New '97 FZJ80 owner...HELP with exhaust/failed smog and power loss, please! (1 Viewer)

[meeshatronic]

Hi all,

Totally new here and new owner of a '97 FZJ80, and in the spirit of full disclosure, a complete girly girl and clueless about cars (aside from learning to change the oil in my dad's '82 Mercedes before he'd let me get a driver's license lol).

Recently moved to Denver and decided I needed a bigger and more reliable mountain adventure-mobile than my money pit of an '06 VW Touareg. Researched exhaustively and found a guy selling the FZJ in Chicago for a great deal. Low (115k) miles, complete service records, hardly any rust, so I snatched it up. The owner did mention an exhaust leak and a few cosmetic issues, but for the price I couldn't walk away from it.

Drove it to Denver last month without any issues and am already madly in love with it. Had my mechanic here check out the exhaust leak...turns out there were just a few missing bolts somewhere causing things to rattle. Everything else checked out, aside from a few small engine oil leaks and old hoses that he said were typical for an almost 20 year old car and didn't need immediate attention. Changed oil, new air filter, coolant, replaced some cracked hoses, etc.

Come time to get emissions tested to register in CO (it passed in IL when I had Toyota dealership check it out pre-purchase) and I cannot get the thing to pass!
Check engine light came on, code P0401 for exhaust gas recirculation, and high Co and NOx readings.

Back to mechanic (he's not a dedicated Toyota guy, but I absolutely trust him and his expertise) who gave me two options that MAY fix it, but both would be pricey and couldn't guarantee that either would be the fix:
1) checked EGR system and said all the components tested correctly...but diagnosed intermittent fault with EGR vacuum switching valve(#2) and/or EGR valve when vehicle was hot.
2) faulty catalytic converter causing elevated levels.

He cleaned off a bunch of stuff, cleared the codes, and recommended I drive the car hard for a couple of days to see if codes come back/if it passes emissions one more time before trying either option.

Enter problem #2...
Just took it on a drive up to the mountains and noticed that once I started going up any kind of incline, it completely lost all power to make it up the hill. Odometer never went above 30000rpm, and even while flooring it I couldn't get above 50mph. It's never been great at accelerating quickly or being able to pass cars, but I just chalked it up to switching from a zippy new V8 to an old and heavy Cruiser. This was my first trip with it to the mountains and getting passed by 18 wheelers on a 3% grade, however, seems like a problem.

So, long (very long, I know) story short...I'm wondering if the two issues could be related? I began cruising forums on here about loss of power going up hills and noticed a few people made mention of problems with the exhaust system.

I love my mechanic, but wanted to check with a bunch of Toyota nuts to see if y'all had any thoughts before I take it back to him.
Thanks so much for taking the time to read this...any insight or suggestions you may have would be greatly appreciated!

 

[baldilocks]

Did The CEL illuminate on this slow trip in the mountains? Did you notice the tail pipe making any odd sounds like maybe it was partially stopped up? Sounds like maybe that intermittent VSV may actually be faulty and causing the egr valve to open when it should be closed. EGR is normally closed except when cruising at a constant speed.
Symptoms also point to a clogged catalytic converter but your rig has low low miles.
Now for my best advice, find a mechanic that is familiar with your 80 and accept the fact that you bought a 20 year old truck, which, btw, will become your new addiction! Welcome to Mud.

 

[meeshatronic]

Thanks for the reply-and yes, I'm already completely obsessed!

CEL didn't come on, so I actually drove straight to Emissions to retest and crossed my fingers. Failed again; CO and NOx levels even higher than last time. Moments after driving away, CEL came on and yeah, I did notice sort of a thumping/diesel-ish sound coming from the tail pipe whenever I came to a stop.

 

[MarkM]

If you have it in park and rev the engine, does it shoot up past 3,000 rpm or does it hesitate?

Baldi nailed my first two culprits. If the connectors to the VSV are corroded that can explain it being intermittent, but if it were me I would take off the vacuum modulator valve (sits right next to the EGR near the back of the intake) and test it according to the factory service manual (do a search for FSM and download it: you will refer to it often). I got the 401 code, replaced the VMV, the EGR, and eventually the VSV with all of the vacuum lines to get the EGR working properly again (though my 80 had 265k on it at the time).

I would look at the EGR system first, and then the cat converters.

Let us know, and welcome to the addiction!

 

[Pin_Head]

What are the actual numbers that it blows and the limits for Colorado and under which test conditions? Colorado uses grams per mile and we use parts per million or % here in CA so I have no way of interpreting the Colorado numbers without knowing what the limits are.

 

[lazy]

Yes, post pictures of the tests so we can see what the exact problem is.

My guess is you'll have a hard time passing without first addressing the egr issue, as it is causing your high nox. I'd start with a new modulator....

The high co can be caused by many things. But spraying your maf with the appropriate spray, New cap rotor and wires. I've done this dance twice with air care and out of state fzj80s these past 2 years, and I have not been able to get them to pass without new o2 sensors. Also, check for vacuum leaks, are you getting a little stumble at idle? Checking through the obd2 the fuel trim(ltft) is helpful information as well.

As someone stated, can you get over 3000 rpm with it in park. My guess is your just having an adjustment period with a heavier vehicle and underpowered motor. I have to help the vehicles with shift points. Coming over Vail pass a few weeks ago, I turned off over drive and just took my medicine in the right lane.

 

[meeshatronic]

Hey guys, thanks so much for the feedback!

In park it will rev way up past 3000rpm without any hesitation.

Attached are the readings from my latest (third-ugh) failed smog check. You can see that for CO it's reading at 27.7(state limit is 15.0) and NOx is reading at 3.21(state limit is 3.0). Oddly enough the second emissions check I had done early morning on a not warmed up engine the CO levels passed and only the NOx was slightly elevated. Not sure if that's relevant, but figured I'd mention it.

 

[meeshatronic]

Also, @lazy do you have a good tech you could recommend here in CO? I've got a neighbor who takes his 4Runner to ToyShop in Denver, and have read good things about Slee Off-road up in Golden while trolling the forums on here.
I'm pretty handy with most things, and part of my reasons for wanting another old Toyota was to have a car I could fix myself if needed (starting a business = I've got more time than money at the moment) and would love to grab the repair manual and learn...but I'm guessing all this EGR business is well above total newbie level!

 

[MarkM]

Also, @lazy do you have a good tech you could recommend here in CO? I've got a neighbor who takes his 4Runner to ToyShop in Denver, and have read good things about Slee Off-road up in Golden while trolling the forums on here.
I'm pretty handy with most things, and part of my reasons for wanting another old Toyota was to have a car I could fix myself if needed (starting a business = I've got more time than money at the moment) and would love to grab the repair manual and learn...but I'm guessing all this EGR business is well above total newbie level!

Actually, it's quite a simple system and easy to learn how to repair it. The testing of it is not bad (test light for VSV, you can blow into the VMV to see if air is passing, and off top of my head I forget the test in the FSM for the EGR valve), and anyone can replace vacuum lines.

The great thing about these trucks is that most of the maintenance can be done with a small number of tools, by those who aren't the most mechanically savvy. Between this forum, a few youtube videos, and a bit of trial and error, you can do just about any of the repairs on an 80 series.

 

[lazy]

Egr, test above as mentioned. Since nox is low when cool and high when warm, exhaust gas isn't getting into system, as per check engine light. Remove throttle body and clean. You'll need a new gasket which is $5.

Need to check for vacuum leaks . Stumbling a bit when idling? Clean maf by spraying maf cleaner and I would replace o2 sensors.
Mechanic, slee and Robbie. I've used neither of them. But for emission stuff I would go to one of the highly rated place in pamphlet you get when you fail. That way it counts towards 700 bucks to get waiver. They most likely will do everything I mention above and replace a few more parts.

 

[meeshatronic]

Actually, it's quite a simple system and easy to learn how to repair it. The testing of it is not bad (test light for VSV, you can blow into the VMV to see if air is passing, and off top of my head I forget the test in the FSM for the EGR valve), and anyone can replace vacuum lines.

The great thing about these trucks is that most of the maintenance can be done with a small number of tools, by those who aren't the most mechanically savvy. Between this forum, a few youtube videos, and a bit of trial and error, you can do just about any of the repairs on an 80 series.

Thanks, Mark! That was exactly my thinking...and I'm excited to learn more than a few basics. Though I am feeling extra cocky at the moment after just replacing a hard drive in my laptop thanks to a few hours of youtube videos. Fingers crossed that my streak as a tech genius continues with this truck!

 

[meeshatronic]

Egr, test above as mentioned. Since nox is low when cool and high when warm, exhaust gas isn't getting into system, as per check engine light. Remove throttle body and clean. You'll need a new gasket which is $5.

Need to check for vacuum leaks . Stumbling a bit when idling? Clean maf by spraying maf cleaner and I would replace o2 sensors.
Mechanic, slee and Robbie. I've used neither of them. But for emission stuff I would go to one of the highly rated place in pamphlet you get when you fail. That way it counts towards 700 bucks to get waiver. They most likely will do everything I mention above and replace a few more parts.

Great idea on the emissions place, I hadn't realized you needed to use one of their places to count towards the $700 repair quota.
I got in touch with Robbie, but he can't get me for another couple of weeks. Hoping I can get the emissions issues sorted this week before my temp tags expire, then have Robbie help me out later with waaaay more fun stuff!