Oil pipes popping all over the place after new alternator (oil vacuum pump) (1 Viewer)

[nomadtribe]

Well, this happened twice; oil pipes popped and engine hosed down. I promised myself this is not happening a third time

I replaced my alternator in my LJ78 (1991 - 2LTE) with a new one. This is fitted with an oil vacuum pump.

At the same time, I also decided to fix all the oil leaks I could find. Happy to say that there are no more oil leaks (apart from the popping oil pipes)

The first time it popped, it pulled of the connector near the brake booster. I did not notice it until about 4 min after running the engine. Basically lost 2.5 liters of oil.

After adding a new hose clamp, it popped at the alternator connector.

Taking into account that oil was pumping out of the top hose near the booster, I take the vacuum pump is operating as expected and taking oil from the engine and pumping it through to the booster (?) Is this correct?

There is another electrical pump (I think) just under the booster that connects the pipe from the alternator to the booster. Can this be faulty? I have a red arrow pointing to it in the photo.

I have attached a few photos after the second engine bay cleanup.

Your wisdom will be greatly appreciated.

 

[Felde]

Hi

Sorry, but I don'tget this whole story ...

Taking into account that oil was pumping out of the top hose near the booster, I take the vacuum pump is operating as expected and taking oil from the engine and pumping it through to the booster (?) Is this correct?

Normally not! As per my best knowledge, the boosters are operated by air vakuum, not by oil pressure!
That's why vakuum lines usually don't pop (because there is no positive pressure on them but negative air pressure (vakuum)).

There is another electrical pump (I think) just under the booster that connects the pipe from the alternator to the booster. Can this be faulty? I have a red arrow pointing to it in the photo.

I can't clearly see it. Does it have electrical connectors at all? If its connected to the vakuum system with some hoses, it might either be a vakuum reservoir (used to stabilize the vakuum and provide more volume to match the boosters' volume) or a diaphragm vakuum switch (which then would have wires on it). It's unlikely to be a pump.

To my knowledge, the vakuum pump on the alternator is attached to the oil circuit for its own lubrication only. Its not supposed to pump oil.

Stupid question: Are you sure this is a vakuum pump and not an external oil pump? Is it installed correctly?
Hopefully you didn't accidentally flood your vakuum system with oil..

 

[jmylie]

The vacuum pump does have oil inlet and outlet hoses. However, the schematic on partsouq does not show where they connect.

This may not be 100% correct for your engine but maybe it will help:

VACUUM PUMP | Toyota LAND CRUISER LJ77LV-MNXW BJ73,LJ7#,RJ7#,HZJ7#,PZJ7#,KZJ7# | Parts Catalogs | PartSouq

If you are looking for VACUUM PUMP Parts for Toyota LAND CRUISER LJ77LV-MNXW BJ73,LJ7#,RJ7#,HZJ7#,PZJ7#,KZJ7# then we advise you to pay attention to the range of our spare parts catalog for Toyota!

partsouq.com

 

[nomadtribe]

Thank you for the feedback.

I have switched the two pipes on the vacuum pump head... Not good.

Now to figure out how bad the damage is. Will check all vacuum hoses and see where the oil got too. I take WD-40 and a compressor should help tp clean the oil from the vacuum system?

 

[Felde]

Here is a pic from the repair manual. It's my BJ73 manual, but it appears to be quite similar.

The pipe-style outlet is the oil outlet. (Also to be seen from part 29300B on the parts diagram: Hose oil outlet).
The vakuum side has a union and bolt on top of the check valve.

 

[nomadtribe]

Here is a pic from the repair manual. It's my BJ73 manual, but it appears to be quite similar.
View attachment 2851419
The pipe-style outlet is the oil outlet. (Also to be seen from part 29300B on the parts diagram: Hose oil outlet).
The vakuum side has a union and bolt on top of the check valve.

Thank you!

 

[Felde]

Outsh. Just saw your post. That's bad.
Don't apply more fluid whatsoever and don't apply high air pressure without having opened the system! The vakuum system is normally sealed off (except for some dedicated, but little vents opened occasionally on operation of the devices). Pressure can't go anywhere and will just blow-up things.
I guess, you need to take the entire vakuum system apart. The vakuum reservoirs will be flooded and full of oil. No way to flush or blow those empty. Need to be tipped and poured out. What worries me most are the diaphragms and vents. Brake booster for sure and do you also have a Clutch booster?
The vakuum system may also be attached to the fuel injection system, 4WD Tcase (in case being 'electric switch' style) and some other components.
All working with diaphragms designed to be 'sucked' by a dry vakuum, not pushed by wet oil at comparably high pressure. Maybe those have ripped?
Taking those apart is complex.
Experts advice is needed here. Maybe @OGBeno or @cruiserdan can comment?
Good luck
Ralf

 

[nomadtribe]

Started pulling off all the pipes this morning from the alternator to the brake booster. Basically one pipe running through that is connected to the PNC as shown in the photo (orange circle). No oil in the booster pipe from the PNC to the booster (top pipe). I take this is good news. Also removed other smaller vacuum pipes from the alternator and no oil in them.

What is the role of the PNC? Seems like an electric solenoid / vapor detector?

Is it possible to clean the PNC out? I used a straw to blow some of the oil out (bottom pipe on the PNC).

 

[nomadtribe]

Outsh. Just saw your post. That's bad.
Don't apply more fluid whatsoever and don't apply high air pressure without having opened the system! The vakuum system is normally sealed off (except for some dedicated, but little vents opened occasionally on operation of the devices). Pressure can't go anywhere and will just blow-up things.
I guess, you need to take the entire vakuum system apart. The vakuum reservoirs will be flooded and full of oil. No way to flush or blow those empty. Need to be tipped and poured out. What worries me most are the diaphragms and vents. Brake booster for sure and do you also have a Clutch booster?
The vakuum system may also be attached to the fuel injection system, 4WD Tcase (in case being 'electric switch' style) and some other components.
All working with diaphragms designed to be 'sucked' by a dry vakuum, not pushed by wet oil at comparably high pressure. Maybe those have ripped?
Taking those apart is complex.
Experts advice is needed here. Maybe @OGBeno or @cruiserdan can comment?
Good luck
Ralf

Thank you. Have posted below some more info. Small vacuum running to top intake pipe. No clutch booster pipe.

 

[Felde]

84-01 refers to a different diagram in the parts catalogue: 8401: SWITCH & RELAY & COMPUTER
PNC is a specific parts position on that diagram. 83390 is 'SWITCH ASSY, VACUUM WARNING' it says there:

SWITCH & RELAY & COMPUTER | Toyota LAND CRUISER LJ77LV-MNXW BJ73,LJ7#,RJ7#,HZJ7#,PZJ7#,KZJ7# | Parts Catalogs | PartSouq

If you are looking for SWITCH & RELAY & COMPUTER Parts for Toyota LAND CRUISER LJ77LV-MNXW BJ73,LJ7#,RJ7#,HZJ7#,PZJ7#,KZJ7# then we advise you to pay attention to the range of our spare parts catalog for Toyota!

partsouq.com

That one will have a little spring and diaphragm in it to translate the vacuum into a movement to operate a switch. Not likely it can be undone. Clean it to the best possible extend and test it. I wouldn't use aggressive solvents like brake cleaner or wd40 on things like that, as the diaphragms are quite sensitive.
You may get a manual vacuum pump somewhere to test items like this: dismount the item from the system and apply some vacuum manually. Check function (e.g. switch should switch).

44740 is a vakuum reservoir assy, one of those I was talking about. There may be some more of those around. Basically an empty tin that provides volume. I guess its save to clean those using brake cleaner. The metal will stand that. On the rubber hoses, Im not that sure.

Use the detail picture to identify what else is attached to that reservoir.
Maybe you are lucky and the hose popped from the reservoir before oil made it into the booster. Also because the booster is a dead end. But a unusual high pressure in the wrong direction was applied by the oil, though. You will see whether it suffered any damage once you test the booster.

Use the clickable parts numbers in the catalogue to identify part names. Also handy to identify what else is attached to the vakuum system.

I would suggest to work your way along the vacuum lines, starting at the alternator/ vacuum pump and see where the oil went (or not), like you already started.
Good luck again.

 

[nomadtribe]

84-01 refers to a different diagram in the parts catalogue: 8401: SWITCH & RELAY & COMPUTER
PNC is a specific parts position on that diagram. 83390 is 'SWITCH ASSY, VACUUM WARNING' it says there:

SWITCH & RELAY & COMPUTER | Toyota LAND CRUISER LJ77LV-MNXW BJ73,LJ7#,RJ7#,HZJ7#,PZJ7#,KZJ7# | Parts Catalogs | PartSouq

If you are looking for SWITCH & RELAY & COMPUTER Parts for Toyota LAND CRUISER LJ77LV-MNXW BJ73,LJ7#,RJ7#,HZJ7#,PZJ7#,KZJ7# then we advise you to pay attention to the range of our spare parts catalog for Toyota!

partsouq.com

That one will have a little spring and diaphragm in it to translate the vacuum into a movement to operate a switch. Not likely it can be undone. Clean it to the best possible extend and test it. I wouldn't use aggressive solvents like brake cleaner or wd40 on things like that, as the diaphragms are quite sensitive.
You may get a manual vacuum pump somewhere to test items like this: dismount the item from the system and apply some vacuum manually. Check function (e.g. switch should switch).

44740 is a vakuum reservoir assy, one of those I was talking about. There may be some more of those around. Basically an empty tin that provides volume. I guess its save to clean those using brake cleaner. The metal will stand that. On the rubber hoses, Im not that sure.

Use the detail picture to identify what else is attached to that reservoir.
Maybe you are lucky and the hose popped from the reservoir before oil made it into the booster. Also because the booster is a dead end. But a unusual high pressure in the wrong direction was applied by the oil, though. You will see whether it suffered any damage once you test the booster.

Use the clickable parts numbers in the catalogue to identify part names. Also handy to identify what else is attached to the vakuum system.

I would suggest to work your way along the vacuum lines, starting at the alternator/ vacuum pump and see where the oil went (or not), like you already started.
Good luck again.

Thank you. Greatly appreciate the feedback.

 

[jblueridge]

On my BJ74, there is a dashboard light that comes on if there trouble with the brakes.
Any of these 3 things makes that light come on:
1. parking brake is on
2. fluid in brake master cylinder is low
3. vacuum is absent or weak in that vacuum reservoir 44740. That’s why it has an electrical switch on it.

When I need to get oil off parts that are plastic or rubber, I use electronics spray cleaner.
It might still damage rubber but I have never had trouble with it.
cleaner

It might be that the small diameter of the vacuum pipes and the system being “closed” or airtight caused the rubber hoses to pop off before the oil flowed through the tubing.

 

[nomadtribe]

On my BJ74, there is a dashboard light that comes on if there trouble with the brakes.
Any of these 3 things makes that light come on:
1. parking brake is on
2. fluid in brake master cylinder is low
3. vacuum is absent or weak in that vacuum reservoir 44740. That’s why it has an electrical switch on it.

When I need to get oil off parts that are plastic or rubber, I use electronics spray cleaner.
It might still damage rubber but I have never had trouble with it.
cleaner

It might be that the small diameter of the vacuum pipes and the system being “closed” or airtight caused the rubber hoses to pop off before the oil flowed through the tubing.

Thank you.

 

[nomadtribe]

Thank you all for the advise. I can repot all is good!