Real time 3B to 13BT swap advice. (2 Viewers)

[OffRoad Rage]

I'm putting a 13BT into a '83 BJ60. I'm about 1/3 of the way through the engine swap and am trying to decide whether to go with the 13BT flywheel, bell housing, clutch and starter or the 3B parts. I have both sets of parts so that doesn't factor into the equation.

I'd like to keep the truck 12V for simplicity sake and the fact that cold starting is rarely a problem here. The clocking on the starters is an obvious difference. The starter housings appear to be identical except for the clocking position. I would hope that the internals could be swapped if I need to use the 13BT starter case with the 13BT bell housing.

I'm ready to order the clutch parts so if any of you that are experienced with this or a similar swap can give me some feedback and direction then I'd be grateful.

Thanks,
Norm

 

[OilHammer]

You can convert the 13BT starter to 12V pretty easily. Just reuse the starter cone and swap the motor/solenoid over. I did this with the 12v minitruck starter and it worked just fine. So, I would say try both bellhousing and see which one works best for your engine bay and work from there. I didn't have both sets on hand, so I went all 13 on mine.

 

[downey62]

Offroadrage, What is up with the 3b. Will it be up for sale? Are there any problems with the 3b. I'm looking for an engine for my 60 thanks. Did not mean to hijack the thread. Alan

 

[RufusTheDufus]

I seem to recall reading some posts on Mud that indicate the 13BT bell housing places the engine or trans at a slightly different angle. I think the trans ends up being out of alignment if you use the stock 3B engine mounts with the 13BT bellhousing. The 13BT never was used in a 40 series. It was used in other models with different engine arrangements.

There's a thread on here from Rutbeer that details everything he went through installing a 13BT in his 40. It's very informative. He even covers the 12v starter cone conversion process.

 

[OilHammer]

That is correct as far as I recall. This was not a huge concern putting the 13 in the 40 since I was putting in all the motor mounts and was able to adjst them a bit to keep the tranny more level.
My thread page Rufus is referring to about the starter is here:
https://forum.ih8mud.com/40-55-series-tech/60600-truck-put-13bt-into-6.html

 

[jake2far]

I did this

I swapped out a 3B in my 1985 BJ70 with a 1987 13BT out of a BJ74. The block of the the 13BT needs to be a Red block, it is the same configuration as the 3B, the bell housing needs to be the aluminum bell housing there is no difference between the 3B and 13BT aluminum bell housing. The 3B starter is clocked different but it bolts up just fine to the 13BT, the red block 13BT is a straight drop in. The heater grid on the 13BT is 24vdc but it works fine on 12vdc, in order to shut off the 13BT you need a 12vdc vacuum switch (see picture with red arrow), the 13BT has a 24 vdc vacuum switch. You can get 1 from Sheldon at G&S or from Dave Stedman at Toyota Parts. The fly wheel of the 3B and 13BT are the same size but the 13BT uses a bigger diameter clutch, I would use (and I did) the 13BT clutch as the 13BT produces more horse power than a 3B.
The conversion can be researched at G&S web site, they have a pretty good reference to this conversion. Contact Sheldon as he can provide all the needed parts and give sound advice (best resource I have found and a really good guy).
You will need a rubber intake connector hose between the turbo and air cleaner.
If you run into any problems contact me at jake2far@hotmail.com or call me at 503-777-3708, I have done this and have a pretty good idea of how to.
You should consider a 2 1/2" or large exhaust system from turbo back with a vibrasober to prevent cracking the turbo housing, the larger exhaust is a must do.


Jim

 

[OffRoad Rage]

Thanks for all the feedback everyone. Sorry I didn't say so sooner but it's been one of those weeks at work. I printed the G&S write up before I started this venture but it didn't seem to be definitive on which clutch and bell housing assemblies should be or could be used. This is exactly the information I was looking for.

The engine is a red block and the 13BT bell housing is the aluminum one. Sounds like I should be OK to use the 13BT housing with the 3B starter. That's also good news that the heater grid can be used 12V. One less thing to convert.

I still have to order the 12V VSV, but I was not aware of the "rubber intake connector hose between the turbo and air cleaner" so that's something I need to ask more questions about.

Do you know if there is anything in the write ups about adding a return tube to the fuel tank? I know that's on my list but a little further down.

I hope to do a full write up on project when I get further along.

Thanks again,
Norm

 

[OffRoad Rage]

Speed Pick Up?

I swapped in the 13BT bell housing and checked the starter fit this weekend. I may need to relocate the brake lines but no big deal. There is a difference in the mounting location for what I'm guessing is a speed pick up for the tach signal off the flywheel. The aluminum 13BT bell housing is almost twice as thick as the 3B bell housing in this area. I was hoping to re-use the sensor but it doesn't extend as far into the opening. Is there a 12v sensor that could be had for the 13BT housing? Or will the existing sensor work even though it's recessed?

Thanks,
Norm

 

[OilHammer]

I believe that sensor has to be very close in order to work, so if you aren't at the same depth, then my guess would be no. I looked for a 12v when doing mine and didn't come up with anything. In fact, I still don't have a running tach....just got used to the sound of it.

 

[Hulsty]

Is there a 12v sensor that could be had for the 13BT housing? Or will the existing sensor work even though it's recessed?

Thanks,
Norm

Yes there is, just use the standard 12V BJ74 sensor.

 

[jake2far]

Thanks for all the feedback everyone. Sorry I didn't say so sooner but it's been one of those weeks at work. I printed the G&S write up before I started this venture but it didn't seem to be definitive on which clutch and bell housing assemblies should be or could be used. This is exactly the information I was looking for.

The engine is a red block and the 13BT bell housing is the aluminum one. Sounds like I should be OK to use the 13BT housing with the 3B starter. That's also good news that the heater grid can be used 12V. One less thing to convert.

I still have to order the 12V VSV, but I was not aware of the "rubber intake connector hose between the turbo and air cleaner" so that's something I need to ask more questions about.

Do you know if there is anything in the write ups about adding a return tube to the fuel tank? I know that's on my list but a little further down.

I hope to do a full write up on project when I get further along.

Thanks again,
Norm

Yes you have to have a return line, it needs to go to the bottom of the tank to prevent foam build up on a partial tank of fuel.
Good luck on the install

Jim

 

[ivanjasper]

im planning to change my toyota b engine into 13bt

can i use my b transmission and what type of 13bt will i buy the red or the blue block? i need some help

 

[coldtaco]

Sheldon did this swap in the 86BJ-70 I bought from him and the tach worked on this rig. Probably a tach sensor from the 74 should work if you can find a 12v one.

 

[roma042987]

hate to thread hijack but where are you guys sourcing your 13bt? im trying to find one.

 

[Dbradford04]

13bt

Me too...would love to find one.

 

[OilHammer]

Finding one isn't too hard. The bigger issue is getting a shipper to handle it these days. Used engines became taboo to transport last year and I don't know if that has relaxed yet. I have imported 4 of them, but it was at least two years since the last one came in. Add to that the conversion rates, and it got expensive too.