My Engine Swap

Discussion in 'OH- The Buckeye Birfield Syndicate' started by phishtaco, Aug 2, 2005.

  1. phishtaco

    phishtaco Cincinnati

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    This is what we got....
    I have a 73 F that is going to be replaced with a 79?80? 2F(Thanks Spacegost)
    The 2F has been stored inside for a bunch of years. It was supposedly a good running engine and it was pulled bc the kid had to have a V8. It sat in the mother's garage for years and then SG got it.

    SG suggested I use the F manifold and carb setup since my carb is in good cond. and the 2F cond. is unknown. So I need a new gasket for that.

    Its got all kinds of smog crap on it that I would like to get rid of if possible.

    Do I use my F air cleaner set up or the 2F? I guess it makes no difference to me just on what filter to buy.

    Obviously I would like to move my alt. to the passenger side. What do I need? wire? can I reuse my F alt?

    I think I just need newer rear motor mounts?

    I've got the old 4 point fan, this will work with the 2F just fine I hope.

    I've got a brand new clutch setup, thanks to the Previous owner.

    Anything else I can get prepared for to help this move faster? I've been spraying bolts on my F so hopefully they'll come out ok.
    Any parts I'm forgetting? Obviously I will have oil, oil filter, antifreeze, brake fluid. My plugs and fuel filter on my F only have 100 miles on them so I'm hoping to just reuse those. Warren has a main rear seal for me(what do I owe you for that) What else? Sounds like a lotta crap.
    Warren is it near Centerberg?
     
  2. Thom

    Thom

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    A few answers

    BETTER CHECK THE HEAT RATING ON THE PLUGS. I'M SURE THEY WILL WORK FOR THE 2F, BUT MAY NOT BE THE BEST.
     
  3. zetasig

    zetasig

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    Yes, near Centerburg, I am on an unsecure connection, I will give you directions at work, The rear main is yours for free, One catch, you gotta haul down to cincy with you 4 rims and meet up with Jukelemon and give them to him:) He will mail me a check, and he can meet you in Cincy.

    as for the questions on the swap. Smog crap is best removed by someone who knows what they are doing. or if it works fine, dont fawk with it. The performance gains from what I understand are marginal at best.

    If possible remove grill, bib radiator, etc before coming down or at least have all the bolts finger tight.

    In my 75 2f the alt is already on the passenger side, so I am not sure about moving it. It would be easier, to just extend the wires that are already there to the other side.

    Voltage regulator should probably be switched out to the earlier one.

    Dizzy, your new one will be all electric, no more points, Will need to cut into the harness for a few hot 12v wires to power it. Also need an ignitor unless you got that too.

    Agree with the later fan more air and a SHROUD is needed.

    Clutch slave, Mine moved from the driver to passenger side, I needed to bend a new hard line to get to it. This may need to happen.

    also need to think about exhaust. the old needs to either be cut out from the stock? manifold now to the new stock one on the new engine? Spray those bolts down with blaster, or else the cut off wheel gets involved.

    Rear Main, Might need to pull the oil pan. if so new oil pan gasket, I have heard its easier to replace with the pan off.

    Sounds like fun to me.
     
  4. zebrabeefj40

    zebrabeefj40

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    I'll jump in on this one as I've worked on a few. Answers in no particular order...

    Smog gear: Most of that will disappear when you swap the F intake/exhaust onto the 2F. Just need either plugs for where the air rail goes into the head. Or I can weld the air rail fittings closed after the rail is cut off.

    Related to the smog gear: you might get a new gasket for the thermostat housing to cylinder head (we can use sealer instead if you can't find one fast enough. Using the F motor housing removes a couple smog related vacuum switches (and the potential leaks around/through them). The rad hoses are sure to fit that way too.

    Exhaust: Since you're planning to reuse the F manifold we can cut the pipe down under the truck near the rear motor mount. Then either use an exhaust coupler in the proper size or a band style exhaust clamp to fasten back together after the 2F is dropped back in. Don't wanna screw with the exhaust pipe studs if we don't have to!

    Motor mounts are the same but if you still have the round mounts IN THE FRONT do yourself a favor and order new mounts now. The round mounts are not long for this world after 30 years of use. It's easier to change them when the motor isn't sitting on them... Rear mounts are the same for both motors.

    Alternator: Your F alternator will work just fine. I might have an extra 2F alternator bracket in my stash. Just extend the wires across the motor to reconnect. No new regulator needed as the alt is the same as before. Might need a new belt though; I'm not sure the belts are the same from the F to the 2F.

    Rear main seal: Easy to change with the motor out of the truck. No need to pull the oil pan or change the pan gasket.

    Distributor: This is a toss up. If you got the electronic distributor with the motor, great! But I think it needs a matching ignitor (same as used on most Toyota's of similar years). Will take a little extra wiring work but not that bad. If you got a points distributor than it's my understanding that the F motor points dizzy is the better unit as it has vacuum advance instead of vacuum retard that some of the later units got. If you got no distributor with the 2F than the F unit works!

    Air cleaner: If your using the F motor carb and intake I'd use the F motor air cleaner too. It's a bolt on deal that way and you already have one.

    Clutch slave: This depends on which trans you're using. If you're keeping whatever the current setup is then what you have doesn't change. The 2F bolts to an F bell housing just like an F bolts to a 2F bell housing... After that, I'd need to know what you have and what you are swapping to; to know just what will need to be changed. I'll bring a double flaring tool along if you need to make a new line for something...

    Fan: I'd use what you have for now to get it going. What fan you use is not critical when it comes to getting the motor in the truck. 4 blade metal fans have been known to blow apart with bad results. In the future I'd look for a newer plastic fan. I might have one of those too and a matching shroud...

    As far as removing things like the bib, radiator and other stuff...I would wait until I got to Warren's to do that. It's not that big'a deal to do. I have found it's better not to try and do a project in several places at one time. Having parts here, there and everywhere is more of a PITA than it's worth in perceived time savings. Sure, spray all the bolts down for a few days ahead of time but don't bother loosening anything until you're "on location" so nothing gets lost. A couple empty antifreeze containers work well for bolt buckets (lay the container on it's side. Cut a rectangular hole in the side facing up=cheap bolt bucket).

    You might also get some new heater hose and clamps. Many of the hoses are easier to deal with when the motor is out of the truck. We might need to extend the wire for the oil pressure sender too...

    HTH,
    Nick Jennings
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2005
  5. phishtaco

    phishtaco Cincinnati

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    Ok, I am taking notes.....
    The new motor came with a shroud, distributer, ignitor and attached oil pan. My current distributer has petronix so if we should keep that cool with me. I will pick up new plugs, I noticed last hight that they were different part numbers. I will get everything lubed up and pick up some gaskets.

    Warren, my buddy owns DJs pizza in Centerburg. He drives a Solid axle Tacoma on 37s, you ever see him around? BIG BENE plates.
     
  6. zetasig

    zetasig

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    So free pizza right, I have seen the taco, On BALD 37s right. Snorkle and no bed.

    Nick where is the fun when half the stuff is taken apart in one place and the other half in another. Some of those loose bolts gotta fall off in tansit somewhere, I got a big coffee can full of half metric and half SAE nuts and bolts. Great way to spend a few minutes trying find what you need.

    Calipers and rotors in, I will be picking them up tonight. or tomorrow. Only need brake hoses, moly grease, and brake fluid.


    Anyone need a set of brand new front Brake pads for FJ 40, never installed, I bought them new with the axles, and then needed to buy loaded calipers. so these are spares. cheap.
     
  7. zebrabeefj40

    zebrabeefj40

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    Oh I'm ALL for having fun, Warren. But playing "where's that part" in the middle of an engine swap in someone else's garage isn't my idea of a good time! Of course it's not MY garage so maybe in that case Phishtaco ought to start pullin stuff off so you can have TWO dead trucks in yer garage instead of just one! ;p :D

    Nick
     
  8. zetasig

    zetasig

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    Smack me down again. Two dead cruisers in one garage is cooler than most people could ever dream.

    Marty I never heard back about taking those steel wheels back to Cincy with you. Are you up to it?
     
  9. beno

    beno Gihee Arakawa Moderator Supporting Vendor GOLD Star

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    Warren/Marty:

    I might be going down that way after Saturday evening...not sure yet (depends on the parental units in Atlanta).

    If so, if Marty can't I'll be happy to make the transport.

    See you all on Saturday. This is some pretty cool s***. ;)
    -onur
     
  10. zetasig

    zetasig

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    Sounds good. Thanks for the help. I am picking up my Calipers and rotors tonight before heading up to MI for the weekend.
     
  11. phishtaco

    phishtaco Cincinnati

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    Stupid fricking internet......What do they really expect me to work at work?

    Anyway, I will definately deal with the wheels. I may even take those pads off your hands if they fit my 76 rotors although I probably really need loaded calipers.
    Stuff is being lubed, parts orders are going in, hopefully I'll have all we need?
    Bene is a good guy, I work on some pizzas, wether he gives them to us or I buy them they'll be free.
     
  12. zetasig

    zetasig

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  13. phishtaco

    phishtaco Cincinnati

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    Good deal....placing an order from advanced pretty soon here. I've got plugs, intake gasket, Thermastat gasket, oil filter.....Whatelse can we think of...
     
  14. phishtaco

    phishtaco Cincinnati

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    What kind of calipers did you go with?
     
  15. zetasig

    zetasig

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    Went with Remanned loaded ones I think they were around a hundred bucks each. I got a 90 dollar core with the two old ones. so it brought it down to 56 bucks for the new caliper and pads. No too bad considering the pads were like 23 bucks by themselves

    Only real difference is the loaded ones obviously have pads. but also the 4 pins and anti rattle spring to hold the pads in. My old calipers had half the pins frozen in by 30 years of rust.

    Interestingly enough they had unloaded calipers in stock, and loaded ones needed to be ordered.
     
  16. zebrabeefj40

    zebrabeefj40

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    Oh man, I must be cooler than I though...I have at least 3 dead Cruisers in and around the workshop. :D Me cool? NOT!! :rolleyes:

    Nick
     
  17. phishtaco

    phishtaco Cincinnati

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    Just by chance...Does anyone have an extra 4 speed skid plate they wanna get rid of?
     
  18. FJ40Jim

    FJ40Jim The Cruiser Whisperer SILVER Star

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    Sorry I'm late to this party, been busy the past week.
    The 2F intake and especially exhaust are much better than the F parts. But, dropping the 2F exhaust manifold into your '73 truck will necessitate a new exhaust system. So, for simplicity's sake, I'll second the F manifolds and carb idea. Oh, and swapping in the 2F carb is a little hassle because the '73 throttle linkage might not fit. Bring a good drill and a sharp 1/2" drill bit to hog out the holes in the F manifolds to go on the 12mm 2F manifold studs & bolts.
    Most of it will go away naturally once the 2F is dressed w/ the F ancillaries.

    Use the air cleaner that fits the carb.

    Why? Just bolt the F alt on the 2F block. No problem.

    Rears are all the same from E-80. Fronts change a little over the years. get new '79 if you have the cash.

    No, the F has the direct drive metal fan. 2F's have an aluminum WP w/ a bigger fan bolt pattern. Best setup is use the 2F fan, fan clutch, WP, Oil cooler, fan shroud.

    Cool. Just swap the entire clutch & flywheel assembly onto the 2F.

    The plugs & fuel filter are fine. Bring the B'laster and some long ratchet extensions. All the usual hand tools. Changing the main seal is no problem once the engine has the flywheel and bellhousing removed. Oil pan removal is not needed. Bring a valve cover gasket for 2F so we can adjust valves. You may not need the VCG, because the rubber 2F ones are reusable a couple of times, but bring it to be safe.
     
  19. phishtaco

    phishtaco Cincinnati

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    Jim, thanks for the reply...It may be a little late for me to pick up anything else. I would like to move the alt. for future ps setup. Fan, well I only have the F fan so I maybe screwed there if that doesn't work, unless anyone else out there has one????? I have a 2F VCG on my current F and a few months ago you said it was in VCG, so hopefully it still is.
    Will you be attending the festivities this weekend then?
    Marty
     
  20. zetasig

    zetasig

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