Oil Separator.......wow! (1 Viewer)

[flintknapper]

Put an Oil Separator on my 80 series after having the intake halves off and seeing how filthy they were.

I've only put 250 miles on the engine since then and while checking under the hood this morning noticed that it had already collected a fair amount of oil. In fact, much more than I would have thought would be there with so little mileage. Hate to think how much of this stuff has been going through the intake the last 23 years and 316K miles.

Maybe it doesn't hurt anything.....I don't know, but I can't see how it would help. Glad I put the separator on there. Going to look at my 100 series and see if its feasible there too.

 

[80t0ylc]

How much oil does your 80 use between oil changes? Just curious

 

[flintknapper]

How much oil does your 80 use between oil changes? Just curious

I really can't say yet. I've just recently had the head off and replaced the valve guide seals and also attended to some other leaks (Dizzy O-Ring, Valve Cover Gasket, Front Main, Oil Pump Cover, Low Oil Sensor Gasket).

I'll just have to keep checking my oil level to see how much of the 'bleeding' I've stopped. Most of my oil loss prior to this work was from leaks.

Until I get some more miles on it....I don't have any data, sorry.

 

[Rwhat]

Just a heads up. Be very careful you don’t over tighten the drain screw. It will cause the plastic housing to crack and leak.

 

[LandLocked93]

Just went thru my TB, VC, and PCV hosing too. Adding one of these today for the first trail run since the work. Strangely excited to see what's caught.

 

[clx16]

Do you mind including details on the separator you used and the additional hose? I am sure others (maybe even me) could use that info.

 

[flintknapper]

Do you mind including details on the separator you used and the additional hose? I am sure others (maybe even me) could use that info.

Separator is the JEGS version:

JEGS 52205: Air Oil & Water Separator [4 1/2 in. Height x 1 3/4 in. Diameter] - JEGS

air oil separator, oil separator, in line air oil separator, in-line air oil separator

www.jegs.com

Hose and fittings you use will depend where you choose to mount the unit.

I was able to use the OEM PCV hose for mine and a couple of 45° barb fittings on the Oil Separator. But where you mount the unit will dictate how you need to route your hoses, how long they will need to be and what shape (if any).

 

[Rifleman]

I like the idea of the oil Separator you installed, but I'd like to offer up one suggestion. I'd see if i couldn't come up with some way to drain the oil that collects in that cup back into the engine. Otherwise i have a feeling you'll be emptying out that cup on a VERY regular basis because It's going to fill up quickly.

 

[Feistl]

It’s actually better/easier to drain into a container that can be subsequently drained at service time.

The problem with draining back into the sump is the increased air pressure from blowby can actually cause airflow to push the oil you’ve collected back into the intake. You should probably try and run a check valve to stop this, although that ads more points of failure.

Finally, apparently it’s not just “oil” you’re catching, but a mix of some pretty nasty chemicals as a result of incomplete combustion getting through as blowby... that can contaminate the oil and cause it to break down.

Assume you’re engine is “relatively” healthy, you shouldn’t get that much oil going through the breathers. Losing say 200-500ml over 10,000km (service interval) shouldn’t be that big a deal, but if you’re using a lot more than that it’s probably time to overhaul the engine.

Cheers

 

[ARB777]

Installed an oil separator as well but i got the harbor freight one. At the bottom of my plastic cup has some sort of spring loaded drain. I was losing oil quite significantly prior to this but lately i havent since installing the oil separator. I noticed that the spring loaded drain is too weak for the suction that the intake causes thus letting some air in. Looks like its sucking air instead of oil. Does yours have a drain at the bottom?

 

[LandLocked93]

Assume you’re engine is “relatively” healthy, you shouldn’t get that much oil going through the breathers. Losing say 200-500ml over 10,000km (service interval) shouldn’t be that big a deal, but if you’re using a lot more than that it’s probably time to overhaul the engine.

Cheers

So having a can provides another engine health monitor of sorts? That can't be bad. FWIW, I did an mpg run today after I put on the Kobalt separator. Covered 100 miles and checked at the gas station and saw maybe a coupe drops at the bottom? The wool looked evenly coated in oil, so I'll check it again in the morning.

@flintknapper - are you using any other filtration element other than the wool? And is that copper-coated steel or pure copper? (no idea if it makes a diff)
I've seen folk run the wool, or the particulate filter, or both. Does that matter?

@ARB777 - In all cases I think the bottom vent has to be sealed against vacuum in some manner. The nice ones are screw-tight types. This Kobalt required a dollop of RTV (FIPG/gasket gizz) on the external portion of the mechanism to keep the sliding mech from moving. There are many other methods, RTV is just the fastest and cheapest I'd guess. And it can be repeated when necessary. Besides, from what I understand the poly carbonate-bowled separators in this application have a shelf life much shorter than the aluminum cans (more costly) made for this purpose. I figure there's no reason to go all ASPW on it. (4xOverland)

 

[Rifleman]

Finally, apparently it’s not just “oil” you’re catching, but a mix of some pretty nasty chemicals as a result of incomplete combustion getting through as blowby... that can contaminate the oil and cause it to break down.

Blow by comes from combustion gases bypassing the piston rings mixing with, and contaminating the oil in the pan along with condensation. So that oil mist that is collected in that separator cup coming out of the top of the valve cover is being generated in the oil pan. So just a question, please tell me why that oil collected in the separator cup is so much worse and shouldn't be returned to the oil pan when it originated in the pan in the first place?

 

[Feistl]

Because apparently when it’s still hot gas (blowby) it stays as vapour and moves pretty quickly into the top end of the engine, through the breather system and back through the intake being burned off.

Whereas when it goes through a catch can it returns to liquid form (which is what a catch can is designed to do, just for oil vapour) and then mixes with the other oil mist. If you have an “auto drain” back into the sump, this liquid now mixes with oil which can cause the oil to break down slightly and isn’t exactly good for rubber seals etc.

It’s also why long distance driving is good for an engine as opposed to lots of stop/start, as these vapours condense back into liquid when the engine stops... so a long drive doesn’t have as much build up and the extended heat can burn away some of the chemicals from oil.

Have a read up of blowby in regards to sulfuric acids and the potential downsides of catch cans...

Also, it probably depends a lot on the quality of fuel you are using and how worn your piston rings are.

But yeah, basically for the tiny amount of oil you’d be able to “reuse/save” (say 200-500ml) I don’t think it’s worth trying to recycle. A contain to catch and then drain fluid is a better option...

 

[zonker]

I added an oil separator about 4 years ago. After running down my EGR codes and cleaning up the mess within the complete intake tract.. I was all over the separator. I placed an order for an extremely well made unit from Saikou Michi. It has a pretty good capacity for captured oil. Figured I would empty it once a year. After several oil changes I was shocked on how much oil drained out. Probably a good 8oz or one cup. Now I attend to it every oil change. Also removed the intake hose and used a scope to look into the upper intake and after 30k miles and it is spotless. No more EGR carbon mixing with oil! Here is a link to the Saikou Michi design..

Saikou Michi Co. Design

 

[fz1boxer]

I get about 1/4 cup every 1200 miles

 

[flintknapper]

Installed an oil separator as well but i got the harbor freight one. At the bottom of my plastic cup has some sort of spring loaded drain. I was losing oil quite significantly prior to this but lately i havent since installing the oil separator. I noticed that the spring loaded drain is too weak for the suction that the intake causes thus letting some air in. Looks like its sucking air instead of oil. Does yours have a drain at the bottom?

Yes it drains from the bottom. There is a knurled brass screw that is threaded into the bottom of the catch basin. It has a rubber seal on the inside. You simply turn it one direction and it allows the fluid to drain out, then shut it off by tightening it back up.

 

[mikedamageinc]

You really should run a bigger one, those little ones fill up too quick (as you started to see). The amount isn't necessarily an indication of health, different engines are just different. You won't really notice a difference but less oil in the combustion chamber means more fuel/air and usually can get more timing and make better use of premium fuel. Of course intake stays cleaner too.

These are a great idea on any car, I put one on every car I own. The OEMs are even starting to put them on some performance cars, I know the Camaro 1le's have one. Best bang for the buck is the Mike Norris can, great quality for great price but they are getting hard to find.

 

[Rifleman]

Because apparently when it’s still hot gas (blowby) it stays as vapour and moves pretty quickly into the top end of the engine, through the breather system and back through the intake being burned off.

Whereas when it goes through a catch can it returns to liquid form (which is what a catch can is designed to do, just for oil vapour) and then mixes with the other oil mist. If you have an “auto drain” back into the sump, this liquid now mixes with oil which can cause the oil to break down slightly and isn’t exactly good for rubber seals etc.

It’s also why long distance driving is good for an engine as opposed to lots of stop/start, as these vapours condense back into liquid when the engine stops... so a long drive doesn’t have as much build up and the extended heat can burn away some of the chemicals from oil.

Have a read up of blowby in regards to sulfuric acids and the potential downsides of catch cans...

Also, it probably depends a lot on the quality of fuel you are using and how worn your piston rings are.

But yeah, basically for the tiny amount of oil you’d be able to “reuse/save” (say 200-500ml) I don’t think it’s worth trying to recycle. A contain to catch and then drain fluid is a better option...

I could perhaps see you're point about not returning the oil to the pan if you were the type of owner who used a cheap grade of motor oil, and didn't change their oil and filter regularly. But if you are the type of owner (like most Mud members) who uses a good quality fully synthetic motor oil, that changes their oil, and filter at regular intervals, i really don't see an issue with returning that oil to the pan. But i guess it all comes down to whatever makes you, as the owner of your truck feel most comfortable.

 

[Rwhat]

The oil/water separator from Harbor Freight is used for compressed air. The spring loaded valve seals under pressure and opens when there is no pressure to self drain.

 

[subzali]

Ref. this thread:

Project Carbon Control!

Hi fellas, wanted to write to share another simple project… When Robbie was working with my motor I was surprised by several things that really revealed how invasive and pervasive carbon contamination is starting with the whole intake system and then continuing through the motor depositing...

forum.ih8mud.com

The PO of my rig added catch cans from Accurate Machine Works. Solid hardware and easy to empty out. Looks like they are sold out now though:

Accurate Machine Works

Accurate Machine Works offers quality, flexibility, and dependability along with product design and consulting, prototype and custom machining and CNC long and short run production.

accmachtech.com