Maybe so, sorry still trying to learn about all this lol. I'm referring to radiator
Opinions on this water to air intercooler for LJ78 / 2LTE? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter digitalbuck
- Start date
-
- Tags
- 2lte intercooler lj78 water
This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate
links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.
Bosch Automotive 392022002 Bosch Intercooler Water Pumps | Summit Racing
Free Shipping - Bosch Intercooler Water Pumps with qualifying orders of $109. Shop Intercooler Water Pumps at Summit Racing.
Try again on the links form different sites.
Okay, I've ordered my stuff from your list and have a machine shop making the throttle body adapter plate.
Couple questions though:
1) Do you have a diagram that shows the routing of hoses? Not sure by pics what hose goes to what. I mean, I know there is an inlet and outlet on intercooler, but how does it all tie in together? The aluminum piping seems easy enough, just not sure about heater hoses.
2) How did you run power to your pump and did you use any kind of relay?
So you're saying its safe to increase the fuel a little by loosing nut under spill control valve by a 1/4 turn or so, without installing the manual boost controller or the air speed control valve?
Plan is to follow your lead and install those items. In the meantime it would be nice to add a little more power. Just making sure I'm reading your comment correctly before I do it to mine.
Good afternoon! So on my attached diagram, is the the sequence of the boost gauge, air valve and controller correct?All right, here are a few points on tuning the 2LTE. I'll just put it here instead of starting a new thread.
Before turning up fuel on a 2LTE, I think there are a few prerequisites. You should have the cooling system in top notch condition, larger exhaust, a good intercooler, and a pyrometer.
You will need a manual boost controller ( Voodoo V MBC Black w/ Ceramic Ball Manual Turbo Boost Controller Made in USA | eBay ) installed on your turbo, and if you want to go over 14psi (which I do recommend), you will need a Pneumatic speed control valve (ASC-8 1/4" BSPT Pneumatic Air Flow Speed Control Throttle Valve CLEARANCE!! | eBay). The point of this valve is to bleed the air from the Boost Sensor in a very controlled manner (lower the boost curve).
The reason an intercooler is the key to more power, is when the turbo boost pressure is increased beyond a certain point, it creates a huge amount of extra heat. This means higher EGTs and less dense air going into the motor (fewer oxygen atoms). Once an intercooler is installed, it solves this problem. Now you have dense air, and lots of it (lots of oxygen).
The boost can be turned up a lot. I run 18psi max after the intercooler. This extra pressure has not worn my turbo in any discernible way over the past four years or so.
Having a lot of boost, with cool air, means there is a lot of head room for safely adding more fuel and making more power. I've maxed out my pump and it seems a good match for the boost I'm running (EGT wise).
Turning up the boost is simple, you just need any ebay manual boost controller. It goes on the boost line to the waste gate and increases the pressure at which the waste gate opens. Note it also takes a given amount of exhaust energy to drive the turbine to generate boost. You may think you've reached the boost limit of your turbo, but from what I've found, adding more fuel will solve this problem.
Now adding fuel part is a little more tricky. First thing is dealing with the computer over boost fuel cut. This is not a sharp cut off. I've found it is a bit more of a progressive thing. Before the over boost light comes on, the computer is already limiting the fuel when the boost gets high. Seems to start happening around 13-14psi or so.
The way to deal with this is the bleed valve that pradocruzer came up with. (Reducing 2lte egt's) It works really well, in that it shifts the whole boost curve down proportionally. So the idea is to trick the computer into thinking it is seeing a normal boost curve, where really you are running almost double the factory boost. The bleed valve just t's into the boost line to the boost sensor. It allows a certain amount of air leakage to reduce the pressure. It needs to be mounted after the little filter thing (which limits air flow a bit also). Tuning this valve is tricky. A 1/4 turn makes a difference. You want to be as high as possible before the computer starts limiting fuel. Only way to really tell is by seat of pants difference. Note, there is a product from a company called 'TurboSmart' called a pneumatic Fuel Cut Defender (FCD). DO NOT use this, because it leaves your boost curve as it is, and then abruptly clamps the boost at the maximum that you've set. This is impossible to tune to, as the computer will not add more fuel as the actual boost continues to rise past the clamp point.
Once that is sorted out, you can progress to turning up the fuel at the injection pump. It is done on top of the spill control valve (solenoid sticking up from the pump head). (see picture below - for a 1KZTE pump, but it's the same for the 2LTE) There is a little cap there that has to be removed. Underneath is a lock nut and hex adjust screw. Mark and take a picture of the factory setting. Then release the lock nut, and turn the screw in a 1/4 turn at a time. DO NOT turn it in more than 3/4 turn, or the engine will go into run-away! (I experienced this at one full turn, and it is scary!). Run-away doesn't happen at idle, it only happens when the engine speed is increased by throttle, and then it revs really high and does not come down. So once you've adjusted the screw, rev your engine while not driving to make sure this doesn't happen. If it does happen, you need to turn the screw back out while the engine is revving like crazy. It sucks, trust me. I've learned that as you get close to the run-away situation, what you will notice is that when you rev the motor the motor will take longer to slow down when the throttle is realeased. This is a sign you are getting close to run-away. So turn the fuel down a bit, and rev the motor again checking that it returns to idle quickly as normal.
Anyhow, 3/4 turn adds at least 30-50% more power. It's crazy. The extra fuel will likely increase the boost pressure, as more work will be done at the turbo with more exhaust gasses. So you'll have to go back and re-adjust the manual boost controller and air bleed valve accordingly.
It took me a couple weeks of fiddling to get the perfect tune. Even with maximum fuel, I still run EGT's that are about 200F LESS than they were when the truck was stock!! All because of the extra boost and cold air.
If you've had a pyro on for a while, you will know that you hit the highest EGT's when under sustained heavy load in hot ambient temps. So when you adjust your fueling, make sure you are tuning for safe EGT's under the worst circumstances. Around town and with normal highway driving my EFT's are pretty low, but under worst case conditions (towing up big hills in summer for example), they EGT's can end up much higher. My probe is post turbo, and worst case is 1000F. Normally I can never get it that high, and it maxes out closer to 800F. If your probe is pre turbo, shoot for 1200F worst case. With my tune, I never see black smoke at full boost. I can get black smoke before the turbo spools if I floor it, but I can control that with the right foot. I don't really floor it until the turbo has spooled up.
Really makes the motor fun. When I add the methanol too and the weather is cold, the truck rips pretty good!
These trucks make about 35-45 rear wheel hp when stock. Mine is making about 100 rear wheel hp right now (with meth/water on). Really transforms the truck. Doesn't seem like much, but it is about the same that my friends mildly tuned 1HDT is putting down to the wheels!! Not bad at all.
GTSSportCoupe
2LTE abuser
I'm trying hard to stay away from Ih8mud these days as I'm simply running out of time to respond to messages/posts due to family/work/home projects etc. I was hoping others who have also done these same modifications would step up to help, but I see not much is happening. So I'll help a bit. Lots of guys have intercooled their 2LTE's, so I suggest looking carefully at all those build threads for ideas too.
So, if you're doing an air/water intercooler system you have air piping, coolant piping and electrical wiring to deal with.
Air piping: Use 2" piping. Use silicone couplers in key spots to allow the engine to vibrate/move without damaging your intercooler parts. The whole idea is just to cool down the super hot air (air gets hot when it's compressed) coming from your turbo before it enters the intake manifold. So the piping runs from turbo compressor outlet into the intercooler, then from the intercooler to the intake manifold.
Coolant piping: Use heater hose and an electric water pump (I recommend using a Bosch pump). Place the pump fairly low in the system so it doesn't cavitate (air). The whole idea with this system is to take the hot water from your intercooler and run it to a small radiator at the front of your vehicle which cools it back down again. So basically you need hose to run from your intercooler, to a small rad, from the small rad to a pump, and from the pump back to your intercooler. You can add an expansion tank to the loop if you want too. I don't run one and have not had a problem. The radiator I'm using is large enough that the coolant temps don't get very hot and thus don't expand/contract much.
Electrical: Buy an automotive inline fuse holder and an automotive normally open 12V 40A relay. Use the landcruiser accessory box to turn the relay on when your car is running. Use the fuse to supply battery power to the power side of the relay. Power will run from the relay to your water pump. The water pump can be grounded to complete the circuit. This will run the water pump anytime your engine is running.
Here is an example of an air/water intercooler setup:
Here is how you wire the relay (instead of 'Lights' its your pump, and the switch is optional).
No, don't increase fuel without first increasing boost. In fact, the computer will add more fuel automatically as you increase boost (until the fuel cut occurs at 14psi). You have a pyrometer installed already right? If not, you should really get one before messing with anything. Anyhow, the best you can really do before installing the intercooler is install your manual boost controller and turn the boost up to around 12-13psi. The computer automatically adds more fuel. Don't run anymore than this as the air intake temps will be too hot as the turbo looses efficiency. Just this increase in boost will increase your power quite a bit.
I did not touch the spill valve screw until I had intercooled my motor. EGT's were too high already. Once intercooled, your EGT's will be much much lower and it will be safe to proceed with more tuning.
Once intercooled, I recommend turning up the boost as much as you can. On this motor you can only get so much as it's limited by how much fuel the injection pump can provide. Most I can get is around 19psi (post intercooler). Before you touch your fuel, you might only get about 14-16psi maximum.
You'll need the bleed valve to lower the boost curve into the ECU boost sensor at this point. This will effectively REDUCE fuel. It tricks the ECU into thinking your still in the safe boost region (pre fuel cut).
So now you finally get to turn up the injection pump spill valve screw. I've set mine to about 3/4 turn in. This brings the fuel curve back up again. Likely you'll have to go back and open your bleed valve a little more again (as boost will have gone up) to keep the computer from hitting the fuel limit again. That spill valve screw is the key to major power on these motors. It'll blow you away. But you need to do things in the right order.
The manual boost controller goes on the little hose between the wastegate actuator and the turbo compressor housing. It doesn't connect to the boost sensor - it's a separate system and is on the opposite side of the motor. Just follow the instructions given with whatever manual boost controller you bought.
The bleed valve t's in just before the ECU boost sensor. There is a little filter and stuff there that you need to leave in place. So basically the vacuum hose will run from the nipple on the intake manifold through the little factory filter and I think there is something else there, then it runs to your boost sensor. Your bleed valve t's in after all those things (just before the boost sensor). Start with the bleed valve full open, and start dialing it in until you get maximum power. If you turn it in too much (and you're running high boost) then the computer will go to fuel cut again. So then you open the valve up a bit again. You need to dial it in so that you get the maximum range out of the boost sensor just before it hits fuel cut. So on my engine, the actual boost the motor gets is 0-19psi, but the ECU boost sensor sees exactly the same shape boost curve, but 0-14psi.
I would not bother with using a boost gauge at the boost sensor. It's pretty easy to tell by seat of the pants if the bleed valve is working right. You should definitely have a boost gauge t'ed in right after the intake manifold nipple though. This will tell you the actual boost pressure going into your engine.
Here is a typical manual boost controller:
Here is how your bleed valve should go:
So, if you're doing an air/water intercooler system you have air piping, coolant piping and electrical wiring to deal with.
Air piping: Use 2" piping. Use silicone couplers in key spots to allow the engine to vibrate/move without damaging your intercooler parts. The whole idea is just to cool down the super hot air (air gets hot when it's compressed) coming from your turbo before it enters the intake manifold. So the piping runs from turbo compressor outlet into the intercooler, then from the intercooler to the intake manifold.
Coolant piping: Use heater hose and an electric water pump (I recommend using a Bosch pump). Place the pump fairly low in the system so it doesn't cavitate (air). The whole idea with this system is to take the hot water from your intercooler and run it to a small radiator at the front of your vehicle which cools it back down again. So basically you need hose to run from your intercooler, to a small rad, from the small rad to a pump, and from the pump back to your intercooler. You can add an expansion tank to the loop if you want too. I don't run one and have not had a problem. The radiator I'm using is large enough that the coolant temps don't get very hot and thus don't expand/contract much.
Electrical: Buy an automotive inline fuse holder and an automotive normally open 12V 40A relay. Use the landcruiser accessory box to turn the relay on when your car is running. Use the fuse to supply battery power to the power side of the relay. Power will run from the relay to your water pump. The water pump can be grounded to complete the circuit. This will run the water pump anytime your engine is running.
Here is an example of an air/water intercooler setup:
Here is how you wire the relay (instead of 'Lights' its your pump, and the switch is optional).
No, don't increase fuel without first increasing boost. In fact, the computer will add more fuel automatically as you increase boost (until the fuel cut occurs at 14psi). You have a pyrometer installed already right? If not, you should really get one before messing with anything. Anyhow, the best you can really do before installing the intercooler is install your manual boost controller and turn the boost up to around 12-13psi. The computer automatically adds more fuel. Don't run anymore than this as the air intake temps will be too hot as the turbo looses efficiency. Just this increase in boost will increase your power quite a bit.
I did not touch the spill valve screw until I had intercooled my motor. EGT's were too high already. Once intercooled, your EGT's will be much much lower and it will be safe to proceed with more tuning.
Once intercooled, I recommend turning up the boost as much as you can. On this motor you can only get so much as it's limited by how much fuel the injection pump can provide. Most I can get is around 19psi (post intercooler). Before you touch your fuel, you might only get about 14-16psi maximum.
You'll need the bleed valve to lower the boost curve into the ECU boost sensor at this point. This will effectively REDUCE fuel. It tricks the ECU into thinking your still in the safe boost region (pre fuel cut).
So now you finally get to turn up the injection pump spill valve screw. I've set mine to about 3/4 turn in. This brings the fuel curve back up again. Likely you'll have to go back and open your bleed valve a little more again (as boost will have gone up) to keep the computer from hitting the fuel limit again. That spill valve screw is the key to major power on these motors. It'll blow you away. But you need to do things in the right order.
The manual boost controller goes on the little hose between the wastegate actuator and the turbo compressor housing. It doesn't connect to the boost sensor - it's a separate system and is on the opposite side of the motor. Just follow the instructions given with whatever manual boost controller you bought.
The bleed valve t's in just before the ECU boost sensor. There is a little filter and stuff there that you need to leave in place. So basically the vacuum hose will run from the nipple on the intake manifold through the little factory filter and I think there is something else there, then it runs to your boost sensor. Your bleed valve t's in after all those things (just before the boost sensor). Start with the bleed valve full open, and start dialing it in until you get maximum power. If you turn it in too much (and you're running high boost) then the computer will go to fuel cut again. So then you open the valve up a bit again. You need to dial it in so that you get the maximum range out of the boost sensor just before it hits fuel cut. So on my engine, the actual boost the motor gets is 0-19psi, but the ECU boost sensor sees exactly the same shape boost curve, but 0-14psi.
I would not bother with using a boost gauge at the boost sensor. It's pretty easy to tell by seat of the pants if the bleed valve is working right. You should definitely have a boost gauge t'ed in right after the intake manifold nipple though. This will tell you the actual boost pressure going into your engine.
Here is a typical manual boost controller:
Here is how your bleed valve should go:
For piping and silicone parts I found some good stuff at Frozenboost.com. I’ll share a couple of pics ASAP that might help
Thanks guys! I have my boost gauge and controller hooked up. My boost controller doesnt have an arrow on it though so I'm playing with it, trial and error I guess. Watching my psi and egt's
You should be able to feel air coming out of your controller but you’ll need someone Erving the motor for you.
Last edited:
Nick has done so incredible much for the 2L-te crowd over the years and has helped me personally for the last 3 years. Collectively, the entire LJ world here has done some amazing mods for these little motors. If Nick wants to spend more time with family, I'm all for that and while I know little, I'll share what I can.
First pic is my Boost controller set-up . Notice the arrows on mine. I can't say yours are the same but...….
The next picture is of the air bleed value just before the Boost sensor for the ECU. Note the bleeder (Yellow circle) is after the 'T' to the boost gauge sensor ( both in Pink) and before the ECU boost sensor (Green)
Hope that helps. Again as Nick said, as you open the boost control valve, you will also need to open the bleeder valve to keep the ECU from reading more that 14 psi. And, as you introduce more fuel, you will need to adjust your boost controller and bleeder valve to find the sweet spot of Boost, fuel and keeping the ECU reading just under 14 psi.
Good luck.
First pic is my Boost controller set-up . Notice the arrows on mine. I can't say yours are the same but...….
The next picture is of the air bleed value just before the Boost sensor for the ECU. Note the bleeder (Yellow circle) is after the 'T' to the boost gauge sensor ( both in Pink) and before the ECU boost sensor (Green)
Hope that helps. Again as Nick said, as you open the boost control valve, you will also need to open the bleeder valve to keep the ECU from reading more that 14 psi. And, as you introduce more fuel, you will need to adjust your boost controller and bleeder valve to find the sweet spot of Boost, fuel and keeping the ECU reading just under 14 psi.
Good luck.
Last edited:
I agree! Nick has been amazing as all you have! I appreciate it so much as I had 0 experience with diesels prior to buying my Prado. I mean 0 experience! I dont blame him a bit for taking some time off. I realize some of my questions might be dumb but when your mechanical ability is as limited as mine, sometimes I need all the help I can get. With that being said, I really do appreciate all the guidance and pointers.
So I'm attaching what I did today. Ease let me know if I did something wrong. I tied in my boost gauge where I believe Nick told me to to get actual psi going into intake. My boost controller is different than yours. Basically it is set up where air coming from barb on side opposite of Wastegate forces ball bearing to press against internal spring, allowing air to pass through to wastegate. Is this wrong?
Your boost sensor tie in point looks good. It appears to me your boost controller is correct as well. As you tighten the adjustment knob, that increases the spring tension and begins to impede airflow to the wastegate, which will keep it from opening up as much and thereby allowing a higher boost. I think you are in a good place now to work on the IC before you proceed with more fuel.
I also see you still have the resonance tube coming off your air intake hose. You may want to bob it off like this.
![thumbnail_IMG_1291[1].jpg](data:image/svg+xml;charset=utf-8,%3Csvg xmlns%3D'http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2F2000%2Fsvg' width='250' height='333' viewBox%3D'0 0 250 333'%2F%3E "thumbnail_IMG_1291[1].jpg")
Just take the metal plug off the end and plug the air intake hose with it.
Just take the metal plug off the end and plug the air intake hose with it.
Awesome thank you! What is the purpose of the resonator tube?
As I understand, it the tube was for quieting the air intake/turbo sound, but I could be wrong. With my ears, it doesn't matter and really cleans up that part of the engine bay. My Boost is currently maxing at 13psi. I am getting ready to put a little more fuel to the mix myself.
You are correct on your boost controller install. I run the same one.
Just to help you understand the boost situation. More fuel creates more boost. You can't really hit those 18-20psi numbers Nick and I are seeing until you turn up the fuel.
The real trick is creating the most boost with the correct amount of fuel. It's a bit of a balancing act. The added fuel will produce more pressure thus more boost so you can utilize more fuel and on and own like that. You just don't want to adjust your spill valve beyond the point that the engine doesn't return to idle immediately. You can sort of hear the revs hanging as you get near the danger point of it trying to hang and run away. It's not a true run away, just extreme high revs that will not return to normal until you back off the fuel. Then , you have to find that sweet spot that you have enough boost to overcome the extra heat generated by the extra fuel. It sounds complicated, but it's more a finding the sweet spot. It's not in the same spot for each vehicle. I know Nick has his fuel turned up about 7/8 of a turn. Mine at that produces more heat than the boost can overcome. So, mine is at I would say about 11/16 of a turn.
Just to help you understand the boost situation. More fuel creates more boost. You can't really hit those 18-20psi numbers Nick and I are seeing until you turn up the fuel.
The real trick is creating the most boost with the correct amount of fuel. It's a bit of a balancing act. The added fuel will produce more pressure thus more boost so you can utilize more fuel and on and own like that. You just don't want to adjust your spill valve beyond the point that the engine doesn't return to idle immediately. You can sort of hear the revs hanging as you get near the danger point of it trying to hang and run away. It's not a true run away, just extreme high revs that will not return to normal until you back off the fuel. Then , you have to find that sweet spot that you have enough boost to overcome the extra heat generated by the extra fuel. It sounds complicated, but it's more a finding the sweet spot. It's not in the same spot for each vehicle. I know Nick has his fuel turned up about 7/8 of a turn. Mine at that produces more heat than the boost can overcome. So, mine is at I would say about 11/16 of a turn.
Quick simple added question - the heat exchanger on this set up is less than 12” x 8”. This is sufficient in a water / air setup? My long range plans include an ARB bumper - how much airflow is needed for this?
TIA!
TIA!
