Builds LX450 where to start! (3 Viewers)

[scottryana]

The computer is capable of adjusting them and I believe the computer can add or subtract up to 20% more fuel before it throws the check engine light. That is usually what most aftermarket parts rely on.

You buy a new exhaust, new intake, new air filter, you are flowing more air and aftermarket parts makers rely on the computer being able to add more fuel, that is where the extra power comes from.

I also think it is what Toyota was banking on when they did their Supercharger, since they didn't provide any mapping for the extra air, they are just trusting that it isn't so much air that the stock system will have enough swing to make up the difference. I have been hard on the TRD Supercharger in the past but it is a simple system and does what it needs to do and that is provide a small power bump without too many complications, but with some drawbacks that I am surprised Toyota didn't address, like high intake air temps.

On the FI/C 8 you can adjust fueling by 100% up or down, but it seems maybe not in open loop? (still investigating this)

OK thanks!

So on STFT and LTFT, are these things that the computer is capable of adjusting, or is this something that you adjust in the fuel map using your new fancy FI/C 8?

 

[concretejungle]

Thank you for that... now i'm up to speed and can understand these fueling discussions better.

 

[Overland Tailor]

Ryan,

In open loop the injectors are not running wide open as suggested. In OL the ECM has been calibrated to maintain an AFR around Stoichiometric or 14.7 to 1 or 1 equaling lambda. This will be for the factory ECM to maintain lowest emissions.

Open Loop as you stated no longer utilizes the vehicles 02 sensors, but in MAF vehicles has a calibrated fueling point for a certain hertz reading (How much air is coming across the MAF wire)... This fueling point is hard set and does not adjust like it would in closed loop when the ECM is also looking at the 02 sensors... We also have MAP sensors which I believe you are running....and volumetric efficiency tables in the newer GM and Ford applications, but I don't believe Toyota utilizes VE tables for fueling.

Toyota did their OL calibration on the MAF sensor in the factory tubing in a set position. Any change to the these variables will throw off the MAF calibration off and thus result in incorrect fueling. In forced induction applications the position of the MAF sensor is critical as laminar airflow can now be an issue.

Some people will call BS, but I've seen MAF sensors off by 20% just by relocating them in a new cold air kit. Calibrate the MAF for the new setup and the car idles again when cold and is no longer lean at WOT

Having said all this the first thing in obtaining proper fueling is making sure you have correct airflow being measured. The only way to do that is to calibrate the MAF to the new setup. Hopefully the AEM setup can accomplish this during its override in Open loop....

Hope this helps you...

Best,

john

Sent from my wireless device~

 

[scottryana]

John there is some good info here but some of it isn't correct for the 80 series.

It has been proven over and over that in open loop these trucks in stock form see 10:1 or richer. In closed loop yes they are trying to maintain stoichiometric ratio of 14.7:1, but open loop is wide open. You can go back on my stock dyno's or you can look around the site it has been done several times.

We could watch the flow in g/s on the MAF sensor using OBDII scanners, you can also change the MAF clamp and make it any voltage lower and it wouldn't change the open loop reaction. The 80 series computer reacts much different from other 90's Toyota's according to the tuner who has done lots of Supra's and MR2's.

 

[scottryana]

Final numbers are in for now!!

Crank power ~422hp and 631ft/lbs!!! @ 16psi of boost

 

[Overland Tailor]

Good info for me as Im just learning the Toyota's.. GM's Ive done, this is new to me.... Just trying to look at simple things first..

Question... Did you ever look at injector Duty Cycle of your stock injectors under boost? Curious to see how close to maxed out they were.


j

 

[scottryana]

I never ran stock injectors in my system, I swapped the 305cc injectors for 540cc injectors and they are around 65-70% IDC

Stock injectors would have been maxed out.

 

[Overland Tailor]

Great numbers you put up! Congrats on that~

Please keep us posted on what they find as a solution....

j

 

[scottryana]

Solution is already done they had to manipulate the MAF clamp table and also the narrow band O2 going into open loop. We are kind of on a time crunch since I am trying to make FJ Summit, so we are stopping here it is running good and with some fine tuning there might be another 30-50hp in it but for now I just need to get a day or two of driving on it before I leave for CO.

 

[Overland Tailor]

Outstanding news... Good luck and enjoy that thing....

j

 

[Luke111]

Ryan, it's looks like you exceeded your goal of 400 HP by a wide margin ..... I can't wait to see a video of this thing on the street or the face of some guy in a Cayenne or any other V8 as your truck pulls away from them ...... Those are really sick numbers

Lou

 

[TYM4FUN]

Final numbers are in for now!!

Crank power ~422hp and 631ft/lbs!!! @ 16psi of boost

WOW

 

[scottryana]

Yeah thanks Lou!

I wouldn't say it was a wide margin, but it made it and I think there is even a little more left in it if I wanted to be more aggressive, the shop is saying 40-50 more hp, but I set 15psi as my limit on stock head bolts, and we were right around 15.6-16 on that last pull. I think we would be fine at the 16lbs of boost levels but we are dialing it back to 12lbs of boost and around 380hp and 570ft/lbs since none of us really have any idea how everything will handle the power.

In the big scheme of things this is actually a very small turbo, (PTE 5862 or Garret GT30) but I sized it so that boost would come on early, little lag, and meet my power goals, I could have gone bigger but I don't need more power and bigger would have just taken longer to be in boost.

Since my truck is my baby I am playing it safe. EMS has a shop truck with 300,000 miles on the stock head and block and they are talking about throwing a BIG turbo on it and finding the limits..... I think that is going to be one hell of a big bang. haha.

 

[lilevo]

What was actual dyno numbers? RWD or 4wd pulls?

Dyno chart? . Good results!

 

[scottryana]

4wd pulls 199% of stock hp and 210% of stock torque on the same dyno.

Chart will probably be after I get back from FJ Summit if I can still make it.

What was actual dyno numbers? RWD or 4wd pulls?

Dyno chart? . Good results!

 

[concretejungle]

Would you mind sharing what costs you have to get to this point? Not trying to beat a dead horse but those are some impressive numbers.

 

[scottryana]

I really don't know a final number. I know that sounds ridiculous, but I just bought parts along the way and then worked with EMS to get everything installed.

I would guess to replicate this it would be a lot, but I already had the exhaust, bought a lot of my own parts, etc. You could have saved a lot of money, cheaper turbo, etc.

I would just call EMS and they can give you an accurate number for a full kit.

 

[concretejungle]

That's kind of what i was getting at... Is this one of the kits or is this a one off.... So to get those numbers you would purchase a kit, plus upgrade part of the kit? Or, perhaps this is one of his stage III kits instead of stage I. That's all i was curious about.

 

[Tapage]

those are good news .. how your AFR ends at nearly 16 PSI .?

You guys pull some extra timing .?

 

[scottryana]

It is basically a stage I, but I already had an EMS exhaust and I replaced some of their stage I parts with my own parts, then I added the computer $550, injectors and fuel pumps which I already had.