This is my concern as well....should get a LOT more coolant from the drain petcock of the radiator. That would be of primary concern to me.
Overheating and Radiator is not HOT???? Need Help ASAP (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter cruiserhunter
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This is my concern as well....should get a LOT more coolant from the drain petcock of the radiator. That would be of primary concern to me.
- Thread starter
- #42
Does that indicate waterpump failure or something more serious?
Patrick
Patrick
Cruiserdrew
On the way there
Read through this and a couple of comments.
1-Water pumps almost never fail, and when they do, they leak out of the bearing. If yours isn't leaking its fine. Remember the bearing goes bad, the shaft doesn't spin true and destroys the seal. While theoretically the impeller could corrode away, that basically doesn't happen either, especially with a Toyota water pump.
2-Cooling problems like this are almost always due to a blocked radiator. Doesn't matter new or old, it's almost always the radiator. Thermostats usually fail open-that's how they are designed-but it is definitely reasonable to replace it since it's a cheap part and accessible without much disassembly.
3-Burping the system is a myth. The flow in the system is designed to purge air, and with expansion the air is preferentially expelled out the radiator cap. So to get the air out of the system, fill as usual and make sure your radiator cap is good and that it seals properly.
4-Where the temp sender sits is just about the high point in the system. So if you think you have air in the system-fill with the sender out. When the coolant gets to the level of the sender hole, install the sender.
5-It is a pecularity of the 2F sender that if there is air in the system, the sender reads hot.
Good luck, cooling problems are a pain. I think in the end you will need to have the radiator rebuilt or just replace it. Make sure you get the 4 row heavy duty version.
1-Water pumps almost never fail, and when they do, they leak out of the bearing. If yours isn't leaking its fine. Remember the bearing goes bad, the shaft doesn't spin true and destroys the seal. While theoretically the impeller could corrode away, that basically doesn't happen either, especially with a Toyota water pump.
2-Cooling problems like this are almost always due to a blocked radiator. Doesn't matter new or old, it's almost always the radiator. Thermostats usually fail open-that's how they are designed-but it is definitely reasonable to replace it since it's a cheap part and accessible without much disassembly.
3-Burping the system is a myth. The flow in the system is designed to purge air, and with expansion the air is preferentially expelled out the radiator cap. So to get the air out of the system, fill as usual and make sure your radiator cap is good and that it seals properly.
4-Where the temp sender sits is just about the high point in the system. So if you think you have air in the system-fill with the sender out. When the coolant gets to the level of the sender hole, install the sender.
5-It is a pecularity of the 2F sender that if there is air in the system, the sender reads hot.
Good luck, cooling problems are a pain. I think in the end you will need to have the radiator rebuilt or just replace it. Make sure you get the 4 row heavy duty version.
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well in regard to the point above about air in the cooling system. These trucks are a royal pain in the @$$ in regard to getting air out of the cooling system....they do not simply purge air as most vehicle do. With most of the vehicles I've worked on when the coolant system required work, you drained the system, made the repairs and then filled it back up and let the thermostat cycle a couple of times with the radiator cap open and topped off the coolant, installed the cap and you were ready to go. Not that simple with teh 60, or at least its never worked for me that simply with eithe rthe I6 engine....Seems like the order of the day is get the front end up high and basically do the above but you end up having to let it cycle 4 or 5 times and maybe run for a while. Thats been my experience. I thik the problem is to some extent all the hard line coolant passenges and hoses on the I6 engine. Seems like on the 60 you end up having to let it run for some time with the cap off and nose up high to get teh air out...that's what I've had to do. I know they make some different funnels and one can unscrew this or that.
Old school temp senders only work correctly when totally submerged in liquid, if there is an air pocket there...where the temp sender probe is...then temps will not be reported correctly. I belive this is true for any temp sender either mechanical or electrical. In the case of the 2f the temp sender sits on the top of head....and on the engine I believe this is a high point in the system...thus prone for air pocket. Good idea to remove sender and fill with coolant till overflow and then reinstall sender if sealing is not an issue.
The 90 degree neck at the radiator water neck where the cap goes does make it an issue as far as determining condition of the radiator or sometimes determing if the radiator is full.
I agree the radiator should be looked at...at least pulled and tanked to see wha the condition is.
Old school temp senders only work correctly when totally submerged in liquid, if there is an air pocket there...where the temp sender probe is...then temps will not be reported correctly. I belive this is true for any temp sender either mechanical or electrical. In the case of the 2f the temp sender sits on the top of head....and on the engine I believe this is a high point in the system...thus prone for air pocket. Good idea to remove sender and fill with coolant till overflow and then reinstall sender if sealing is not an issue.
The 90 degree neck at the radiator water neck where the cap goes does make it an issue as far as determining condition of the radiator or sometimes determing if the radiator is full.
I agree the radiator should be looked at...at least pulled and tanked to see wha the condition is.
- Thread starter
- #45
Thanks for the posts guys.
Cruiser Drew and ELbert,
1. About the waterpump: I was also thought that water pumps leaked when they fail. That is why I initially thought I had an issue with my radiator, since my water pump was dry. But, I am getting no flow through the upper radiator hose when the truck is running (with or without the thermostat) and when I put a garden hose in the upper radiator inlet I get flow out of the rad drain spigot and after a minute water flowing out of the thermostat housing. (Upper rad hose removed) I believe this means that there is flow through the radiator and through the engine.
So ,if not blocked then no pressure to push coolant=waterpump.
Oh and my waterpump (unfortunately) was from autozone or o'rielies. I did not know of Cdan back then.. so maybe that is why it did not last as long
That is why I bought an new waterpump and thermostat. Just to be safe I'm gonna pull the radiator and have it pressure tested.
After everything is put back together I will attempt to burp the system with a really long funnel.
I will most definitely document this and let y'all know.
Thanks again
Patrick
Cruiser Drew and ELbert,
1. About the waterpump: I was also thought that water pumps leaked when they fail. That is why I initially thought I had an issue with my radiator, since my water pump was dry. But, I am getting no flow through the upper radiator hose when the truck is running (with or without the thermostat) and when I put a garden hose in the upper radiator inlet I get flow out of the rad drain spigot and after a minute water flowing out of the thermostat housing. (Upper rad hose removed) I believe this means that there is flow through the radiator and through the engine.
So ,if not blocked then no pressure to push coolant=waterpump.
Oh and my waterpump (unfortunately) was from autozone or o'rielies. I did not know of Cdan back then.. so maybe that is why it did not last as long
That is why I bought an new waterpump and thermostat. Just to be safe I'm gonna pull the radiator and have it pressure tested.
After everything is put back together I will attempt to burp the system with a really long funnel.
I will most definitely document this and let y'all know.
Thanks again
Patrick
MrMoMo
That's not rust, it's Canadian patina...
Lets break this down a little, and see what we have.... 
You shouldn't be getting flow past the thermostat, unless the truck is hot.
Getting "flow" out of the rad does not mean everything in the rad is ok, it simply means that it is not blocked solid. Having enough flow for a garden hose may not mean you have sufficient flow to cool the engine. (Though it is better than no flow) realize that the flow available through your rad hose is MUCH higher than your garden hose... Look at the difference in hose size. The coolant is going to take the path of least resistance. If your rad is partially clogged, the coolant will go though the heater circuit.
Lets see what has been discovered so far...
1) you have heat in the cab (pump is pushing coolant)
2) your temp sender works, you boiled it in a pot of water
4) your rad is not completely blocked
5) your engine is not completely blocked
Everything seems to be in order.
Next steps?
1) make sure there is no air in your temp sender housing.
2) can you confirm that the thermostat is actually opening? Seems there is some inconsistency here. For the cost, just replace it. Make sure the gaskets are in right, and the thermostat is in properly. Check that you have flow with NO thermostat installed.
Buying a whole bunch of parts and throwing them at the truck is not the way to solve the problem. Find the root cause of the problem, and fix it, spend your money on the parts you need! (And the upgrades you want!)
Have you figured out why? Lets say you remove the rad from the equation. If you put the lower rad hose (rad end) into a bucket of water (instead of the rad supply to engine hose) will the engine suck the water from the bucket, and spit it out the other end? If yes, your problem is not on the engine side. If no, forget the rad (for now) and figure out why the engine isn't able to draw water. Is the above true with the thermostat removed? If the truck is not up to temp, you shouldn't be getting any flow out the upper rad hose, nor any suction from the bucket, otherwise the rad would over cool the system. Pull the thermostat.
This contradicts what you said above, that you have no flow. Unless the water pump impeller has sheared off the shaft. This would then contradict your earlier finding that you do get heat in the cab (since it wouldn't pump coolant to the cab)
You shouldn't be getting flow past the thermostat, unless the truck is hot.
Getting "flow" out of the rad does not mean everything in the rad is ok, it simply means that it is not blocked solid. Having enough flow for a garden hose may not mean you have sufficient flow to cool the engine. (Though it is better than no flow) realize that the flow available through your rad hose is MUCH higher than your garden hose... Look at the difference in hose size. The coolant is going to take the path of least resistance. If your rad is partially clogged, the coolant will go though the heater circuit.
Well, if you have SUFFICIENT flow through the rad, and through the engine, and you can get heat in your cab, then you don't have an overheating problem. Check that you don't have an air pocket stuck at your temp sender as suggested. Perhaps everything is fine, but you are reading a steam temperature rather than coolant temperature!
Except you have proven that the water pump works, because it pumps heat through the cab.
Lets see what has been discovered so far...
1) you have heat in the cab (pump is pushing coolant)
2) your temp sender works, you boiled it in a pot of water
4) your rad is not completely blocked
5) your engine is not completely blocked
Everything seems to be in order.
Next steps?
1) make sure there is no air in your temp sender housing.
2) can you confirm that the thermostat is actually opening? Seems there is some inconsistency here. For the cost, just replace it. Make sure the gaskets are in right, and the thermostat is in properly. Check that you have flow with NO thermostat installed.
Buying a whole bunch of parts and throwing them at the truck is not the way to solve the problem. Find the root cause of the problem, and fix it, spend your money on the parts you need! (And the upgrades you want!)
waterpumps do generally leak at the weep hole when they fail....and or they lock up or have some catastrophic failure, but not necessarily do they fail that way 100% of the time.
If you pull the radiator have it boiled out and rodded.... a pressure test only confirms leaks.
- Thread starter
- #48
No flow with thermostat out. That was the first thing, i did when I did not feel pressure/flow in the upper hose.
I get the bit about sufficient flow....
I'll have to make sure the thing is heating the air. The problem is it's 100 degrees in the shade here in Arizona. I can not recall if the air was heated or if the when turning the a/c off it started blowing outside air at me.
I'm working tomorrow, but I'll check in the evening if I get home before too late.
The idea about buying the waterpump was that I was going to pull the rad and I had a 7-9 yr old aftermarket waterpump in my truck. I am lucky enough to have a reasonable source for toyota parts.... so why not replace. Now, I have a extra, for whatever reason and the waterpump will be carefree for some time.
Elbert,
Most definitely will have the radiator boiled, rodded, pressure tested and whatever else I can done to that thing to make it work better, longer and more reliably.
How many times can you rod a radiator?
Again, VERY MANY THANKS!!!
Patrick
I get the bit about sufficient flow....
I'll have to make sure the thing is heating the air. The problem is it's 100 degrees in the shade here in Arizona. I can not recall if the air was heated or if the when turning the a/c off it started blowing outside air at me.
I'm working tomorrow, but I'll check in the evening if I get home before too late.
The idea about buying the waterpump was that I was going to pull the rad and I had a 7-9 yr old aftermarket waterpump in my truck. I am lucky enough to have a reasonable source for toyota parts.... so why not replace. Now, I have a extra, for whatever reason and the waterpump will be carefree for some time.
Elbert,
Most definitely will have the radiator boiled, rodded, pressure tested and whatever else I can done to that thing to make it work better, longer and more reliably.
How many times can you rod a radiator?
Again, VERY MANY THANKS!!!
Patrick
MrMoMo
That's not rust, it's Canadian patina...
Well that changes everything! Back to square one....
(I can see how it would feel like heat blowing out when it's that hot out!)
If you can push water through the engine manually (hose) but water does not flow out of the engine when running, with the thermostat removed - you very likely have a pump problem. This coupled with the fact that perhaps you actually don't have heat, would strongly suggest a problem with the pump.
in regard to how many times can a radiator be rodded....probably the radiator shop will have to tell you that. I don't think there is a magic number of times, more so it would be as long as the radiator was in decent shape, otherwise time to replace the radiator if it cannot be rodded / boiled-cleaned.
Eliminate possible causes of overheating to find cause
You wrote:
Engine hot. (to touch)
Rad "cold". (to touch)
Gauge going in red.
Right?
Cause1:
Did you ever use a radiator leak fix?
If yes, your rad could likely be clogged.
Replace radiator, flush won't work, if
center cores are clogged. (Happened to me)
Cause 2: (Most likely)
Thermostat died, stays close.
1) Open thermostat housing, take out thermostat.
2) Reassemble housing w/o thermostat.
3) Still overheating?
4) No = thermostat. Yes = go to Cause 3
4) Buy new thermostat, install (forget the old one, unreliable).
Cause 3:
Water pump (unlikely)
1) On cold engine disconnect top return hose (after thermostat @ radiator)
2) Adapt a source of water supply to top inlet flange of radiator.
3) Start engine,
warm up.
4) Does water get pushed out of top hose coming from thermostat housing?
5) No, large gas (air) bubble possible, "burp".
6) Though unlikely, water pump defective
Return your findings!
You wrote:
Engine hot. (to touch)
Rad "cold". (to touch)
Gauge going in red.
Right?
Cause1:
Did you ever use a radiator leak fix?
If yes, your rad could likely be clogged.
Replace radiator, flush won't work, if
center cores are clogged. (Happened to me)
Cause 2: (Most likely)
Thermostat died, stays close.
1) Open thermostat housing, take out thermostat.
2) Reassemble housing w/o thermostat.
3) Still overheating?
4) No = thermostat. Yes = go to Cause 3
4) Buy new thermostat, install (forget the old one, unreliable).
Cause 3:
Water pump (unlikely)
1) On cold engine disconnect top return hose (after thermostat @ radiator)
2) Adapt a source of water supply to top inlet flange of radiator.
3) Start engine,
warm up.
4) Does water get pushed out of top hose coming from thermostat housing?
5) No, large gas (air) bubble possible, "burp".
6) Though unlikely, water pump defective
Return your findings!
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MrMoMo
That's not rust, it's Canadian patina...
¿ huh ?
Seriously? Dude, I'm not usually one to flame a post but did you read any of the previous posts before regurgitating everything that everyone else has already suggested, ruled out, and pointed to??
Good tip on cause one - he may well have a problem in the rad, however, it has been made pretty obvious with his previously posted findings that there are other things going on here as well.
"Eliminate possible causes of overheating to find cause"
Wow, brilliant. Try "read previous posts before posting "most likely" solutions"
Trying to help someone out is great, A for effort - But muddying the waters with things already discussed and clarified isn't going to help sort it out for anyone.
Seriously? Dude, I'm not usually one to flame a post but did you read any of the previous posts before regurgitating everything that everyone else has already suggested, ruled out, and pointed to??
Good tip on cause one - he may well have a problem in the rad, however, it has been made pretty obvious with his previously posted findings that there are other things going on here as well.
"Eliminate possible causes of overheating to find cause"
Wow, brilliant. Try "read previous posts before posting "most likely" solutions"
Trying to help someone out is great, A for effort -
But muddying the waters with things already discussed and clarified isn't going to help sort it out for anyone.
MrMoMo
That's not rust, it's Canadian patina...
QUALITATIVELY WRONG!!!
you will NOT get flow out of the thermostat housing on a cold engine unless you have removed the thermostat or your thermostat is stuck open.
Posting incorrect information makes it even harder for people to figure things out.
Seriously? Dude, I'm not usually one to flame a post but did you read any of the previous posts before regurgitating everything that everyone else has already suggested, ruled out, and pointed to??
Good tip on cause one - he may well have a problem in the rad, however, it has been made pretty obvious with his previously posted findings that there are other things going on here as well.
"Eliminate possible causes of overheating to find cause"
Wow, brilliant. Try "read previous posts before posting "most likely" solutions"
Trying to help someone out is great, A for effort -
"Seriously? Dude, I'm not usually one to flame a post..."
A: ...but you did!
Your head
and one more Btw. Rest of your comment sounds like drunk trailer trash red neck puke, to be fair....
I won't engage...
"Trying to help someone out is great, A for effort -
But muddying the waters with things already discussed and clarified isn't going to help sort it out for anyone."A: Did you help? Thank you "lecturer". Now be a good boy and STFU.
Having gone through the same problem and received similar structured help by a VERY KNOW AND REVERED person her on IH8M (&U2) I simply wanted to help.
Reading some "suggestions" I felt compelled to help in the same way to hlp solve the posters problem.
So sorry that my efforts SO upset you....
Finally , this should fit your level:
I drove more miles and years with a FJ60 than you pooped in your diapers.
Happy?
Ada boy!
PS Did you do Paris - Dakar (Not Brownville local) in aFJ60? If yes, then we can talk!
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MrMoMo
That's not rust, it's Canadian patina...
I don't even know how to compare these, but if that's how you see it.... Ok. Um, ¿thanks? Apparently I didn't poop enough as a child.
Sorry folks, I'll stop trying to help, I'll be busy building up my time behind the steering wheel so I can have mechanical knowledge and better troubleshooting skills. Best of luck sorting this out, apparently you are in good hands.
dorcom, don't expect any more replies out of me.
I don't poop enough now! 
TMI ?
TMI ?
I actually didn't expect your lecture in the first place. You can't assume that I first read all 50 something replies first. I meant well to help the original poster and not to receive some quack from you.
The latter suggests that you might have some other issues underlying. Your initial first response to my post says a lot about you I don't even want to know. Neither did it help the original poster.
Now that all is totally off topic let's close it here.
- Thread starter
- #60
FINALLY Got it this sometime!!! What the Hell is this????
Ok Ladies and Gentleman,
I sincerely apologize for taking so long.. Life and work have given me severly limited time.
So i finally was able to pull the water pump and I found this yellow gunt inside the pump!!!!! see the pictures? ANYONE KNOW WHAT THIS IS?????? I have never ever seen anything like this before.
I got the radiator flushed, recored, and pressure tested. (there was a small leak that is now fixed).
I have a new waterpump, thermostate and fixed radiator now and when I get back in town I will put them on, but I am afraid the same problem will occur.
Anyone knows what is inside my waterpump and knows how to fix what caused it?
Thanks for all the help and advice
Patrick
Ok Ladies and Gentleman,
I sincerely apologize for taking so long.. Life and work have given me severly limited time.
So i finally was able to pull the water pump and I found this yellow gunt inside the pump!!!!! see the pictures? ANYONE KNOW WHAT THIS IS?????? I have never ever seen anything like this before.
I got the radiator flushed, recored, and pressure tested. (there was a small leak that is now fixed).
I have a new waterpump, thermostate and fixed radiator now and when I get back in town I will put them on, but I am afraid the same problem will occur.
Anyone knows what is inside my waterpump and knows how to fix what caused it?
Thanks for all the help and advice
Patrick
