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Oil and Motors

Discussion in '80-Series Tech' started by landtoy80, Oct 22, 2003.

  1. landtoy80

    landtoy80

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    With all the oil talk here, is oil really the killer of the Toyota engine???
    A Toyota truck/LC will run well over 200k mi with just changing the oil.
    A nonToyota US made engine with the best oil is lucky to see 150k (on average, my guess)
    Most owners use the Pennzcrap or what is cheapest at the LubechangeMartstore.
    My motor has the mark of Penn form the PO. It is a film that you can scrap off with a knife, but it still runs like new at 231k mi.

    That being said what is the killer of the 80 engine??? Head gasket,bad injection (running lean), running out of oil,coolant???
     
  2. Junk

    Junk

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    Based on my record, it must be the driver. :'(
     
  3. landtoy80

    landtoy80

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    I forgot to add JUNK to the list of motor killers :doh:
     
  4. Jonathan_Ferguson

    Jonathan_Ferguson ★ is in the wrong locale SILVER Star

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    All Toyota Diesel Engines Should get close to 1,000,000km and should easily get over that if mainly used on the Highway with basic Servicing.

    All Engines regarless of where they're made should reach 500,000km with out any problems with just the basic Servicing.

    The main killer of current Landcruisers is rust: Such as most of the Mines in Australia and Papua New Guinea change over their 78 and 79 Series every 3 years and never do any maintenance as the rust will kill it before it's necessary. - The usual Modifications are just a Roll Cage, Mine Rated Suspension and a Donaldson Pre-cleaner.
     
  5. landtoy80

    landtoy80

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  6. Jonathan_Ferguson

    Jonathan_Ferguson ★ is in the wrong locale SILVER Star

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  7. Big_Moose

    Big_Moose

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    500,000 kilometers equals 310,685.6 miles.
     
  8. landtoy80

    landtoy80

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    I don't think many vehicles in the US ever see 500K or 310,685.6 mi even with a new motor or twooo
     
  9. cary

    cary

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    [quote author=landtoy80 link=board=2;threadid=6644;start=msg54058#msg54058 date=1066875952]

    Most owners use the Pennzcrap or what is cheapest at the LubechangeMartstore.
    My motor has the mark of Penn form the PO. It is a film that you can scrap off with a knife, but it still runs like new at 231k mi.

    [/quote]

    Thats not from the Pennzoil, but not changing the oil enough. FYI, Pennzoil is a very good oil nowdays, for years they had problems with crud but their new Purebase oil has turned in great UOA number and shown to be top notch (other best mineral oils are from Chevron, Valvoline is rather weak now).

    What kills the motors- Combination of factors- Normal wear, abuse, how driven, where driven, maintence.

    I will reiterate, I like Synthetic motor oils. If you want to change your oil every 5000-7500 use synthetics. If you are stuck on the 3000-4000 mile oil changes, use mineral oil, you won't see the benifit of synthetics. The problem is that many owners end up changing Mineral oil at anything from 7500 to 15,000 miles, and that will shorten motor life.

    Cary
     
  10. cruiserdan

    cruiserdan SupportingVendor Emeritus Moderator

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    Cary,

    Please expand on Valvoline's decline. I've been a Valvoline guy since Christ was a corporal. Does this old dog need a new trick?


    D-
     
  11. hfpieratt

    hfpieratt

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    I'm new to TLC FJ80 ownership.

    For what it's worth, my brother is a crew member of a Nascar team #77 and he tells me that regardless of the cars sponsorship every single Nascar team uses Mobil 1 fully synthetic oil in every one of their motors. If it is the Pennzoil car and they are required to put in Pennzoil motor oil they leave the drain plug open and pour it right through to the oil pan and then plug it up and fill with Mobil 1. I believe him.

    I personally believe, sorry I'm not a mechanic, that Fram oil filters are unequalled. I have heard horror stories about other brand filters and how they restrict the flow of oil running in a motor.
     
  12. Shortbus

    Shortbus

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    [quote author=cruiserdan link=board=2;threadid=6644;start=msg54284#msg54284 date=1066923632]
    Cary,

    Please expand on Valvoline's decline. I've been a Valvoline guy since Christ was a corporal. Does this old dog need a new trick?


    D-
    [/quote]

    Ditto!! Hope Valvoline hasn't gone down the tubes. :doh: The cruiser is new to me, and I was kinda thinking about using Valvoline Durablend in it. Flamesuit on....
     
  13. Beowulf

    Beowulf

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    hfpieratt,

    >> ... that Fram oil filters are unequalled. <<

    Can you provide us some unbiased resources to substantiate this?

    -B-
     
  14. cary

    cary

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    The Used Oil Analyises (UOAs) of Valvoline All Climate have shown that their additive package is substandard and their wear numbers are higher. In the real world, this probably doesn't make a whole lot of difference, especially if you are sticking with the 3000 mile changes, but there are better mineral oils out there now (Pennzoil and Chevron). It is a shame, because I really liked Valvoline and in talking with their engineers in the past have found them to be very honest and open.

    Fram Filters- Generally Fram is accepted as the last filter to use. Search around the internet for the problems and subpar construction. Some issues 1) Carboard anti-drain valves instead of the industry standard rubber or silicon, 2) crappy filter media, 3) poor filtering qualities, 4) Bypass cuts in too fast.
     
  15. hfpieratt

    hfpieratt

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    >>Can you provide us some unbiased resources to substantiate this?

    Truthfully, no I can't, I won't bullshit you that I know something about FRAM that I don't. I tried to phrase that statement in such a way that I could disclaim it:
    >>>I personally believe, sorry I'm not a mechanic, that Fram oil filters are >>>unequalled.

    My opinion is formed from my experiences with a guy I used to work with that had worked at an oil change place specializing in Valvoline. They used Valvoline oil filters and he told me they were crap and he himself used nothing but FRAM. I was already using FRAM at the time so I have never changed.

    One story was about how somebody had fried their motor shortly after having left his place, they brought it in asking questions and he was put under the car to inspect what may have happened. He said he had to hacksaw the filter to get it off and inside it there was far too much filter material compared to a FRAM. It was his belief that the Valvoline filter had caused the oil to flow too lean throughout the motor and caused it to overheat.

    This was almost 10 years ago, and at the time he told me Pennzoil was just as bad as Valvoline, so I have no comment on whether Pennzoil has 'improved' since then.

    Thanks!!!
     
  16. hfpieratt

    hfpieratt

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    Cary-

    That's the first I have heard about FRAM oil filters being bad. The only bad thing i've heard was from a story that they were difficult to deal with from a business POV. They, the auto parts store people I heard this from, had the idea that FRAM was so well known to be the best in the business that they would often push their weight around in the business world and could not be negotiated with.

    hmmm..... I will look around some more about that on the internet. I will ask my brother what the Nascar guys are using too.
     
  17. cary

    cary

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    [quote author=hfpieratt link=board=2;threadid=6644;start=msg54324#msg54324 date=1066927959]

    One story was about how somebody had fried their motor shortly after having left his place, they brought it in asking questions and he was put under the car to inspect what may have happened. He said he had to hacksaw the filter to get it off and inside it there was far too much filter material compared to a FRAM. It was his belief that the Valvoline filter had caused the oil to flow too lean throughout the motor and caused it to overheat.
    [/quote]

    Consider the source!!!! Let's see here, he just changed the oil but had to hacksaw the filter to get it off!!! Sounds like they had a gorilla wrenching in the pit. There was to much filter media??? Even assuming the filter had clogged, the bypass would have opened. I will suggest two more likely scenarios 1) the oil changer failed to put oil in, or the filter was leaking, he torqued the s*** out of it and it still leaked and pumped the oil out, or 2) the engine was already in trouble and it died.

    Cary
     
  18. cruiserdan

    cruiserdan SupportingVendor Emeritus Moderator

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    Thanks Cary, as my oil rarely goes past 2900 miles, I imagine I have done no harm. I'm curious, I'm running 15/40 All-Fleet. Do the same observations apply?


    D-
     
  19. Shortbus

    Shortbus

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    In ref to Fram filters being junk......

    IMHO, there is a HUGE difference in the build quality of Fram "race" filters, and Frams off the shelf crap. The Fram filters you can buy at Walmart are equal to the quality of Walmarts grub, pure $hit. The filter media is junk, and they'll blow out in an engine that has any substantial oil pressure. On one of my cars, there was actually an advisory I read specifically NOT to use them, because of the flow/pressure blowing the innerds out of the filter.

    On the other hand, I can back up hfpieratt regarding the "race" filters that Fram makes. I have no idea why they build pure crap for the street and excellent stuff for the track, but we used Fram only in all the sprint cars I worked on over the years. Thats on motors that are $45,000 a throw, making 800hp. Never had an issue of any kind.

    If Penn-Soil has changed, that's great. When I was working for Goodyear in the late 80's we had a car come in with a sludge about an inch thick on the "roof" of the valve cover. 1987 Chevy 6cyl with 36k miles. The owner said that he'd only used Penn-Soil since new and that he'd changed it every 4k. I scraped off a sample to show to customers, and put in a clear jar. That jar sat on my service desk for almost 2 years, and the goo never dropped to the bottom. Some nasty stuff. I've always said that I wouldn't put Pennzoil in my lawnmower.

    Looked alot like this... but WAY thicker. [​IMG]

    Filters>>> OEM = excellent (For Toyota that is), Purolator has always been good stuff too.

    Oil>>> Mobil 1 - Redline if cost is not an issue. Prolly Chevron for dino. Sorry to hear about valvoline.

    I'll stop babblin' now... that's my 2 cents. 8)
     
  20. cary

    cary

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    I haven't seen any numbers on the All Fleet. I would suspect it to be a more robust oil with a stronger additive package since it is speced for both Gas and Diesel.