No oil to rocker assembly on rebuilt 71 F motor (1 Viewer)

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Stevepipeman

Stevepipeman

Joined
Aug 29, 2018
Threads
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Location
Tampa, FL
After running my newly rebuilt 71 F motor for its 20 min break in, it's apparent nothing is coming through the oil pipe running through head into the rockers. I fear either the oil passage is clogged or the machine shop may not have properly positioned a cam bearing. I can feed the rockers with an alternate copper oil line, tapped into the discharge of the oil filter housing (currently feeding extra oil pressure gauge), through the rocker cover, into the union connecting the rocker halves. My concern is the cam may not be getting oil at one journal. I've removed the copper oil pipe and snaked it to make sure it's not clogged and it's not. Although the engine didn't run too badly, the rockers were loud which I attributed to adjustment. I couldn't swear the problem didn't pre-exist the rebuild. What do experienced LC builders think or suggest?
 
Sorry to hear about your trouble. Did you rebuild or replace the oil pump? What pressure do you see at the gauge?

I'm just finishing up a rebuild on a similar vintage F engine and it was challenging to get the bearing clearances correct both at the crank and
at the cam. A lot of hand fitting was required to prevent binding. I mention this because I can envision the cam being too tight and spinning a
cam bearing. Aligning the oil holes with the holes in the block was a simple matter of marking the block hole location and matching it up with
the new cam bearing hole. An inspection mirror was essential because you can't directly see the oil holes from below. Hope this helps.
 
Last edited:
flee said:
Sorry to hear about your trouble. Did you rebuild or replace the oil pump? What pressure do you see at the gauge?

I'm just finishing up a rebuild on a similar vintage F engine and it was challenging to get the bearing clearances correct both at the crank and
at the cam. A lot of hand fitting was required to prevent binding. I mention this because I can envision the cam being too tight and spinning a
cam bearing. Aligning the oil holes with the holes in the block was a simple matter of marking the block hole location and matching it up with
the new cam bearing hole. An inspection mirror was essential because you can't directly see the oil holes from below. Hope this helps.
Click to expand...
No, I didn't replace oil pump but have 35 psi @ idle and over 60 @ 2000 rpm. I bench tested it before reinstalling and had good pressure prior to the rebuild. I certainly expected my machine shop to properly install the new cam bearings, but it will take a major failure or disassembly and removal of the cam to prove an oil passage is blocked. I did have major concerns with bearing tolerances, due to what I thought was a tight rotating assembly after I finished assembling the new machined block, head, pistons, cam, lifters and other components. I completely tore the engine down after initial assembly, cleaned everything, bagged and catalogued all parts and paid a reputable shop to check all my tolerances and assemble the rotating assembly. They re-assembled it using every shim, ring and bearing I previously installed and and supplied to them, with no need for replacement. They said the machine shop did an accurate job with bores and journals and any tightness in the crank was in my head. I could kick myself in the ass for not checking the camshaft galleys when I got the block from the machine shop. The damn thing fired right up and runs great with no overheating, noise or smoke, but no oil coming through the rocker pipe.
Thanks much for your input.
 
I am now going to double check that my new cam properly passes oil to the rocker feed tube!
The engine is still on a stand.
 
73FJ40 said:
@Stevepipeman

Did you replace the camshaft? I believe the galley feeding the rocker shaft feeds from a different cam bearing F vs 2F arrangement. "Reputable" replacement camshafts are apparently drilled for both.
Click to expand...
Yes, replaced with a Japanese-made ITM Cam, whether that's a reputable manufacturer is probably debatable. The old cam is drilled through the 2nd cam journal and I can't definitively say I know where the new one is drilled. I'll be contacting ITM tomorrow for that revelation. They obviously changed from the copper pipe to the rocker to a passage in one of rocker supports in the head in the later or 2F motors. What brand of cam did you get?
Thanks again for your reply, it might explain the problem.
 
We got the cam and bearings as a whole kit.
I will check it soon as I can this week.
 
flee said:
We got the cam and bearings as a whole kit.
I will check it soon as I can this week.
Click to expand...
I looked at the detail image of the ITM Cam, and it shows the holes drilled through the 3rd bearing journal, which is not going to work in my 71 1F engine. I checked their catalog and they show the same part number for both a 71 1F and 78 2F, but I'll verify it with them. In that ITM seems to make a fair amount of Land Cruiser engine parts, they need to change their catalogue. It's my fault for not physically comparing the original to the replacement, but it doesn't help when the manufacturer misrepresents the application. I guess I now know what the problem is, thanks to your comments, which will necessitate pulling the cam but ultimately save this engine from an early failure.
 
@Stevepipeman

For the record, attached is a picture of a NOS camshaft drilled for both F and 2F applications. I got this back in 2010 off of EBay. It is clearly new, but it was 'vintage' when I got it. the box said Applied Power and "made in U.S.A."
NOS F-2F Camshaft.jpg
 
73FJ40 said:
@Stevepipeman

For the record, attached is a picture of a NOS camshaft drilled for both F and 2F applications. I got this back in 2010 off of EBay. It is clearly new, but it was 'vintage' when I got it. the box said Applied Power and "made in U.S.A."
View attachment 2477497
Click to expand...
That's exactly what would make this cam work in both 1F and 2F. Thanks for showing one in the flesh.
 
The chicomm camshafts are only drilled for 74-later oiling.

The cam should be only surface hardened. It can be drilled after hitting the drill location with a grinding wheel.
 
FJ40Jim said:
The chicomm camshafts are only drilled for 74-later oiling.

The cam should be only surface hardened. It can be drilled after hitting the drill location with a grinding wheel.
Click to expand...
Before trying any drilling:
I would approach the supplier with the expectation that they should make good with the correct cam to make up for sending the wrong one.
 
I used a carbide tipped drill this is not a difficult thing to do . Yeah you could send it back but you’ll be time and money ahead just taking it to a machine shop and having it done.
 
FJ40Jim said:
The chicomm camshafts are only drilled for 74-later oiling.

The cam should be only surface hardened. It can be drilled after hitting the drill location with a grinding wheel.
Click to expand...
Thanks Jim. Vendor told me to shove camshaft, not their fault.
 
@Stevepipeman

Not to :deadhorse:, but

ITM parts for 1971 Toyota Landcruiser:

Note that ITM's picture of camshaft shows it's drilled in the third bearing location. Merchantability clause in the Uniform Commercial Code? :hmm:
Picture of camshaft:

1603841932098.png
 
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