Looking for feedback on HDJ81 for US use (1 Viewer)

Joined
Dec 24, 2019
Messages
110
Location
Sydney, Australia
Well, the diesel engines can go bad easily in my opinion. The rotary bosch style injection pump if getting bad fuel or water contamination goes bad quickly and for example, the injection pump for the 1hd-fte costs 6500 US dollars in the Toyota dealership in my town. The set of injectors are around 3000 dollars. If I take the 1FZ engine for example I can't think of any component in the engine which would be similarly expensive as for the 1hd-fte.
I've been driving Toyota trucks with rotary Denso injector pumps continuously since 1993, first the 3L engine in a Hilux, then the 1HZ in my 80. Those pumps are tougher than you think. I had the pump rebuilt on the Hilux at 500,000km. Not because there was anything wrong, just because I thought it was time. Cost me $1200AUD, plus $300 for the injectors. I had the injector pump done on the 80 last year, first time it's ever been serviced in 25 years of operation. They ended up replacing virtually every part, including the housing, due to general wear. It was still working fine I'll note, just a slight diesel leak from the low sulfur diesel change they did in AU a decade back that shrunk the old seals of pumps, which the new seals fix. Total cost? $2000AUD, plus $500 to service the injectors. Don't look at the Toyota prices, this is a Denso pump, and the parts prices are much, much cheaper through them. All your diesel service places will be buying direct from Denso. That $2000AUD price was basically a new pump assembled from parts. It's now ready to go for another 25 years. These things aren't fragile. You talk about bad fuel and water contamination. The fuel filter has a water sensor on the 80, connected to a dash light and buzzer. You'll know about water long before it reaches the pump. As for contaminated fuel, you can run these engines on used cooking oil. They're not delicate.

And now consider what the diesel models don't have to worry about. I have no ECU. No fuel pump. No carby. No O2 sensors. No cats. No vacuum lines for the engine itself (on the 1HZ at least. No PHH! The pump is sucking diesel directly from the tank itself, and squirting it straight into the head. You need fuel and air. You don't need spark. You don't need electricity at all. The engine has no weak points. No minor thing I can think of that takes you out of action. There's a reason they're popular in places like Aus and Africa, when being stuck somewhere can actually be deadly.
 

SNLC

OCD
Supporting Vendor
Joined
Sep 9, 2004
Messages
7,508
Location
Boise - Idaho
Man, you're not kidding on that injection pump -

View attachment 2631195

Also looks like it ha about a million parts in it.

View attachment 2631196

That’s not $6k.

We are getting brand new FTE pumps out of Australia for about $4500.

While the injection pump is a complicated device it is your distributor, spark plugs, coil and fuel pump all in one unit. They don’t fail often unless you run bad fuel through them. You are not going to find much bad diesel in the USA at the pump and even so that is why people run nice fuel filters and water separators in a diesel. The injection pumps can go hundreds of thousands of miles before needing a service or rebuild.

I have had 1HDT pumps rebuilt locally for about $700. All six injectors for about $600.

The diesels don’t have head gasket issues. Only early 1HDT’s need BEB done every 100,000. The rest of the 1HDx platforms don’t have these issues.

They are bomber and simple engines.

For comparison, I have an all new from Toyota 1FZ in my 80, I have over $15k in parts in the engine build. 🤷🏼‍♂️

Cheers
 
Joined
Dec 24, 2019
Messages
110
Location
Sydney, Australia
I will add though, the injector pumps are NOT user serviceable. They'll keep on going and going even if they're knackered though, just expect a loss of power or uneven power across the RPM range. The pump is full of moisture sensitive parts though, and needs precise calibration. It's something you get done by a proper diesel service centre, that has the experience and gear to do it. There will be places like that in the US I'm sure, and in aus they usually are the places that also do big rigs. If you have a healthy pump though, for most people they're good for the life of the truck, or now at the 25+ year mark, one pre-emptive rebuild to get you to 50+ years. Worth it IMO.
 
Joined
Aug 8, 2015
Messages
615
Location
Somewhere
That’s not $6k.

We are getting brand new FTE pumps out of Australia for about $4500.

While the injection pump is a complicated device it is your distributor, spark plugs, coil and fuel pump all in one unit. They don’t fail often unless you run bad fuel through them. You are not going to find much bad diesel in the USA at the pump and even so that is why people run nice fuel filters and water separators in a diesel. The injection pumps can go hundreds of thousands of miles before needing a service or rebuild.

I have had 1HDT pumps rebuilt locally for about $700. All six injectors for about $600.

The diesels don’t have head gasket issues. Only early 1HDT’s need BEB done every 100,000. The rest of the 1HDx platforms don’t have these issues.

They are bomber and simple engines.

For comparison, I have an all new from Toyota 1FZ in my 80, I have over $15k in parts in the engine build. 🤷🏼‍♂️

Cheers
Well, I wrote in Toyota in my town in central Europe was giving me the price of 6000$. Sure, I bought the injection pump from Australia for the 3000$ on eBay but just to give heads up on the price of the injection pump. The full rebuild of the 1HD-FTE pump in Australia in a reputable shop like ADS Injection is not 700 $ but more like 1500 $.
When I took my old injection pump to the injection place they asked for 3000 $ for a full rebuild, but that would mean all new internals, just housing would be reused.

My point here is that there are components on the turbo-diesel engines which are significantly more expensive than on gasoline engines.
 
Joined
May 20, 2007
Messages
4,772
Location
Riyadh and Auburn
I'm a current 100 series owner and I'm considering selling it for a roughly 93-95 vintage JDM 80 series with the 1HD-T engine. My reasoning is just to play with the extra off road potential of the 80 series suspension, but going with the diesel so it's not as big a step down in power and torque from my 100. To be honest, my use would be 95% around town, but the 5% off road would be 2-3 weeks per year taking it on hiking and fishing trips.
I'm interested in this statement. Are you saying the 1HD-T is going to be "peppier" than a 1FZ-FE? I think you will be disappointed if that's the major reason to go for diesel vs gas.
 

SNLC

OCD
Supporting Vendor
Joined
Sep 9, 2004
Messages
7,508
Location
Boise - Idaho
Well, I wrote in Toyota in my town in central Europe was giving me the price of 6000$. Sure, I bought the injection pump from Australia for the 3000$ on eBay but just to give heads up on the price of the injection pump. The full rebuild of the 1HD-FTE pump in Australia in a reputable shop like ADS Injection is not 700 $ but more like 1500 $.
When I took my old injection pump to the injection place they asked for 3000 $ for a full rebuild, but that would mean all new internals, just housing would be reused.

My point here is that there are components on the turbo-diesel engines which are significantly more expensive than on gasoline engines.

Sure and I don’t disagree.

If you pay a shop to do a head gasket job on a 1fz though, it’s not cheap at all.

Cheers
 
Joined
Jun 15, 2016
Messages
363
Location
Denver
@kgrove Not sure where you're located but I'd just go test drive one before you commit. They're all around the country at this point.
 
Joined
Jul 23, 2008
Messages
191
I'm interested in this statement. Are you saying the 1HD-T is going to be "peppier" than a 1FZ-FE? I think you will be disappointed if that's the major reason to go for diesel vs gas.
In truth, yes I was expecting the diesel 1HD to have more torque than the gas 1FZ, so at least better relative performance pulling at lower rpm like is more common off road. Looking at the specs, it looks like they're more similar in both power and torque than I thought, though the diesel version does appear to give its highest torque at lower rpm... depends a bit whether I look at the -T or -FT version on the diesel side or the -F or -FE version on the gas side.

I'm fully expecting both to be turtles on the freeway... not that my current 100 is going to win many races (one of the only races it could consistently win would be against either flavor of 80 engine). The bigger reasons I wanted the diesel are the reliability and range given the fuel economy. I also wouldn't mind learning about diesels for fun... because since I've already learned 5% of everything I need to know about a gas engine, it's probably time to move on and learn some new stuff.

Why?
I have for the past 16 years and 310000 miles.

It will probably be the most reliable car you've ever had..
My statement that it would be "stupid to rely on this car 365 days a year" is overkill. What I meant is that even reliable cars break, especially when they're 25-30 yrs old. If the wrong parts break on this one, it could be down for a couple weeks awaiting parts. I need to acknowledge it's a potential problem and either plan on having a second car or not get too angry if I have to rent a car. I've already found with my 100 that the car is unavailable at times because I'm tinkering with something... that will get worse, not better with a JDM car if for not other reason than it's older.

Not sure where you're located but I'd just go test drive one before you commit. They're all around the country at this point.
I haven't seen one in Phoenix yet, though I hear they exist. I'm on the lookout, however.
 

SNLC

OCD
Supporting Vendor
Joined
Sep 9, 2004
Messages
7,508
Location
Boise - Idaho
Any 1HDx platform that is tuned and modified correctly will give you excellent power.

28psi, 250rwhp (irrelevant with a full time 4wd) and 600ftlbs is no problem. Some even run 32+psi.

I am not sure why you are comparing the 1HDx to the 1FZx. They are so completely different in nearly every way including how they drive on and off-road.

The concerns of parts, some random mechanic know what to do and so forth are valid. Most diesel Cruiser owners in the USA either work on their own truck or have “their guy” who they have and do work with at least some what regularly. They truly are not hard to work on with a half dozen metric wrenchs and an FSM. They need far less maintenance or repairs than the gas engines. All a diesel needs to run is air, fuel and compression. I have seen 1HZs running on 100psi in a cylinder for an engine that should have 500psi.

Cheers
 
Joined
Jul 23, 2008
Messages
191
Any 1HDx platform that is tuned and modified correctly will give you excellent power.

28psi, 250rwhp (irrelevant with a full time 4wd) and 600ftlbs is no problem. Some even run 32+psi.
You're referring to upping the turbo boost? How difficult is that to do and what does it entail? I'm interested, but would prefer skewing towards longevity and reliability over gaining more power.
 
Joined
Dec 24, 2019
Messages
110
Location
Sydney, Australia
You're referring to upping the turbo boost? How difficult is that to do and what does it entail? I'm interested, but would prefer skewing towards longevity and reliability over gaining more power.
I've never had a turbo, so take what I say with a grain of salt, but IMO a turbo itself is an exercise in trading off longevity and reliability for power. I've always stuck with the naturally aspirated diesels over a turbo. Less power, but less stress on the engine, and less to go wrong. Yes, that means my rig is slower and less powerful than some other people's. I can still do the max legal speed limit here up most hills with a full car, and in low range I can go up just about any hill I point it at, so I've never seen the appeal in a turbo. That's just for my use. That said, I'd take a factory turbo diesel over a petrol model any day of the week, but if you really care about reliability and longevity over power, keep it stock and don't mess with it would be my advice. More boost is more strain on the engine and the drive train.
 
Joined
Feb 16, 2012
Messages
201
The 1hdt might not be for you, no small town mechanic is going to even know what it is, my local Toyota dealership doesn’t know anything about it and are useless for parts (unless it’s some generic 80 series part) There are shops in the States that can help with repairs but your primary source of information Is most likely going to be this Forum and the FSM.


Yes, I have 1994 fjz80 and almost impossible to find anyone that will work on it. This is in Slidell LA which is a decent size city. That said most mechanics these days are looking for easy fast turn around work. They don’t want a vehicle sitting in there shop for more than a day. Some of the local shops I talked to for work I say Landcruiser, which draws weird look then followed by 1994. At that point a pretty much loose them and they don’t want to work on it. I would just keep your100. Your going to spend a large amount of time and money baselining to just get the vehicle up to a good state. You maybe thinking low miles must be good shape, do not be deceived.
 
Joined
Jul 23, 2008
Messages
191
So a more detailed performance question for you - probably mostly for the Aussies and South Africans that see a bunch of these. I know these aren't strong performers, but I'm trying to get my hands around exactly how they'll behave.

1) Assuming a properly running and fully stock (no intercooler, no extra boost, etc) 1hd-t and 1hd-ft, how much will it struggle to do 75mph / 120kph on flat, level ground? What kind of EGT is it already pushing at a typical freeway speed and how much does it have left if required to pass somebody, ascend a small hill, etc?
2) how much different will the 1hd-t and -ft be in this respect?
3) Some of what I'm reading is that small boosts, like in the 15psi range, are potentially neutral or even positive from a reliability standpoint with respect to highway driving as they lower EGTs by improving the amount of air reaching the engine. Does that match real world experiences you guys are seeing? What all is entailed in that kind of baby boost and what other considerations are there? I would assume there has to be a downside or Toyota would have engineered this with a slightly bigger boost to begin with. My guess (and all this is assuming the stuff I've read elsewhere isn't crap) is that a small boost may indeed be more optimized for higher demand usage like freeways or sustained hills, but maybe you pay for it with higher EGTs on lower load driving.

I'm fully expecting this to be a step down in performance from the 4.7L in my 100. I'm just trying to figure out how much of one, how much I should prefer an -FT to a -T, and how I might configure mine after I get it.

I've decided to go ahead and go through with it assuming I can find one that seems to be a good deal. My worst case scenario is I'll play with it for 6 months and sell it after deciding I like my 100 series better. The best case is I love it and bring several more across for my friends to buy so I have somebody to mooch spare parts from.
 
Joined
Nov 29, 2020
Messages
77
Location
San Diego, CA
JDM 80s here, got it last year when the 95 become legal. Haven't read all of what has been said so far, but I will just give my experience. Apologies if I repeat anything that has been said so far. My cruiser is my daily with weekend play here and there, and the looks you get from people, especially older folks, is priceless. I lived in Goose Creek, SC, for 2 years for the Navy, which is pretty small in my opinion (coming from a city of 1.5 Million).

The car wasn't perfect when I got it, but I have found that most of the basic parts that are shared among vehicles are generally easy to find (I.E, had to replace the starter which my local AutoZone had. Perfect match). I have actually been able to find parts relatively easy online, what with sites like cruiserparts.com, partsouq.com, and a few little ebay sellers here and there. The only thing I have had a real tough time finding is a charcoal cannister, which I assume is probably because emissions in the US are different than in Japan. So far, no shop has refused to service my car, whether it be from a little jiffy lube all the way up to a Toyota Dealership.

For going on the field, or even a long road trip, planning things out/planned maintenance is a MUST. I recently took a trip from SC to CA, and on the day I was suppose to pick up my U-Haul trailer, I didn't think of getting a trailer adapter for the lights. No retailers had the right adapter since it was different from the traditional US style. Had to order one off amazon and wait for shipping. Unfortunately took two days from my vacation time. Just a little story, but the amount of time I wasted and the inconvenience it was, all for a little trailer light adapter, simply because I didn't do my research.

Besides a little hiccups here and there, I truly love my JDM 80s. If you need sources on where to get a JDM 80s, feel free to Pm.

IMG_3643.jpg


IMG_3930.jpg
 
Last edited:

ppc

M Go Blue
Joined
Aug 18, 2003
Messages
3,381
Location
Nashville, TN
JDM 80s here, got it last year when the 95 become legal.

Keep in mind that although you have a JDM model it has the 1FZ-FE motor which was sold here in the US. The OP is inquiring about a diesel engine that was never sold in the US. Parts availability for the motor and experienced mechanics is going to be completely different concern.
 
Joined
May 20, 2007
Messages
4,772
Location
Riyadh and Auburn
1) Assuming a properly running and fully stock (no intercooler, no extra boost, etc) 1hd-t and 1hd-ft, how much will it struggle to do 75mph / 120kph on flat, level ground? What kind of EGT is it already pushing at a typical freeway speed and how much does it have left if required to pass somebody, ascend a small hill, etc?
2) how much different will the 1hd-t and -ft be in this respect?
Have you ever driven an 80 with a 1FZ-FE? It will do 85 or 90 all day long with no struggle; or at least mine will. I have pulled a tandem axle, enclosed U-Haul fully loaded (guessing 4000+ lbs) at 80+ with minimal struggle on small hills. I'm not touting it as a race car by any means but I think you will find it much closer to your 100 series than you assume.

I'm not saying don't get the 1hd but you're comparing apples and orange.
 
Joined
Sep 17, 2006
Messages
414
Location
Calgary, AB.
Ive owned a 1990 HDJ81 in Canada for 10 years now. 4 years ago the injection pump went, cost 4,500$ to have rebuilt, injectors included.

I bought the truck for 15,000$ and have EASILY put another 15,000$ into it in 10 years ( incl maintanance & mods ).

Not a cheap vehicle to drive, but THE BEST nonetheless...
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top Bottom