How much do the dealers pay for the LC

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I was in a Toyota dealer to test drive a 03 LC, they want $36K with 39K miles, and my offer is $32K. The sale manager told me that, they only make a few hundred bucks out off this LC, which I think is B.S.:D

How much do dealers pay for the LC these days? Any more room to bargain?:confused:
 
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I was in a Toyota dealer to test drive a 03 LC, they want $36K with 39K miles, and my offer is $32K. The sale manager told me that, they only make a few hundred bucks out off this LC, which I think is B.S. How much do dealers pay for the LC these days? Any more room to bargain?:confused:

The real question is, "what is a fair price for this 03 LC". Go to www.nadaguides.com and enter all the details. If it was a clean vehicle with 39k in the mid-south and had a nav system the trade-in value is $30,400 and retail is $34,330. I'd say you are right about the stealership BS. They may soften on their price with time.
 
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Dealers buy and sell vehicles everyday. You might buy 10 your entire life, and they do that before lunch everyday. They are pros at getting the most out of every car and truck that they can. Unless the dealer will hand you a bill of sale showing you what they paid for a used vehicle don't beleive it. If they do show it to you, call the seller listed on it to confirm everything.

Now I already know they will not show that to you, it would be like showing their hand at a poker game, and if they show their hand, your getting conned. So all you can really do is use nadaguides, or edmunds.com to get a real sense of what the truck is worth.

Drive the LC again. Not the salesman's going around the block thing. Try for a good 10+ miles. Highway, city streets etc. Keep the radio off, but do test the AC to see if it works and how it affects the idle. Does it track straight and true? Does it veer while braking etc. Find a dirt parking lot and engage the center differentials and low range etc. Heck, it is already used, it's not like your running up miles on a new car. The more time you spend with them, the more likely that they will not want you to leave without making a sale.

Negotiate from the low end. If you start with the fair price, they will only go up from that point. Print out the stuff from both edmunds and nada and walk in and tell them that you want to make a deal today, bringing your check book, large amounts of cash and a copy of your credit report won't hurt either. They will know that you are serious. Obviously, only go this route if you actually intend to buy it.

Additionally, find every flaw in the truck, however small, to show why the price should be what you are offering. They would do the same if you were trading in a vehicle.

If the price is starting to get real close to what you are willing to pay and they are not budging, try working soft dollar stuff like free oil changes, future service items, extended warranty, and car maintenance items from the parts department. If all that is agreed upon and you shake hands, make them put it in writing on the sales contract, otherwise the soft dollar stuff will be forgotten when you show up for the freebies.
 
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And make sure you're getting TWO master keys before you agree to buy, 'cause they're $200 each if you have to buy one!

Dealers make more money on used vehicles than new vehicles. Dealer's asking price for my CPO 03 LX w/ 49K mi was $49K, hoping they'd find a sucker during Xmas (this was a little over 1 yr ago). No one took the bait, and I got it for the KBB trade-in price plus options and CPO cost after it sat on the lot for a few months. They wouldn't budge after initially dropping the price over $7K, but I did get a 2 yr platinum warranty extension for only $300 (list was $1800, they claim).
 
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Joined
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redondo beach, CA
on a used car you have to completely detach yourself from the whole process if you want to escape with your head. dealers live on service and used car sales. it's nothing for a dealer to make 5000+ bucks on the used car deals. they get them so cheap it'd make your head spin.

make an offer and walk away. make your offer early in the morning on the last day of the month. research around your area and be RUTHLESS. get yourself either enough in your checking acct or one of those blank check auto loans before you go in. tell them that you'll write them a check for 32K out the door (or whatever the price is) right this minute TAKE IT OR LEAVE IT.

jp
 
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I have had success, although limited, by writing out the check before hand if possible - it shows you are serious. Be fair like the others have said - use NADA and make sure you have the right region selected - this can and does make a big difference especially when it comes to 4X4 vehicles. It really is like poker - how much did they pay for it, how many sales do they have for the month, how long has it sat on the lot taking up space, etc. I usually end up buying from an owner and not a dealer, but you if you find the right one - go for it.
Best of luck to you.
 
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don't buy used from a steeler - buy private party. I landed my Sonora Gold 2003 with just over 50K miles, NAV, loaded for $27K. Yes, it needed a new key and tires - fine - but I LIKE needing new tires because it helped me get him down in price from his $29K asking and now I get THE TIRES I WANT - not some crappy OEM ones that still have a ton of life.... So now I'm in for $28K and she's perfect - I know I could sell it in a week here in Seattle for $35K If I wanted to... Keep in mind I've been looking for this right one for OVER A YEAR... that sucked

Fish
 
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Thanks for the inputs. I may go back there again next week, since it is the end of the month, they may let it go cheap.:D
 
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These guys are generally right. You will drive yourself insane worrying about how much profit the dealer may make. The salesman doesn't even care about that (the sales manager does). Just offer a sensible, fair price, because even after all the research you do, they will still know better what that price should be. They are the experts and the NADA guides are statistically driven from reported vehicle sales.

End of the month is always a good time too, since most salesmen are looking for bonuses on number of sales. If you pick a salesman that the manager likes, he will give you a deal. I've been in that situation several times and it has saved me thousands of $$.

The tires issue is also an important consideration. I live in a state with safety inspections, so the dealer had to inspect and pass the vehicle. They clearly did not want to replace the tires so they passed them, and when I pointed out the error, I got an $800 allowance for new tread. Then I went out and bought Revos!

Dealers also make money off loans and loan deals with certain financial institutions, so coming in with a check is a double-edged sword. They may prefer to finance the vehicle rather than do a cash sale. This is impossible to figure out, but consider the sales manager's options when offering concessions....

Good luck and be patient. I have also had better luck shopping during the day and then buying at night, when the staff is tired and wants to go home. They are also busier at night and anxieties increase, which usually benefits you (give the buyer the deal to get them out). Then come pick up the prepped vehicle during the day.
 
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The sale manager left me a message, he said if I come back to try the LC one more time, he can work on a deal.:cheers:


All four tires are new, but it is missing one master key (Comes with 2 keys, and one of them is Master). Personally I don't care how much they make on this LC, since we all have to make a living, but I do care how much I can save, since I am CHEAP.:D

I just received a check from Capital One, so I can walk in there again as a cash buyer, unless the dealer has a lower rate.:grinpimp:

This is going to be the fourth 03 LC I had tried since begining of the month, sometiimes I wonder, am I picky or not?
 
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justimaginejack

Looking for a new Cruiser
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ok, lots of good advice and some reall s***ty advice too. NADA is suggested Dealer Retail Value and has very little to do with actuall value of vehicle.

Never, EVER, EVERRRRRRRRR USE NADA, the Vehicle is worth whatever the wholesale value of the vehicle is on the day you buy it and yes it goes down every single day. Go to KBB.com and Edmunds.com and find out what good, read not excellent condition wholesale value is. That is what the car is worth when you drive it off the lot. Assuming it is in good(read great) shape. The way the system is set up, people come in and sell their vehicles to dealers, they always lowball your ass!!!!!!

They get paid to get money out of your pocket and in tho thiers. Salesmen get relativley little or no compensation compared to what the dealership actually makes. So they reallly push to get big commissions. Or they get Fired!!!!!!!!!

The vast majority of profit in any dealership comes from used/pre-owned. They start negotioating anywhere form 2-3K below wholesale on your trade in, telling you the vehilce needs work, yada yada BS then the come up to wholesale or lower. This is just the start. Then they start at NADA or KBB Dealer Retail and come down 1-2 K on the purchase vehicle. Now they have just given you a very generous 4K, wow, you are really beating me down. Hey I still have to put food on the table. The spread works out to be 3-5K per car, you drive off the lots while they crie/celebrate and you are stuck paying the difference on your financially upside down vehicle.

I laugh when I buy cars from Lexus, I walk in with my buddy's Black book( the wholesale guide from last weeks auction, which only has three values. None of which say great or excellent) and say here is what the car will be worth to me tomorrow, and they say come back in 60 days, if we still have it we may deal. Takes longer but 5K is a lot to Lose.

A dealer will never lose money on a vehicle. They would rather wholesale it to some schmuck who didn't know they couldn't sell it. I have seen the same LX470 I five dealers in my area, Each one kept it too long and they price kept getting higher. I just laugh!!! You should too.
NEVER pay retail. If you can't get it for between wholesale and private party, walk. Not your Fault they paid to much. Also, the spread between Wholesale on KBB and Edmunds are never the Same. Find some unethical schmuck at a used car lot and pay him 70 bucks for a copy of the black book! Then you really know what the price of the vehicle is!!!

How good of shape is this thing in??? It needs to be perfect, no joke there are to many on the market to not get a great one.

I have several books on How to buy cars from Previous Car Sales Trainers, who quit and wrote books. My dad is also a Sales Trainer, so I have heard it all.

Tell the dealer you want to play nice, then you play hard to get, make them come to you. show up several times, say sure would be nice of you could get it down, take family in, test drive it with them. Never come up in your price, get them to come down.

They say 35K
You Say 29K
They say 34 K you say 29,300
They say 34,900
you say 29,400
you continue to lower thiers by keepin yours within 1K Raise ten times, by then you should be counting pennies below 30K

If they have the room and no other bidders then you are set.
 
Joined
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The sale manager left me a message, he said if I come back to try the LC one more time, he can work on a deal.

This is going to be the fourth 03 LC I had tried since begining of the month, sometiimes I wonder, am I picky or not?

Call your sales person back and tell them about the message from the sales manager. Tell the sales person your not coming back in on the hope the price is going to drop to an acceptable level...you need their new price over the phone, if there is one. Let him know in the mean time, you'll continue to look at other options. Most sales people are paid on straight commision, not a percentage of the profit on the vehicle, so they will lobby the sales manager for a lower price. On the other hand, the sales manger is paid a commision on the profit margin so they are motivated to hold the price higher longer.

Looking at four vehicles isn't that may for the size of the investment. Take your time. If you miss one because someone else buys it, there was some reason it wasn't meant to be.
 
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Here is another worthless suggestion. If you are happy with the vehicle and the price then you got a good deal.

You won't know if you got a good deal until two years later and nothing major has gone wrong.
 
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Used cars typically have a LOT of markup built in to them. Is it certified? The certification costs the dealer about $500.

Does it have a 100K mile warranty? That is worth about $1,200. If it is just a 1 year / 12K warranty...it is only worth about $300....2 year / 24k about $500 I would estimate.

How is it equipped? Navigation and all the extras?

I would bet that the dealer has a good 20% in that vehicle .... meaning that they probably have a cost of around 28K .... could even be less ... depending on how it is equipped.

The only thing that confuses me is that they let you walk after you offered them 32K.

Also, it depends on where you live. I go up to Buffalo, NY to buy my Land Cruisers from Basil Toyota. I get screaming deals because the market for LC's is not exactly prime up there.

Great vehicle though, you won;t be disappointed.

Rich

I was in a Toyota dealer to test drive a 03 LC, they want $36K with 39K miles, and my offer is $32K. The sale manager told me that, they only make a few hundred bucks out off this LC, which I think is B.S.:D

How much do dealers pay for the LC these days? Any more room to bargain?:confused:
 
Joined
Oct 16, 2006
Messages
135
Location
redondo beach, CA
decide what your price is for that particular vehicle. if they can do it, buy it. if not, don't.

if you get it for what you think is the right price, who cares about anything else. i walked out of 5 dealerships buying my truck. they throw 6 people at you telling stories and what not, but just ask if they can do it. YES OR NO? i had other stuff to do......

good luck. being emotionally detached after you set your mental price will save you big.

jp
 

justimaginejack

Looking for a new Cruiser
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St.Louis/ Floyd, VA/ Phoenix AZ
Straight Commission is a percentage of profit. Usually Tiered. Here is my deal. I have been royally screwed by dealers. The LC I bought, with records, that the owner of the dealership who knew me, sold us, with "no doubt" in his mind was in great shape, had tons of problems. 5K worth. He refused to speak with me after the sale, still doesn't talk to me and acts Like I broke everything and it was fine when it was on his lot. He had "Everyhting inspected" he said. So did I, and the radiator was broke. He said no it wasn't and if it needed to be taken care of he would, that was how he did business. It was part of his mission statement, which he read to me aloud in front of the sales manager. So NO, I don't give a Fu!* about the dealers, or their empty dinner tables. I gave him my trade in 600 below wholesale, and paid 21,500 for te LC, a car he bought for $19,000 ( which was worth $17,500 wholesale the day I bought it)while he stuck it to the "new buyers" for sticker! So he wlked with more than 2k easy on my Trade in, which he sold in less than a week. Plus another 2,500 on the LC. You know how I found out the vehicle has a real radiator Problem, when I took it in to the Dealership for it's first free service, they told me it was broke. I was fxxxing livid, then they pressure tested it making the crack worse, and to add insult to injury, the Fxxxers Made me pay for the Test, the Fluids and the oil change Just to get my car back. Some Complimentary Service That was!!!

I have no problem with people earning a living, I have been in straight commision sales my entire life. Wouldn't have it any other way. If I fxxx a client, then I lose eventually because they tell everyone. But if I bust my ass and provide amazing value for my clients, then they get what they want and i get paid.

Dealerships, specifically ones that do not measure service or value, like toyota, cannot be trusted. ( this is not Toyota the corporation, it it a franchisee, who might own a taco bell and god knows what else?His only concern is with profit.) It is not that they want to be assholes. It is that if they behave otherwise then they think they won't make any money. thier is a reason that JDpowers and Assoc. Calls everyone in my family each year, they send out questionairre's asking me how happy I am. It is because I own a Lexus too.

Please understand, whenever in negotiations, when the opposing side benefits only on a higher Price in cash, that there is rarely if ever a symbiotic relationship. It is them vs you. YOu may not choose to use that thinking, but it will be present never the less, just like the air you breathe.

Another thing. Check the BBB and see how the Dealership is rated. Seeger Toyota here is St.Louis came so Highly recommended, I knew Tom Seeger and His family, I used to serve them dinner at the Country Club When I was in College. Everyone Said they were so nice, honest. If I had checked the BBB I would have bought the LX and Kept my 5K in the Value difference in the Vehicle. They had six unresolved issue in the last three months alone on used cars!!!

I know thier are dealers/ Wholesalers on here, I pray you live and breath with the utmost integrity, you do own a vehicle that was created with it.

If you want help, I would be happy to call and act as a buying agent. I am willing to bet you I can get a lower price. if nothing else, have a friend who is a hard ass, call in and say he is your accountant, and will be handling the transaction from here. I have seen this work miracles. Saved another friend more than 11K on a used S500( I tried to talk him out of mercedees but he is russian? Needs the emblem)by acting as his financial advisor.

sorry about the rant, just pisses me off to see good people get screwed. I pray you find a cherry.

This is what edmunds.com says my LC is worth Now!

2000 Toyota Land Cruiser 4 Dr STD 4WD Wagon
Trade-In Private Party Dealer Retail
National Base Price $15,725 $17,808 $19,850
Optional Equipment $873 $1,019 $1,289
Running Boards $205 $239 $302
Third Seat $300 $350 $443
Trailer Hitch $33 $39 $49
Rear Wind Deflector $66 $77 $97
Electrochromatic Rear View Mirror $33 $39 $49
Automatic Climate Control (2 Zone) - Front and Rear $150 $175 $222
Roof Rack $86 $100 $127
Color Adjustment
White $96 $109 $121
Regional Adjustment
for Zip Code 63017 $-199 $-225 $-251
Mileage Adjustment
135,000 miles $-2,183 $-2,183 $-2,183
Condition Adjustment
Clean $0 $0 $0
Total
Wholesale $14,312 Private Party $16,528 Dealer Retail $18,826


KBB.com

Wholesale
Condition Value
Excellent
$12,450
Good
$11,425
Fair
$9,640

Private Party
Condition Value
Excellent
$16,140
Good
$14,950
Fair
$13,330

Dealer Price:
Condition Value
Excellent
$19,995


Priced with the same options.
Depending on What Manheim Auctions come up with and these two resources. About a year and a half after I purchased the LC it is worth between $11,425 and $14,312.00 (03/25/2007)

I have paid out just shy of $1,600.00 in tax title and License. $21,500 for the Truck and $5K in needed/PO Delayed neglected Maintinance repairs Not to mention the sting of Property taxes this last December.

That Means the dealer made more than 4K off of me while :"not feeding his family, we need to make a profit here" BS.
I am into this Vehicle for $28,100, not counting interest, and It was worth $17,500 on the day I bought it, in good shape. Now I am upside down between $13,788.00 and $16,675.00 depending on who you ask. And if someone takes an LC to auction and gets less, my Value will drop concurrenlty within a week.

So no It doesn't mean you will know if you got a good deal on a Vehicle if you don't have problems with it. If you Buy and LX in perfect condition Certified Pre-Owned with 100K warrenty, YOu are most Likely Giving the Dealer 10K over the Wholesale they paid. Which will be the Value of your LX after you sign your papers unless you can convince a Private Party Buyer Otherwise.
( on that note, My certified ES300 was Bought and maintained at Lexus of St.Louis. Little Old Lady, leases for two years. She had been in a fender bender, not reported, didn't show up on car fax. The Dealership did the Repair work! They certified it. After I bought it I powerwashed My new Lexus with Pride only to find touch up paint coming off on the front bumper. I was .... They fixed it and gave me a New ES to drive while they replaced the entire front bumper at thier cost. But I still had purchased a vehicle that had been in an accident at a certified price. They did the repair work and still the Used car people certified it. I have the test/ inspection papers to prove it. So It just goes to show the all the words in the world and even the best of intentions can miss and put a buyer back financially)

The salesmen need the profit to be so high because the typically only get 30% or less and I have never seen an automotive Sales company not have a tiered System, Not sell more cars, get paid more, it is get higher profit and get paid a higher tier.
1,000-2,999 15%
3,000-5,999 20%
6,000-8,999 25%
9,000-11,000 30%
11,000-15,000 35%
so on and so forth
Car Salesmen only care what they can get out of you. They may be "looking out for your best Interest, but they are always looking out for thiers first, or they will get fired!(would have been in the Peace Corps. not selling)
 
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Joined
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Just FYI

Lots of informative stuff up there on your prospective purchase--Last week I got my 2000LC for $21,500. 69K, extended warranty, loaded, pvt party. Immaculate except for CV boot leaks. Bakersfield, CA. LS430, Jeep Grand Wagoneer
 
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FWIW I paid 34K with 40K miles in mint mint condition. the only blemish was a 1 inch scratch on the rear side molding...full sevice records one owner etc.

I've seen them for more $38-42K and passed and for less$$...but this one was awsome.......soooo if you find an 03 that you love don't let it get away from you for a few bucks....i found them very hard to come by.

If you do a search on Autotrader.com you can pull up a bunch to compare....yeah the deaalership is in the buisness to make money, probably 8-10% over private, but for me it was the right one at the right time.
 

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