Radiator preventative maintenance (1 Viewer)

[highfructose]

In the case someone else was in the same boat as me: I’m at around 83k miles on my 2011 lc570 and I’ve, recently, seen the “stress mark” around the part number plate on my radiator deteriorate.

in the past 10k or so miles, I saw what looked like a white stress mark where you might bend plastic back and forth around the part number plate on the radiator begin to show the faintest hint of a crack. No leaking coolant yet.

I considered purchasing a radiator and jumping through all the hoops but then, instead, decided to pick up a spare JB weld radiator repair kit so that, if the radiator ever popped a leak, I might patch it and be able to make it home.

then I decided I might as well put the JB weld patch kit on the radiator NOW and perhaps give it an appropriate lifespan before I spend the money and time doing the radiator...and all it’s accompanying accoutrements...

knowing that I should probably replace the water pump, thermostat, and hoses at the same time partially went into the calculus. Will see how it turns out. Attached is a photo of what my radiator stress mark looked like after roughing it up with the sandpaper from the JB weld radiator kit. It’s quite dark...was doing the repair very early in the morning and the flash didn’t work that well.

 

[DPA200]

Before I changed my radiator out I personally preferred having the crack uncovered and visible so I could regularly track the progress of the crack. I figured if it was all covered I’d have no idea when it’d blow

 

[highfructose]

Before I changed my radiator out I personally preferred having the crack uncovered and visible so I could regularly track the progress of the crack. I figured if it was all covered I’d have no idea when it’d blow

Yes. I may have made a mistake...

this JB weld is thick and tough though. Might stay patched and ensure it never blows. I’ll find out sooner or later.

 

[Sandroad]

Yes. I may have made a mistake...

this JB weld is thick and tough though. Might stay patched and ensure it never blows. I’ll find out sooner or later.

I don’t like the “sooner or later” thing. And what is an “appropriate lifespan”? Even in the dark photo, the radiator is obviously cracked. If it was mine, I would consider the glue a temporary patch for only the time it took me to assemble the parts and tools for the replacement work. Start now to line those up and a place to do the work if you aren’t going to do it yourself. Far better to plan the time and money now rather than as an emergency expensive job at an inconvenient place/time. The last thing you want to have happen is to find out it blew out by being forced to the side of the road with an overheated engine.

 

[highfructose]

I don’t like the “sooner or later” thing. And what is an “appropriate lifespan”? Even in the dark photo, the radiator is obviously cracked. If it was mine, I would consider the glue a temporary patch for only the time it took me to assemble the parts and tools for the replacement work. Start now to line those up and a place to do the work if you aren’t going to do it yourself. Far better to plan the time and money now rather than as an emergency expensive job at an inconvenient place/time. The last thing you want to have happen is to find out it blew out by being forced to the side of the road with an overheated engine.

The lifespan for these radiators, with their flaw, appears to be 80-140k miles.

I would expect a lifespan for a radiator designed for a 200 series to be 150 or so minimum, but Toyota messed up. The radiators on 200’s have a flaw that they’re aware of...that doesn’t exist on sequoias and tundras with the same engine. If I could spend more on a fully aluminum one designed for 250, I’d do so. I’ve heard mixed things about the replacement radiators. I’m not 100% sure they fixed the weak spot.

my thinking is: I’m not replacing the radiator unless it actually leaks...because along with the radiator, because I was in there, I’d be, at minimum, also replacing the water pump, thermostat, hoses, fan related stuff, etc. plus I don’t even know if the new radiator solves the weak spot issue.

And, to my mind, replacing $500 worth of parts at 80,000 miles even though the radiator isn’t leaking doesn’t seem reasonable. Each of us decides what’s reasonable...I fully support someone replacing their radiator and all those other things before it breaks...but that’s not for me.

I figured I’d post this potential solution for others that have the same mind as me-reinforcing a weak spot, carrying an extra patch kit ($12), distilled water, and expecting to do the 500 dollar maintenance at a later date. I’ve had a few radiators blow on the various s*** boxes I’ve owned. I’ve had cooling issues. They’re not the end of the world.

time will tell...who knows, the radiator might spring a leak some place else now...I could have a catastrophic leak, quick overheat, and blow a head gasket. I’m not too worried about those things though...hasn’t happened to me yet.

 

[4gotalot]

This is another radiator page that I wrote, I am not good at typing
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No worries about causing overheating problems unless you were very very hot climate and pulling a heavy load were pressure and specific gravity of the fluid can make a difference of the boiling point of water. The crack just let the pressure drop to ambient as if the cap was off. I would guess that the fluid level was still above the core and the radiator was still doing its job.

The radiator on my 80 series cracked at around 230k mikes and I just unlocked the cap so no pressure was alowed build up and a any over flow just went into the tank but could not be drawn back in to radiator. I drove the 80 for six more months like that until it was warm enough to wear shorts and then we installed a new one. Sorry about the visual image of my halibut belly white legs. No, I am not kidding, 200,000+ miles is at the low end for 1990's LC radiators. I wouldn't have any problem doing the same with the 200LC.

I do not recommend any one running there equipment with the radiator unlocked a 1/4 turn but still locked in place unless they were familiar with a closed/presurized and an open/non-presurized cooling system. NEVER OPEN A RADIATOR CAP WHEN THE RADIATOR IS HOT!!!!!!
------------------------

I ran my 200 LC with the radiator cap off for over a month to ck the amount of fluid that was displaced when the engine heated up and the level never dropped close to the core. I did this just before I put my carbon fiber patch on the failing area. If its going to crack out from under the patch or blow the patch off then it will still look the same as the other failures. I agree, its going to happen sooner or latter. I am really just do not like the idea of a mfg defect that they would not take care of.

 

[Sandroad]

The lifespan for these radiators, with their flaw, appears to be 80-140k miles.

I would expect a lifespan for a radiator designed for a 200 series to be 150 or so minimum, but Toyota messed up. The radiators on 200’s have a flaw that they’re aware of...that doesn’t exist on sequoias and tundras with the same engine. If I could spend more on a fully aluminum one designed for 250, I’d do so. I’ve heard mixed things about the replacement radiators. I’m not 100% sure they fixed the weak spot.

my thinking is: I’m not replacing the radiator unless it actually leaks...because along with the radiator, because I was in there, I’d be, at minimum, also replacing the water pump, thermostat, hoses, fan related stuff, etc. plus I don’t even know if the new radiator solves the weak spot issue.

And, to my mind, replacing $500 worth of parts at 80,000 miles even though the radiator isn’t leaking doesn’t seem reasonable. Each of us decides what’s reasonable...I fully support someone replacing their radiator and all those other things before it breaks...but that’s not for me.

I figured I’d post this potential solution for others that have the same mind as me-reinforcing a weak spot, carrying an extra patch kit ($12), distilled water, and expecting to do the 500 dollar maintenance at a later date. I’ve had a few radiators blow on the various s*** boxes I’ve owned. I’ve had cooling issues. They’re not the end of the world.

time will tell...who knows, the radiator might spring a leak some place else now...I could have a catastrophic leak, quick overheat, and blow a head gasket. I’m not too worried about those things though...hasn’t happened to me yet.

Fair enough. We all have our own risk levels and uses of our 200s. I have heard good things about JB Weld. Have a pic of the repair?

 

[bloc]

I’ve heard mixed things about the replacement radiators. I’m not 100% sure they fixed the weak spot.

Care to cite any references? Have you read the whole PSA thread, including the cross section cut pictures? Or seen what none of us have yet: the new design cut similarly to see whether it is also very thin in that spot?

Toyota changed the singular spot that is at issue, and in a way that appears to be sound from an engineering perspective. There are some very smart people on this board, and the consensus is the new design is definitely an improvement.

I would certainly trust it more than an all metal unit that may have other fatigue, corrosion, and electrolytic issues.

 

[highfructose]

This is another radiator page that I wrote, I am not good at typing
-------------------------------------------
No worries about causing overheating problems unless you were very very hot climate and pulling a heavy load were pressure and specific gravity of the fluid can make a difference of the boiling point of water. The crack just let the pressure drop to ambient as if the cap was off. I would guess that the fluid level was still above the core and the radiator was still doing its job.

The radiator on my 80 series cracked at around 230k mikes and I just unlocked the cap so no pressure was alowed build up and a any over flow just went into the tank but could not be drawn back in to radiator. I drove the 80 for six more months like that until it was warm enough to wear shorts and then we installed a new one. Sorry about the visual image of my halibut belly white legs. No, I am not kidding, 200,000+ miles is at the low end for 1990's LC radiators. I wouldn't have any problem doing the same with the 200LC.

I do not recommend any one running there equipment with the radiator unlocked a 1/4 turn but still locked in place unless they were familiar with a closed/presurized and an open/non-presurized cooling system. NEVER OPEN A RADIATOR CAP WHEN THE RADIATOR IS HOT!!!!!!
------------------------

I ran my 200 LC with the radiator cap off for over a month to ck the amount of fluid that was displaced when the engine heated up and the level never dropped close to the core. I did this just before I put my carbon fiber patch on the failing area. If its going to crack out from under the patch or blow the patch off then it will still look the same as the other failures. I agree, its going to happen sooner or latter. I am really just do not like the idea of a mfg defect that they would not take

Fair enough. We all have our own risk levels and uses of our 200s. I have heard good things about JB Weld. Have a pic of the repair?

Lol I’ll take a picture of it when the sun comes up and post it. This was my first foray into JB weld (plus fiber cloth). it looks like a 3 year Ike’s finger painting, but based on how thick the product ended up being, I’d say it’s more than twice as thick as the plastic of the radiator...and harder too. I’d be very surprised if it ever leaks from anywhere near this patch.

I’d recommend everyone that does off-roading stuff or goes on longish road trips spends $12 and puts one of these repair kits in their vehicle. It’s cheap effective insurance.

 

[linuxgod]

I have some jbweld in my toolbag, just in case. I have no idea how well it actually bonds to the original plastic though. It might be really thick, but if it doesn't actually bond with the plastic so much as harden on top of it and adhere to it, then even if the crack gives you're basically just buying time before the layer between the radiator plastic and the jbweld also gives. Seems like a good temporary repair, but if you've gone ~100k miles just consider the cost like it's another wear item like brakes or tires and just replace it.

For those suggesting not to worry as you can loosen the radiator cap to decrease the pressure if it does go and still drive it.... yeah, don't do that. You might be able to drive to a shop to get it fixed like that, or you might end up with a blown head gasket like some other unlucky soul in this forum (apologies I can't recall who it was who bought a used LC that had had the radiator replaced and later found out the truck had a leaky head gasket/warped head). The pressure in the cooling system helps keep it from boiling... by relieving the pressure you're lowering the boiling point for the system. (I dunno, maybe you can get away with it in north dakota in winter, but how lucky do you feel?)

 

[Sandroad]

I have some jbweld in my toolbag, just in case. I have no idea how well it actually bonds to the original plastic though. It might be really thick, but if it doesn't actually bond with the plastic so much as harden on top of it and adhere to it, then even if the crack gives you're basically just buying time before the layer between the radiator plastic and the jbweld also gives. Seems like a good temporary repair, but if you've gone ~100k miles just consider the cost like it's another wear item like brakes or tires and just replace it.

For those suggesting not to worry as you can loosen the radiator cap to decrease the pressure if it does go and still drive it.... yeah, don't do that. You might be able to drive to a shop to get it fixed like that, or you might end up with a blown head gasket like some other unlucky soul in this forum (apologies I can't recall who it was who bought a used LC that had had the radiator replaced and later found out the truck had a leaky head gasket/warped head). The pressure in the cooling system helps keep it from boiling... by relieving the pressure you're lowering the boiling point for the system. (I dunno, maybe you can get away with it in north dakota in winter, but how lucky do you feel?)

I agree. When I hit around 100k I’m going to replace the radiator with the new type, unless it cracks before then. The new style looks good and I take my LC to places where it would be difficult to get parts, plus it would be a serious problem to get replaced when on a camping trip towing my trailer.

 

[linuxgod]

I agree. When I hit around 100k I’m going to replace the radiator with the new type, unless it cracks before then. The new style looks good and I take my LC to places where it would be difficult to get parts, plus it would be a serious problem to get replaced when on a camping trip towing my trailer.

FWIW if you don't have the hairline crack, I personally wouldn't do a PM replacement until it starts to show. And I regularly take 4000-5000 mile trips around the country, pulling a trailer through the mountains, offroading along the way, etc. While plenty of folks have posted pics of theirs giving out, I suspect most if not all of them had the crack forming and just didn't notice. Inspection at oil change intervals IMO should be sufficient. Once you detect the hairline crack, then yes, I would definitely do a PM replacement once it's convenient.

BTW my 2013 had the hairline crack at 76k miles. The Toyota dealership said they wouldn't replace under the VSA unless it was actually leaking. That said the tech said there was some pink coolant residue around it and thus Toyota replaced mine as part of the VSA. I had not noticed any leak, but a few drops of coolant *might* have splashed onto the top of the radiator when I was checking the level, so perhaps that is what he saw, or perhaps mine actually gave out on the trip from my house to the dealership... Sadly they replaced mine with the same part, so I'm sure I'll have to deal with it again down the road...

 

[highfructose]

FWIW if you don't have the hairline crack, I personally wouldn't do a PM replacement until it starts to show. And I regularly take 4000-5000 mile trips around the country, pulling a trailer through the mountains, offroading along the way, etc. While plenty of folks have posted pics of theirs giving out, I suspect most if not all of them had the crack forming and just didn't notice. Inspection at oil change intervals IMO should be sufficient. Once you detect the hairline crack, then yes, I would definitely do a PM replacement once it's convenient.

BTW my 2013 had the hairline crack at 76k miles. The Toyota dealership said they wouldn't replace under the VSA unless it was actually leaking. That said the tech said there was some pink coolant residue around it and thus Toyota replaced mine as part of the VSA. I had not noticed any leak, but a few drops of coolant *might* have splashed onto the top of the radiator when I was checking the level, so perhaps that is what he saw, or perhaps mine actually gave out on the trip from my house to the dealership... Sadly they replaced mine with the same part, so I'm sure I'll have to deal with it again down the road...

So they replaced it with the same part?

im still not clear on whether Toyota had fixed the problem or not...if I buy a new radiator later on, I’d like it to be an improved version.

 

[bloc]

So they replaced it with the same part?

im still not clear on whether Toyota had fixed the problem or not...if I buy a new radiator later on, I’d like it to be an improved version.

The new part was introduced in late 2018, and there was still some stock of the original stuff that trickled out over the next few months. I bought my 2013 cruiser with 105k and a cracked radiator in April of 18. Got it home and immediately threw a new OEM in.. old design.


For the past year plus every one I’ve seen has been the new design.

 

[highfructose]

The new part was introduced in late 2018, and there was still some stock of the original stuff that trickled out over the next few months. I bought my 2013 cruiser with 105k and a cracked radiator in April of 18. Got it home and immediately threw a new OEM in.. old design.


For the past year plus every one I’ve seen has been the new design.

Out of curiosity, how do you know whether a radiator is the new one or the old one?

 

[bloc]

Out of curiosity, how do you know whether a radiator is the new one or the old one?

Tons of pictures in the radiator PSA thread. BTW the thread title isn't accurate, as it only implicates up to 2010 with the problem. IIRC some high mile 2016s have even had the issue.. still the older design.

 

[linuxgod]

So they replaced it with the same part?

im still not clear on whether Toyota had fixed the problem or not...if I buy a new radiator later on, I’d like it to be an improved version.

Yeah even though the newest part was released I got old stock. :-(

 

[linuxgod]

Out of curiosity, how do you know whether a radiator is the new one or the old one?

The stamp/sticker on the raised portion near the cap is rectangular and has 90 degree edges in the old style

The new style is curved with no right angles

I highly suspect the new style will eliminate this issue. Whether or not there's some new failure point that emerges later who knows?!?

 

[TeCKis300]

Done right, these patches aren't just bandaids. They can be permanent fixes. For this particular stress riser type issue, it can be permanently fixed such that it doesn't become the first, or ever, point of failure any longer. The earlier a patch (more a structural support) is applied, the better, as it geometrically changes the shape of that corner in a way that the stress riser will never develop or propagate further.

Modern adhesives and epoxies are used all the time in industry to manufacture things for a lifetime. It ain't Elmer's glue we grew up with. Working with composite aircraft, these bonds are often tougher than the substrate. OP did a good thing repairing it proactively. Hopefully it was done well and early enough to completely sidestep the issue.

To running without a radiator cap... please no. Pressure is a critical part of a well functioning cooling system. Reduced heat capacity, hot spots, pump cavitation, air bubbles/boiling/air locks, are all bad things that rely on a properly pressured cooling circuit to avoid.

 

[highfructose]

Done right, these patches aren't just bandaids. They can be permanent fixes. For this particular stress riser type issue, it can be permanently fixed such that it doesn't become the first, or ever, point of failure any longer. The earlier a patch (more a structural support) is applied, the better, as it geometrically changes the shape of that corner in a way that the stress riser will never develop or propagate further.

Modern adhesives and epoxies are used all the time in industry to manufacture things for a lifetime. It ain't Elmer's glue we grew up with. Working with composite aircraft, these bonds are often tougher than the substrate. OP did a good thing repairing it proactively. Hopefully it was done well and early enough to completely sidestep the issue.

To running without a radiator cap... please no. Pressure is a critical part of a well functioning cooling system. Reduced heat capacity, hot spots, pump cavitation, air bubbles/boiling/air locks, are all bad things that rely on a properly pressured cooling circuit to avoid.

Yes, this patch is markedly thicker and harder than the radiator itself. Plus it has fiber reinforcing it. I doubt it’ll pop there...if there’s another stress point, I think that will be the failure point.

if you’ve got a radiator that is showing stress, I think it’s a no brainer to use the JB weld radiator repair kit as preventative maintenance.