OPINION NEEDED - 1997 FzJ80 Update: Sliders, Lift, Bumpers...Oh, MY! (1 Viewer)

[DirtyPepper]

Ok, gang!

As some of you know, my rig is wholly stock from 1997 (minus the head unit). Last May, the first update was tires as the old tires were dangerously bad. I updated to simple 265/75r60 Cooper AT tires because I needed to baseline. In the almost year, I've updated the entire cooling system, purchased the Spark plugs, spark plu wires, cap and rotor...they will all be taken care of in the next couple of weeks...I've eliminated all of the electrical gremlins thanks to an Auto Electric shop in Oregon City; I've replaced the windshield gasket to OEM and stopped the water intrusion which was caused by the electrical system issue.

The front knuckle rebuild will be done soon, and everything that goes with that.

So...I'm looking at moving on to either:

Rock sliders
Rear swing out tire carrier by @GGM
Ironman or OME 2" lift (and 285's or 315's - undecided at this point)
Ironman or ARB front bull bumper with winch

I'm doing a moderately slow build...so what would you do first from that list and why?

(And yes I've read through the "If I had to start all over again" thread)

I'm leaning to holding out on the lift as the tires I bought in May don't even have 5k miles on them yet...but I could just sell them after, I guess.

"Well, dude...what do you use your rig for?" you might ask...

Rock crawling isn't my thing unless it's neccessary. I know a lot of people go for the huge tires and climb the rock walls at Moab...that's not for me. I live in the PNW and some of the trails have good sized rocks, but I'm not into looking at a 50' sheer rock wall and trying to go up it...it's just not my thing. I'll look at that rock wall and find a way around it. I respect it and I have fun being the passenger, but it's just not for me as a driver.
I really enjoy getting into some back areas where other might not be able to...I guess "Overlanding" but that's just deep camping to me and what we did in the 80's as a kid. I'm planning a WABDR run at the end of the summer, as well as Leslie Gulch (these mods aren't required for that), as well as a Black Butte to madras run soon, and a bunch of old forest roads. sliders would be good protection, yes, but the lift would give me more clearance. The swing out would move the tire away from being underneath.

Thoughts? Opinions? Pics of your set up would be awesome also!


Pic of my '97 for reference...

 

[Francis K]

If money is no object nor is resale value and you don't mind waiting on parts and work, also dealing with the issues that diverting from stock will entail then do as you wish.

If not and you're not going to be doing anything aggressive just do the absolute bare minimum and call it good. The deeper you go down the rabbit hole unless it's for an actual purpose the less you will enjoy your truck, it will become a burden more than a hobby and source of enjoyment. That is my experience at least...

Edit: If you're really intent on a build and your truck as it sits is stock and in good shape I would sell it and buy one more suitable to beating up. Again just my opinion as someone who just dumped a silly amount of money into a truck...

 

[DirtyPepper]

If money is no object nor is resale value and you don't mind waiting on parts and work, also dealing with the issues that diverting from stock will entail then do as you wish.

If not and you're not going to be doing anything aggressive just do the absolute bare minimum and call it good. The deeper you go down the rabbit hole unless it's for an actual purpose the less you will enjoy your truck, it will become a burden more than a hobby and source of enjoyment. That is my experience at least...

Edit: If you're really intent on a build and your truck as it sits is stock and in good shape I would sell it and buy one more suitable to beating up. Again just my opinion as someone who just dumped a silly amount of money into a truck...

Thanks for the reply. Money IS an object and I'm doing a slow build, or rather, want to. I've had her seven years now and the PO didn't take care of her other than the engine itself. Some small maintenance items; she runs super smooth and like a sewing machine...but it was everything else.

If I don't go the route of a lift, I'll definitely get the OEM springs and get SOME height back after 25 years of weight and sagging, along with some really good shocks. I definitely want to set up the rear tire carrier though.

Like I mentioned, mostly just wanting to get deep into some areas that I did when I was a kid in the early 80's and get into places where I won't see a lot of people.


Thanks.,

 

[ZCissner]

Sliders, then front bumper, then rear bumper, then lift.

 

[leonard_nemoy]

Sliders, front bumper, lift, rear bumper, bigger tires including a 5th matched spare for the rear swingout.

Or just leave it stock and stay out of the rocks.......

 

[Devils Paw 80]

I would do sliders and nothing else, then see how it goes. Or just leave it stock.

 

[SxyLxy]

Given the springs are that old I would do the suspension first as any front or rear bumper will add more weight to the respective end of the vehicle. Then since you want to go where others have difficulty a front bumper and winch would be necessary. If you are doing the tire carrier from GGM it may make sense to go ahead and do a rear bumper with swingout. There are several options that wont break the bank.

 

[Roketdriver]

I have a very similar intended use for my 80 - go to cool places but not do the really extreme trails.

After getting stuck for the first time without the ability to self-extract, a winch and bumper became my top priority and were my first major mod.

Instead of going with the rear swingout for the spare, I installed the Wits End tire leveling kit: 80 Series Tire Leveling Kit - https://absolute-wits-end.com/80-series-tire-leveling-kit/

I refreshed my suspension with the OME stock-heavy kit and added sliders at the same time. This happened about a year after the bumper and winch install.

If I were to start again from scratch, I probably would do suspension first. My saggy springs and a trunk full of gear resulted in a lot of trailer hitch slaps on trails I would consider very mild.

 

[DirtyPepper]

I have a very similar intended use for my 80 - go to cool places but not do the really extreme trails.

After getting stuck for the first time without the ability to self-extract, a winch and bumper became my top priority and were my first major mod.

Instead of going with the rear swingout for the spare, I installed the Wits End tire leveling kit: 80 Series Tire Leveling Kit - https://absolute-wits-end.com/80-series-tire-leveling-kit/

I refreshed my suspension with the OME stock-heavy kit and added sliders at the same time. This happened about a year after the bumper and winch install.

If I were to start again from scratch, I probably would do suspension first. My saggy springs and a trunk full of gear resulted in a lot of trailer hitch slaps on trails I would consider very mild.

Thanks for the reply!
And I like that leveling kit...sadly, it's unavailable via Wits End.

When you did your suspension, did a shop update it or did you do it yourself?


Thanks,

 

[jpoole]

Have you lived with a rear, swing-out tire carrier? If you are on the fence regarding tire size I recommend you consider staying at 285s/33s and keeping the spare in the stock location. Larger tires and swingouts/carriers look cool but do have a number of relevant down-sides in my opinion. The rear tire carrier will get dirty quickly from dust/spray and then require management (open/close/make sure doesn't swing unintentionally, etc.) every time you need to access the rear cargo area. If I can avoid it I won't have a rig with a rear tire carrier again as I've found them pretty annoying when I've had them in the past.

As you creep into larger tires and lifts the work required to dial the truck back in grows increasingly, as you know. If you don't know for sure that the larger tires/lift are what you want then to me that's a great indication that you shouldn't commit to them, and the work/costs they require, at this point. Gearing/power, suspension/steering geometry, handling, etc. will all need to be dealt with and you'll be stuck with a higher center of gravity and a vehicle that's harder for passengers to get in and out of. You need to have clear reasons to step into those changes in my opinion.

On my '97 I added step sliders, 33's and stowed a moderate selection of tools, spares and recovery gear in the tailgate/rear quarter panels, including a decently strong comealong. For me it's pretty well dialed in and plenty capable. Importantly, the way it's setup has not compromised how well the 80 works the way that it gets used most of the time which is as a family hauler on various adventures.

 

[Roketdriver]

Thanks for the reply!
And I like that leveling kit...sadly, it's unavailable via Wits End.

When you did your suspension, did a shop update it or did you do it yourself?


Thanks,

D'oh, I missed that it wasn't in stock

I did the suspension myself, watched a bunch of YouTube videos before tackling it. Timmy the Toolman did a good job explaining everything. In the week leading up to the work I doused all the hardware with penetrating oil daily. Had no problems doing the whole thing myself, with the exception of asking a buddy to hold the strap wrench on the shocks during reassembly.

 

[jpoole]

Raising the spare is an easy diy. Here are a few, of many, threads that include pics/info on how folks have done this in the past:

• FJ/FZJ80 Spare tire lift (5" the easy way) - https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/fj-fzj80-spare-tire-lift-5-the-easy-way.778554/
• spare tire mod - https://forum.ih8mud.com/threads/spare-tire-mod.128637/

 

[CrabCake]

I see that a lot of others said sliders first, but honestly that would be late on the build list for me (and was). If you aren't crawling, and the side steps aren't dragging, they really won't do much for you. As a classic VW/Audi performance head myself prior to the 80, suspension should always be first. You'll be amazed at what a fresh set of OEM quality springs and shocks will do to a 25+ year old rig...these are heavy and it most definitely has lost some height over the years and the shocks just wear out. I feel that the whole idea of mods are to be able to get where you want to go, and if yours does that for you at this point, then I'd go OEM+ quality stuff. As far as the swing out, I'm actually considering taking mine off and mounting inside as it's a real PITA every time you want to access the back end. Mine came with a fantastic Kaymar rear with tire and jerry can swing outs...I do love the look (and the function), but again, if you are always in the back end and haven't had a problem with dragging the spare ever, I'd leave it underneath and just to the raise up mod. For the front end, I have the non-winch ARB from the PO. If a winch is important, I would consider @GGM for the winch mount. With little mods to the bumper, you can have a pretty much hidden system that will work great. I did his plate with extremely minor mods to mine and love it, saving be $$ on a whole new bumper setup.

Long story short, if you don't need the lift I'd start with a high quality OEM style spring and shock setup, probably from OME. Along with that, replace all of the bushings in the front and rear bars & radius arms with OEM parts (stay away from poly). If after that you really want to bump up just a little in tire size, I'd go with 20mm spring spacers all around, or at least to balance your rig out based on normal load. Hope this helps!

For mine, I have a 2" OME lift with 1" front spacer, Delta front and rear components, and 315's and it just punished the WVA hills, rocks, and mud this past weekend, exactly what I wanted to do with it and kept up with and even out performed 3 well built 200's.

 

[DirtyPepper]

I see that a lot of others said sliders first, but honestly that would be late on the build list for me (and was). If you aren't crawling, and the side steps aren't dragging, they really won't do much for you. As a classic VW/Audi performance head myself prior to the 80, suspension should always be first. You'll be amazed at what a fresh set of OEM quality springs and shocks will do to a 25+ year old rig...these are heavy and it most definitely has lost some height over the years and the shocks just wear out. I feel that the whole idea of mods are to be able to get where you want to go, and if yours does that for you at this point, then I'd go OEM+ quality stuff. As far as the swing out, I'm actually considering taking mine off and mounting inside as it's a real PITA every time you want to access the back end. Mine came with a fantastic Kaymar rear with tire and jerry can swing outs...I do love the look (and the function), but again, if you are always in the back end and haven't had a problem with dragging the spare ever, I'd leave it underneath and just to the raise up mod. For the front end, I have the non-winch ARB from the PO. If a winch is important, I would consider @GGM for the winch mount. With little mods to the bumper, you can have a pretty much hidden system that will work great. I did his plate with extremely minor mods to mine and love it, saving be $$ on a whole new bumper setup.

Long story short, if you don't need the lift I'd start with a high quality OEM style spring and shock setup, probably from OME. Along with that, replace all of the bushings in the front and rear bars & radius arms with OEM parts (stay away from poly). If after that you really want to bump up just a little in tire size, I'd go with 20mm spring spacers all around, or at least to balance your rig out based on normal load. Hope this helps!

For mine, I have a 2" OME lift with 1" front spacer, Delta front and rear components, and 315's and it just punished the WVA hills, rocks, and mud this past weekend, exactly what I wanted to do with it and kept up with and even out performed 3 well built 200's.

Yes!

 

[ceylonfj40nut]

2.5” lift, sliders, 33” tires. It has taken me everywhere I want to go. Most trails in CO and more. Not into hard rock garden wheeling. Have not needed more.

 

[DirtyPepper]

I see that a lot of others said sliders first, but honestly that would be late on the build list for me (and was). If you aren't crawling, and the side steps aren't dragging, they really won't do much for you. As a classic VW/Audi performance head myself prior to the 80, suspension should always be first. You'll be amazed at what a fresh set of OEM quality springs and shocks will do to a 25+ year old rig...these are heavy and it most definitely has lost some height over the years and the shocks just wear out. I feel that the whole idea of mods are to be able to get where you want to go, and if yours does that for you at this point, then I'd go OEM+ quality stuff. As far as the swing out, I'm actually considering taking mine off and mounting inside as it's a real PITA every time you want to access the back end. Mine came with a fantastic Kaymar rear with tire and jerry can swing outs...I do love the look (and the function), but again, if you are always in the back end and haven't had a problem with dragging the spare ever, I'd leave it underneath and just to the raise up mod. For the front end, I have the non-winch ARB from the PO. If a winch is important, I would consider @GGM for the winch mount. With little mods to the bumper, you can have a pretty much hidden system that will work great. I did his plate with extremely minor mods to mine and love it, saving be $$ on a whole new bumper setup.

Long story short, if you don't need the lift I'd start with a high quality OEM style spring and shock setup, probably from OME. Along with that, replace all of the bushings in the front and rear bars & radius arms with OEM parts (stay away from poly). If after that you really want to bump up just a little in tire size, I'd go with 20mm spring spacers all around, or at least to balance your rig out based on normal load. Hope this helps!

For mine, I have a 2" OME lift with 1" front spacer, Delta front and rear components, and 315's and it just punished the WVA hills, rocks, and mud this past weekend, exactly what I wanted to do with it and kept up with and even out performed 3 well built 200's.

"You had my curiosity, now you have my attention..."
Also, nice to see another Audi fan. I'm a former one. Still love them but damn, are they expensive to run. I had a 95 (IIRC) 100S and then a 1999 Audi A8...loved them both, especially the A8. My daily is now a 2011 Avalon Limited and honestly, it's a lot more comfortable than what I had in the A8...but, it's also a decade newer.

Anyway...Ok, so...OEM springs...go OME and NOT toyota? Wouldn't toyota be the better option being OEM? Also, good to know about the bushings and such...I'll put that nugget on my spreadsheet.

The bumper I go back and forth on to be honest but watching someone make an illegal turn in front of my dad's 80 series and killing the rig, and watching others go through the same thing, I want that protection.

@GGM makes some amazing stuff...I'm looking forward to getting some.

 

[DirtyPepper]

2.5” lift, sliders, 33” tires. It has taken me everywhere I want to go. Most trails in CO and more. Not into hard rock garden wheeling. Have not needed more.

I definitely like the look of the 35's but I don't think I'll need anything more than the 33's.

I have some friends living in CO and I'd love to come out and see them and bring my rig. I've seen some amazing videos of trails out there for exactly what I want to do.

 

[CrabCake]

"You had my curiosity, now you have my attention..."
Also, nice to see another Audi fan. I'm a former one. Still love them but damn, are they expensive to run. I had a 95 (IIRC) 100S and then a 1999 Audi A8...loved them both, especially the A8. My daily is now a 2011 Avalon Limited and honestly, it's a lot more comfortable than what I had in the A8...but, it's also a decade newer.

Anyway...Ok, so...OEM springs...go OME and NOT toyota? Wouldn't toyota be the better option being OEM? Also, good to know about the bushings and such...I'll put that nugget on my spreadsheet.

The bumper I go back and forth on to be honest but watching someone make an illegal turn in front of my dad's 80 series and killing the rig, and watching others go through the same thing, I want that protection.

@GGM makes some amazing stuff...I'm looking forward to getting some.

For the suspension, really your choice, but I'm very happy with the OME setup and think that the OEM level option would be a great choice. That said, OEM is great too.

Now for the Audi bit, if you know, you know.... Absolutely insane for a 2003 production year especially with the tune...that said, if I every have a rollover, I'll be much happier at 6 mph instead of 160! Sold this to fund my 80 and probably forever toy!



For those that don't know, it's a 2003 RS6, fastest production sedan in the world that year...twin turbo v8 pushing 600 whp all wheel drive with the tune...

 

[Roketdriver]

"You had my curiosity, now you have my attention..."
Also, nice to see another Audi fan. I'm a former one. Still love them but damn, are they expensive to run. I had a 95 (IIRC) 100S and then a 1999 Audi A8...loved them both, especially the A8. My daily is now a 2011 Avalon Limited and honestly, it's a lot more comfortable than what I had in the A8...but, it's also a decade newer.

Anyway...Ok, so...OEM springs...go OME and NOT toyota? Wouldn't toyota be the better option being OEM? Also, good to know about the bushings and such...I'll put that nugget on my spreadsheet.

The bumper I go back and forth on to be honest but watching someone make an illegal turn in front of my dad's 80 series and killing the rig, and watching others go through the same thing, I want that protection.

@GGM makes some amazing stuff...I'm looking forward to getting some.

If additional weight is in the future, go with Old Man Emu or similar. My understanding is that the spring and shock rates are designed with heavy accessories in mind.

Before:

After:

For scale reference, I run a 265/75/16 size tire.

 

[DirtyPepper]

If additional weight is in the future, go with Old Man Emu or similar. My understanding is that the spring and shock rates are designed with heavy accessories in mind.

Before:
View attachment 3278946

After:
View attachment 3278947

For scale reference, I run a 265/75/16 size tire.

That’s the same size tire I’m running currently…Cooper Adventurer

Great reference shots, thanks!