Getting ready to buy a ARB non-winch bull bar.

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I have a couple of questions before I make the purchase. I searched and I still need help.

I have OME light front, med rear, caster correction bushings.

Question 1) What size spacers do I need in the front to get the level look?

Question 2) 4X4 Connection has the cheapest price I've found so far ($600 for the bull bar plus $75 shipping. Is it cool to contact Slee or Man-A-Fre and give them the opportunity to match this price or is that a d*ckwad thing to do? I would really like to give them my business since they contribute to this board.

Thanks,

TT
 

NorCalDoug

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What's the OME light suspension/springs? I thought there were med and heavy -- and that stock-height-deal, but I thought the spring rate on those were the same as the med (although I could be wrong). If you get some sag, try a 1" spacer. The bullbar reported weighs around 80 lbs, so it shouldn't be too bad.

If you want to do it right, take the $600 price (less the shipping cost) to your nearest 4WheelParts whorehouse and get them to grab ankle. I've heard they'll match prices and if it's close to you, you'll save on shipping charges.

Maybe it's because I know Christo, but I typically don't haggle with him when I place orders from SleeOffroad.
 
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trouser_trout said:
I have a couple of questions before I make the purchase. I searched and I still need help.
Man, you have all KINDS of trouble don't you. You have a trout in your trousers, you are second-guessing yourself on price, AND you are buying a bullbar without the ability to ever add a winch. You are screwed. :flipoff2: And if you want the "level" look, you bought the wrong springs.

Personally, I think its kinda chiken$h!t to come on here and ask us (in front of Slee, who is active here) whether or not you should buy from him or someone else. How are we supposed to answer that?? If you really want to support them then chalk the extra you pay up to knowing that anytime you need to call them, they'll be there to give you trail-proven advice.
 

landtank

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Personally the D*ckwad thing to do in my opinion would be to buy the cheaper bar and then call Christo for help installing it. It's happened.

I don't think calling him and asking him his thoughts on it would be an issue, but remember that service and support costs money and the margins you are talking might be well below what Christo and others will do as they won't be willing to sacrifice their reputation by providing poor support just to make a sale.

For the most part I personally shop by price, however I also know I must assume the risk of being out on my own on the install. If you think that you might need some help with whatever may come up then I'd seriously rethink the bottom feeder approach to your purchases.
 
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Thanks elmeriachi for you response. I did not mean to be chickensh*t. I thought it was a reasonable a respectful request. I did not mean to offend anyone.

I know very little about Land Cruisers and the automotive industry and what is considered cool or not. I have no desire to get in a name calling mud slinging battle with anyone on this board.

Thanks,

TT
 
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trouser_trout said:
Thanks elmeriachi for you response. I did not mean to be chickensh*t. I thought it was a reasonable a respectful request. I did not mean to offend anyone. I know very little about Land Cruisers and the automotive industry and what is considered cool or not. I have no desire to get in a name calling mud slinging battle with anyone on this board.TT
You certainly didn't offend me, I just think its wrong to ask us how to go about where you buy your stuff, especially if it involves another Mud member. Like Rick said, I am always in search of a better deal, but cheap prices tend to come at the expense of little or no support. Call Christo and ask him...he'll tell you what he can or can't do. :cheers:
 
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From what I understand ARB dealers agree to something called MAP pricing. I was told that they have to keep their prices at a certain level to continue being an ARB dealer.

Apparently these other shops (4 wheel parts, 4 x 4 connection, Earls or any place like that) sell the ARB stuff below MAP pricing. How they can do that, I do not know. I was told that the price these big stores offer is below the independent shop's wholesale price. Is that true? I do not know.

Specialty shops sell the items for more, but you are getting service after the sale and Land Cruiser specific advice that you won't get from a 4 wheel superstore.

I'm not trying to influence your decision in any way, just sharing what I was told.

Charlie
 
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sleeoffroad

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Trouser_trout, don't sweat it. We have a policy not to price match, but we do try on a lot of other levels to accomodate customers. I don't want to go into this, I do want to address Charlies post. Yes there is a thing like MAP policy, but it is not that easy to enforce, especially with WD's (wholesale distributors) in the picture. They might adhere to MAP, but the shops that source product from them might not. Bottom line is, that as Cdan says, a sale without a profit is a a gift.

The consumer has the right to buy where and when he wants and at whatever price. However a shop also has the right to set their own policies. The bottom line is we can't make a living if we sell a ARB bumper and make $50 on it. That is what a lot of shops with free shipping etc etc make.

I believe it is a matter of however sells the product is so far removed from the guy paying the supplier that they do not figure out they are making a loss. Or they make it up with shear volume. Unfortunatelly with us, we are two people selling, and one of those two pays the supplier. Pretty quick to figure out when you are selling something at a loss.
 
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Maybe it's me. I am in a situation where I have to bottom feed and I am not happy about it. It's not my style.

I purchased my lift from Man-A-fre and my DBA rotors from Slee because they happily answered my many question and were a great help. I did this out of gratitude and didn't even consider shopping around.

I am currently buying a bunch of parts from CDan to do the ultimate service I asked about a couple of months ago. I sent a list to Dan. The only instructions I gave him was to call me for my CC number.

I should really wait to buy the bull bar, but I want it now. I can justify the service to the wifey but not the bar, therefore I have to convince her I'm getting the best price.

Thanks again,

TT
 

Biff

 
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TT

Don't sweat it, I did the same thing with my bull bar shopped it around till I got a good price. Most people here just have a certain perspective about supporting the vendors that support us. I have given my share of business to Mud vendors, but still keep an eye out for good sale items.
 

sleeoffroad

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Biff said:
but still keep an eye out for good sale items.
And there is nothing wrong with that. A bumper is a bumper is a bumper. There is nothing wrong with shopping for the cheapest price. But it should always be buyer beware and you pays your money, you takes your chances. 99.9% it will work out fine.

I have found that most people in the LC community do not mis-use vendors and suck them dry for info etc etc. However sometimes that does happen. We have had cases where we have spent hours and hours on the phone with someone on pre-purchase advise, only to be asked afterwards if we would price match some on-line retailers price. In those cases, we politely point out that we do not. Some customers take it well, others don't. Those that take it well, normally become customers for life, the others are like bees, they will find another flower to suck dry. Those you really don't want in any case. It might sound arrogant, but that is the only way we can strive to give the best customer service we can. Again, that is strive, sometimes we miss as well.
 

Biff

 
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sleeoffroad said:
I have found that most people in the LC community do not mis-use vendors and suck them dry for info etc etc.

I agree thats why I don't expect you to help me out with my ARB bar if any problem arises because I didn't buy it from you. On the other hand I will utilize your gold star customer service with the items that I do buy from you. All the items I've bought on my own are soley my responsability.
 

landtank

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Hey Christo, on those items that I've purchased and haven't called for help, are they stored in some kind of bank for when I buy some used POS off of E-Bay and need some sort of bracket fabricated to make the damn thing work?
 

sleeoffroad

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landtank said:
Hey Christo, on those items that I've purchased and haven't called for help, are they stored in some kind of bank for when I buy some used POS off of E-Bay and need some sort of bracket fabricated to make the damn thing work?
Yup, you can collect frequent shopper points to be redeemed later. :D
 

swixtt

 
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Slee, you hit the nail on the head. I completely agree with your thoughts as i'm in business for myself as well. I've seen everything for the 15years i've been doing my job. You have to have your limits on what you can do for people. and yes, most are great but there are some who aren't worth giving the time of day. there has been times when i will purposely quote high to get rid of them and 99% of the time i'm right. they just use you for your knowledge and then give nothing in return.
 

e9999

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I think Trout's question about prices was not only legitimate but also appropriate.
(Was also showing foresight, except of course that he probably didn't know that Christo is keeping a sharp eye on us all here and keeps tabs on who says nice things about him... Kinda like Santa Claus [nice toys too] :D Did I mention he's running the best shop in the country? :D )

Personally, I think that a shop who would be offended or indignant about somebody asking for a price match or discount would show poor business sense. Of course, good business sense may be for them to politely decline -as Christo suggested- and that should be their prerogative. But if they abused me verbally if I were to ask something like that, you can be sure I'd never buy from them again...

ARB should also be free to tell their retailers that they should sell only at such and such a price if that's their condition for supplying stuff, but that smacks of "price-fixing" and some/many customers would not take kindly to such a rigidly-enforced approach, I would think. The equivalent would be that you can only buy a Toyota at "MSRP" from your local dealer. Uh? Pretty much running against the concept of free-market, I would think.

Anyhoo, a well run shop with good practices and good people will do fine. And I never read nor heard anything here or elsewhere that would lead me to think that this is not the case with Christo's.
 

MTNRAT

 
 
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"Yup, you can collect frequent shopper points to be redeemed later. "
Hey Christo, how many do I gots?
Cheers,
Sean
 

Land Speeder

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Mamma didn't raise no fool. I shop and shop and then shop around some more. I (like probably most of this list) even browse ebay almost daily. That said, I understand why a culture such as ours is so cool, and it's largely in part because of smaller shops that have cool hard-to-find parts and they are fanatics like the rest of us. These shops are willing to talk to us because they love to talk about the same thing we do. The large volume dealer employees are more prone to be 9 to 5er's and they could care less what you are doing to your rig.

My Story: When it came time to buy my OME springs, I called the primary small shops listed on this thread. But no one seemed to have all 4 springs in stock. I found out that not even ARB USA had them in and was waiting on a shipment from AUS and everyone of these shops told me the same thing, 3 weeks. Well, I finally called a large volume dealer and they said no problem, we got'em! Well guess what... they didn't have them either. And trying to get shipment updates from them was like pulling teeth. I was p!ssed because they lied to me just to get me to buy from them and once they had my money I couldn't even get someone to talk to me. Not a single small shop lied to me, they were honest and I will always remember that.
 
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When I had a FJ60 I ordered a few parts from a vendor that I prefer not to mention by name. Anyway he sells stuff fairly reasonably priced and I tent to migrate towards decent prices, one time I bougth a set of shocks that when they came it was obvoius that the bushings were not the correct bushing for the FJ60, I called to get tech support on the purchase and the guy was a real a$$ and did not care to take care of the customer and would not take the shocks back.
Leason learned: Shop not only on price but on service which to me is more important than price.
This vendor still sells stuff at very good prices and even has a few items on eBay constantly, but I promised myself that I will never support his business even if I have to pay more somewhere else for the same items.

Thanks,
 
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