, and new oem retainers all around.

Which OME springs should i go with, im reading The 2865 spring is good, but not sure exactly what i should do here?



I agree, thats how i am with my M3's. I usually keep them stock until i track it, then add my mods based on what i need, i should follow that same principle here too. Thank you for the input!

I just priced it out, $323 shipped for all new oem shocks with rubber cushions, and new oem retainers all around.

Which OME springs should i go with, im reading The 2865 spring is good, but not sure exactly what i should do here?



I agree, thats how i am with my M3's. I usually keep them stock until i track it, then add my mods based on what i need, i should follow that same principle here too. Thank you for the input!

alwaysbored786 Do you mind posting the part numbers required for all (4) OEM shocks, cushions and retainers?