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panhard rod....need for spherical bearing?

Discussion in '80-Series Tech' started by concretejungle, Aug 21, 2006.

  1. concretejungle

    concretejungle SILVER Star

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    I was looking at some of the really nice stuff man a fre has and noticed their adjustable panhard rod with spherical bearing. Thinking the motion through it's cycle in my head, it appears that there is no need for that type of bearing. Am i wrong? Not knocking MAF, just curious if it is something that is actually needed in that application?

    http://www.man-a-fre.com/pa/4plus80seriessuperhdadjrearpanhardrod.htm
     
  2. Clutchee

    Clutchee I'm fun sized! SILVER Star

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    Talk to Steve from MAF....supports the board & knows his products.:)

    4Plus products=great stuff!:D
     
  3. -Spike-

    -Spike-

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    On the front, when the control arms rotate, they twist the axle. The spherical bearing would allow the axle to twist independantly of the panhard rod. I don't know if there's enough twist to warrant a mod.

    -Spike
     
  4. General Sherman

    General Sherman

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    Yes

    Standard rubber bushing will return to center and as such have a preload built into them. When the end from Man-A-Fra moves it has no preload alowing it to move more freely. This is miner at the pivot but can translate greatly at the wheels. Give it a try you'll like it.
    Neil
    FAO
     
  5. Nay

    Nay

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    You don't need it from a "twist" perspective on a moderate travel suspension. What you are getting is the removal of a rubber bushing, which will tighten up the lateral control onroad. Something along the same lines as putting poly bushings into the panhard adds a lot of stability.

    I've used spherical ends in panhards before and they are a good application...but really the only reason is to remove rubber from your suspension for a more rigid link. The more offroad biased you get, and the more suspension travel you engineer, the more this matters.

    Nay
     
  6. concretejungle

    concretejungle SILVER Star

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    Thanks for the input. So i guess for my application a standard adjustable panhard is really all i need. THe spherical bearing is more bling than anything.

    Now if i was sitting with 6inches of lift perhaps this would be beneficial?
     
  7. Nay

    Nay

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    With 6" of lift and 14" of travel I'd want spherical rod ends on both ends, although a simple lefthand/righthand tapped DOM with standard spherical rod ends would be plenty and could be done for under $100.

    For OME 2.5" a standard adjustable is what you want (if you think any adjustment is necessary)...just remember that means having poly bushings instead of rubber now that Slee has stopped modifying stock panhards to be adjustable.

    So your choice really is between poly and spherical rod end. I personally would have done the MAF panhard for the extra $50 if I had been aware of it when I did my adjustable. The rod end should last well in that application and you still keep rubber on the other end. I say that simply because I don't trust smallish poly bushings in hardcore applications, 'cause I've fragged 'em before and if you don't have spares it gets ugly quickly.

    Nay
     
  8. concretejungle

    concretejungle SILVER Star

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    Thanks Nay. I did measure my axle and both front and rear are off to one side or the other a tad over an inch.
     
  9. sleeoffroad

    sleeoffroad Supporting Vendor

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    Just to clarrify, we will still offer the DIY adjuster for those that want to modify a stock panhard with rubber bushings. The new rods we have uses urethane, but can be replaced with stock Toyota bushings.

    As for your comment on the small bushings, how does that gell with small bushings on Billstein shocks?
     
  10. Nay

    Nay

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    I've never had any failure problems with eye mount bushings in terms of flex because I've never had an extreme travel suspension. The link doesn't have to rotate much within the mount and the bushing style is different than in a control arm or panhard (whether poly or rubber in the shock eye mounts the bushing style is the same).

    It's not that poly bushings are small per se in a control arm or panhard application that is a potential issue, it's that this style of bushing can't handle much twist. The panhards don't need much twist to accomodate fore/aft axle movement, so theoretically there should be no issue. But that takes us back to the ongoing "expedition vs. rock crawling" discussion. You get completely different stresses between the two types of wheeling.

    Have you done any long term testing on the new style? I prefer it tremendously to the old version because the poly is a lot more rigid than the old rubber and the design is high quality. Do you carry the bushings separately? I'll have to get an extra set for trail spares.

    Nay
     
  11. sleeoffroad

    sleeoffroad Supporting Vendor

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    We have not done long term testing, but the bushings are made by one of the largest bushing developers in Australia. The bushings have a 2 year/40000km warrantee.

    I do not have spare bushings in stock, but will get some with our next order.
     
  12. Nay

    Nay

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    Sounds good - I did flex them with only one end of the panhard installed, and the bushings were easily taking far more fore/aft movement than you could ever achieve.

    I want to make sure that I'm not coming across on this thread as being critical - IMO poly is the best bushing material in any application where it is durable because poly bushings are simple to replace, very inexpensive, and offer rigidity.

    Do you have a front bar in this style now? Hmmm...this is turning into a sales phone call :D

    Nay
     
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