All this just because of some poop on the trail. Jeesh. I'm glad I don't have to worry about this where I live now.
need a CRAPPER!!!
- Thread starter chicago
- Start date
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Who would build these trailside outhouses? Who would maintain them? Pay for them?
The off road clubs? Maybe. Didn't think the local TLCA chapter had that much extra money.
Maybe the Feds.
Of course then I'd have to blame all those red bastards on the left for raising my taxes
.
Hayes[/quote]
I said the migrant workers could build it. Round up some of the thousands that are marching for equal rights and work and put them to use. How about a day use fee? Maybe the cost of the bags and papaer for each rig would go a long way towards a system. At least your taxes would be going for something you enjoy if they had to raise them for this. Ask the Govenator what he is doing with all the taxes now...
The off road clubs? Maybe. Didn't think the local TLCA chapter had that much extra money.
Maybe the Feds.
Of course then I'd have to blame all those red bastards on the left for raising my taxes
. Hayes[/quote]
I said the migrant workers could build it. Round up some of the thousands that are marching for equal rights and work and put them to use. How about a day use fee? Maybe the cost of the bags and papaer for each rig would go a long way towards a system. At least your taxes would be going for something you enjoy if they had to raise them for this. Ask the Govenator what he is doing with all the taxes now...
Cruiserdrew
On the way there
Rusty Shackleford said:
Rusty, I have steered away from personal attacks. If you enjoy 4 wheeling, you will need to wake up to this as an issue. Sanitation and related problems have become one of the major weapons of the anti-access crowd. It seriously is a major issue. It isn't a joke.
Regarding the soil-most of the Sierras have a thin veneer of soil, just a few inches to a few feet deep. There is not enough depth to "perk" a septic system. There is enough depth to support trees and other greenery. If you look closely at Rubicon pictures though, there is rock everywhere. Other trails like Dusy Ershim, there is even more rock and less soil. I agree with First Toy that I don't need a broken down crap shack to ruin the view.
There are kits available for cleaning up trip related oil spills. One of out club members put several such kits together and gave them away to the rest of the group. Usually, someone has one on board. You seem to agree that leaving an oil spill "out there" is a bad idea.
One last thing-Sometimes you just need to focus on what's right and not on what is convienient for you. I'm sure your mom told you to pick up after yourself, and this is just another place you should do just that.
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rusty_tlc
Dain Bramaged Member
This is an old debate, we were having it in the late seventies among the backpacking community. Back then leave only foot prints take only pictures was a relativly new phrase. The sport was expanding rapidly, a lot like four wheeling today. Many people didn't have the sensibilities of a cat, as a result a lot of campsites were pretty disgusting. This in turn resulted in people camping in less desirable spots until they got trashed, etc. etc. Eventually some trails had a fire ring every few hundred feet.
It took a lot of education but the problem seems to be in control on back country trail nowadays.
In areas like the Rubicon you cannot simply bury your waste. There is just to much traffic.
And as Drew pointed out there really isn't much soil.
And yes people do outnumber animals in that area, besides being concentrateed in a narrow strip of terrian.
It took a lot of education but the problem seems to be in control on back country trail nowadays.
In areas like the Rubicon you cannot simply bury your waste. There is just to much traffic.
And as Drew pointed out there really isn't much soil.And yes people do outnumber animals in that area, besides being concentrateed in a narrow strip of terrian.
I'm not trying to attach you guys. I see your point and it is very clear to me that everyone who enjoys the trail systems do not mind the packing out requlations. Like I said earlier, I have never been there, so I do not know the extent of the problem. It must be way out of hand from the post I have seen here. I'm all for keeping the trails open and if it takes packing poop out, then by gawd I say pack it out. The Rubi has been on my list of must do trails someday, so I'm sure I will get a chance to do the same in the future. Not all will see eye to eye. I can understand you don't want to see a run down shack in your view. I would rather see that than not seeing the trail at all. I hope the efforts you guys are going through make the difference so I can see it someday. You know as well as I do that 100% of the users will not be doing the pack out thing. Sure, they may get a ticket, but it's still going to happen, especialy if there are hunreds and hundres of people using this place each weekend. Keep up the fight though.
Oh yeah, my mom did make me brush my teeth each night before bed, but I can't seem to recall ever packing out my poop on a camping trip.
Oh yeah, my mom did make me brush my teeth each night before bed, but I can't seem to recall ever packing out my poop on a camping trip.
well, here goes the neighborhood,,,,,,
i couldnt find a single one of those that i actually fit on enough to want to make a deposit in the boonies,, i eventually made my own around an elongated toilet seat bought from home depot.
i couldnt find a single one of those that i actually fit on enough to want to make a deposit in the boonies,, i eventually made my own around an elongated toilet seat bought from home depot.
- Thread starter
- #47
WHOA!!!!!
I leave the board for a few days to wrench on the rig, and go to my first LC meeting, and this lowly crapper thread spawned an environmental debate...
Great info here gents...Im really glad this topic came up as it did.
Chicago
I leave the board for a few days to wrench on the rig, and go to my first LC meeting, and this lowly crapper thread spawned an environmental debate...
Great info here gents...Im really glad this topic came up as it did.
Chicago
I just read the the July 4th weekend, that was the final nail in the coffin for Spider Lake, there were over 3000 people camped there. I have been through there many times and had to camp at Spider Lake two times. One because of some breakage earlier in the day and arriving late and the second from breakage in the sluice. Pretty disgusting before they closed it to camping. Buck Island is now taking the extra hit. There are far too many that wheel into the sluice, drink, get stupid, camp and then wheel back out. They have never even been through the complete trail.
By the way my PETT got here yesterday.
Jack
By the way my PETT got here yesterday.
Jack
rusty_tlc
Dain Bramaged Member
Like I said it's pretty bad now, but so were a lot of hiking trails in the late seventies. As more people becone educated the problem will be less and less. Peer pressure is a powerful thing.Rusty Shackleford said:I'm not trying to attach you guys. I see your point and it is very clear to me that everyone who enjoys the trail systems do not mind the packing out requlations. Like I said earlier, I have never been there, so I do not know the extent of the problem. It must be way out of hand from the post I have seen here. I'm all for keeping the trails open and if it takes packing poop out, then by gawd I say pack it out. The Rubi has been on my list of must do trails someday, so I'm sure I will get a chance to do the same in the future. Not all will see eye to eye. I can understand you don't want to see a run down shack in your view. I would rather see that than not seeing the trail at all. I hope the efforts you guys are going through make the difference so I can see it someday. You know as well as I do that 100% of the users will not be doing the pack out thing. Sure, they may get a ticket, but it's still going to happen, especialy if there are hunreds and hundres of people using this place each weekend. Keep up the fight though.
Oh yeah, my mom did make me brush my teeth each night before bed, but I can't seem to recall ever packing out my poop on a camping trip.
Dig hole,
s***,
back fill,
have beer,
simple,
Why all the rigmaroll?
s***,
back fill,
have beer,
simple,
Why all the rigmaroll?
http://www.greatdividetours.com.au/AOZPress/ThunderBox.html
Is what we use, with a garbage back stretched over the frame once folded out, before the lid id folded down onto the base.
The bag sits in a hole you dug first, and you bury the bafg when your done.
rusty_tlc
Dain Bramaged Member
Where I live it is still that simple.topend yobbo said:
In some areas, like the Rubicon, there are three problems.
First there isn't enough soil to dig a hole in.
Second if there were enough soil the places are so popular that you couldn't dig a hole without finding a treasure buried by someone else.
Third a lot of the people visiting these areas are new to the outdoors, or just stupid ignorant a-holes. They do a lot of of step four and totally skip steps one and three. This leads to clouser of some areas and restriction like "pack it out" for everyone.
The big problem is the ones that cause the situation in the first place will be the same ones that ignore the rules. Eventually enough people will become educated and will place enough pressure on the rest that people will do what they should have been doing all along.
