FJ40 Axles vs Dana 44, stronger? (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter oldracerguy
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So they should be sufficient for garage wheelin'?
The large pattern studs have a bigger diameter. The thought recently crossed my mind to have a set cryo'ed.
Not true
small pattern are 11mm
big pattern are 12
and like a mentioned before, hysteer arms are really the major issue with studs loosening which then breaks them
Cool. I did a visual inspection on mine last week and found out that I have the large pattern knuckles on my '74.
Thanks, previous owner. I didn't know that the studs were larger also. Good to know.
No, but I have the 11 mm studs and don't think ARP has these available.
Without a reference, that sounds like an opinion and you know what they say about opinions
Ed
they're like assholes, everybody has one. I have been told that the toyota axle is much stronger than a D44 and about the same as a D60, the only point that the D44 might be stronger is in the pinion....this is what one of the local cruiser guru's has told me and im fairly inclined to believe him. I have seen a 60 wheeling on 38's and stock axles (and he still hasnt replaced one).....the stock toys got plenty of beef. if your really concerned then put a set of 27 spline longs in there and dont look back. the 30 splined longs would be much more then needed but hey, it depends on how deep your pockets are....
so how much stronger are fj60 birfs than 40 birfs. i did a knuckle swap for disc brakes and took the 60 birfs and they were alot bigger than the stock ones. are 60 birfs as strong as say fj40longfields?
pb4ugo
SILVER Star
FYI, I have a dana 44 in the frt w/ ARB & 4:88's. I did it b4 longs or any thing else was on the market. I was breaking birf's quite often w/a lockrie and 33's. Then, I went to the 44, which cured my problems. It worked well. When I went to 36's, the weak link became the 44's dana axle joints. When it breaks it usaully takes out the axle ears, which holds the axle joint. I'm too tight to buy the alloy axle joints which I believe would be helpful, but the next link would be the axle, and alloys are bucks. I soon realized, I could be polishing a turd. From the help from this web site & others , my next move is to run the L/C frt end w/longs & arb. The only alternative is a dana 60 or polish my turd. I'm pretty sure the L/C frt end will be a cheaper build.
I never really had a problem w/stk birfields and an open frt end, w'33's, and a V8. FYI
Ken
I never really had a problem w/stk birfields and an open frt end, w'33's, and a V8. FYI
Ken
60 birfs probably have nothing on longs i would guess....but they are a bit beefier then the stock 40 ones....specially the 10 splined birfs on the pre '74 trucks...and as far as breaking birfs....it probably has some to do with driving style as well....i have a bit of a heavy foot wheeling but i know enough not to crank my tires and punch it...or try to keep going when it starts hopping...that might contribute to not having broken a birf or axle also...but everybody will have their own opinion on whats better....there was also a guy running a locked front on 35's with stock axles (pretty sure they were stock) in the club im in and he didnt break his junk either....i think if you think about what your doing to your axles when your wheeling...you should be fine
Lot of geralizations and feelings here, so here are facts. To make it short d60 trumps all, there is nothing to compair. 30 spline longfields are the same strength as a stock 35 spline spicer shaft(see graph below). That is a stock shaft campaired to the strongest thing you can get. Steering there is no contest, housing there is no contest, ring and pinion, you guessed it, no contest. Everything is so much bigger. There have been a few failed 30spline longs in our group, but bobby kicks ass and has replaced them.
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Without a reference, that sounds like an opinion and you know what they say about opinions
Ed
Lot of geralizations and feelings here, so here are facts. To make it short d60 trumps all, there is nothing to compair. 30 spline longfields are the same strength as a stock 35 spline spicer shaft(see graph below). That is a stock shaft campaired to the strongest thing you can get. Steering there is no contest, housing there is no contest, ring and pinion, you guessed it, no contest. Everything is so much bigger. There have been a few failed 30spline longs in our group, but bobby kicks ass and has replaced them.
Haha. Sorry for not posting some data, Ed. Someone did it for me before I got back to this thread.
Felt I should chime in here.
95 runner, bobbed, chopped, caged, 4500lbs, 5.3L, 40x15r15 TSL's with BJ60 hybrids. Flipped the front for driver drop because there's just no room for DS clearance on the passenger side due to the offset pan on the 4l60e. Centered the rear by slamming in some mini truck ends. Up front, rcv 300m shafts, six shooters and chromoly hub gears. Rear stock mini shafts (which eliminate the idiotic diff centric c-clips), 96 runner backing plates and drums. 5.29's and lunchboxes.
So like, my rigs no lightweight, and it's got a ton of power. Comparing the strength of the BJ60's, built properly, against a built pair of 44's and 60's, there is no comparison. Roomies truck weighs the same as mine, same engine, only on 38x14.5's, and he snaps s*** constantly, and doesn't take the fun trails. I've been running my setup now for about 7 or 8 months without a single issue. Suspension isn't tuned at all yet, so it hops on big climbs, and the axles just soak it up like nothing. Been out with heaps of guys with D60/14b who blow up u-joints on stuff I've got no problem with.
At this point, I can't see why these axles aren't way more popular. No one knows what to do with them, so they can be picked up cheap, same aftermarket support as the mini axles (cause it's all the same parts), and quite a bit lighter than tons.
I should have grabbed a set of 80's for the outers, just for peace of mind, but as it stands, I have zero concern for the strength, and starting at half the weight of a 60/14 means I've got a lot of room to add extra weight without worrying about it.
95 runner, bobbed, chopped, caged, 4500lbs, 5.3L, 40x15r15 TSL's with BJ60 hybrids. Flipped the front for driver drop because there's just no room for DS clearance on the passenger side due to the offset pan on the 4l60e. Centered the rear by slamming in some mini truck ends. Up front, rcv 300m shafts, six shooters and chromoly hub gears. Rear stock mini shafts (which eliminate the idiotic diff centric c-clips), 96 runner backing plates and drums. 5.29's and lunchboxes.
So like, my rigs no lightweight, and it's got a ton of power. Comparing the strength of the BJ60's, built properly, against a built pair of 44's and 60's, there is no comparison. Roomies truck weighs the same as mine, same engine, only on 38x14.5's, and he snaps s*** constantly, and doesn't take the fun trails. I've been running my setup now for about 7 or 8 months without a single issue. Suspension isn't tuned at all yet, so it hops on big climbs, and the axles just soak it up like nothing. Been out with heaps of guys with D60/14b who blow up u-joints on stuff I've got no problem with.
At this point, I can't see why these axles aren't way more popular. No one knows what to do with them, so they can be picked up cheap, same aftermarket support as the mini axles (cause it's all the same parts), and quite a bit lighter than tons.
I should have grabbed a set of 80's for the outers, just for peace of mind, but as it stands, I have zero concern for the strength, and starting at half the weight of a 60/14 means I've got a lot of room to add extra weight without worrying about it.
Good info,
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After I started browsing the thread I realized it was started my my neighbor. He sold his 40 to someone in the South West a couple of years ago now.
I actually came across this thread when I first started thinking about doing my bj60 hybrids. Everywhere I looked, I found much the same answer "Forget the BJ60's, just do tons". Lots of guys insisting that they're not strong enough due to the mini axle parts. But realistically, I see buggies on mini axles doing just fine all the time, except for blowing up the gears. Anything that blows up other than the gears, always comes down to incorrect installation (seems no one knows how to install a knuckle/bearing/seal around here). The weight, price, and availability kept factoring in. No matter what, I figured tons are designed from the ground up, for hauling cattle. Diffs hang way low and I wasn't planning on running 40's, and a bone stock d60 front sells for $2500-$3500 here in the North, when they pop up maybe every 3 or so months.
So I bit the bullet and did the BJ60's, and I'm damn glad I did. Just figured I'd spread the word for the next guy waffling between tons and BJ60s. Ultimately I think they're the best axle choice for anything from a mall crawler up to a medium weight buggy (that won't be doing big hucks at least). I'm planning on using them on all future builds. Likely building a set to go under one of the XJ's, and I think we're doing another 1st gen that'll get'm as well. Mine will likely get a rear steer soon as well.
Oh, and just to give ya'll an idea of just how good these axles are, I picked up 3 sets of junkyard axles. All bone stock, and all complete with the factory installed bearings and seals. That's a 40 year old axle that was probably beaten on for at least 30 of those years. Every one of them was in perfect condition. I actually re-used the stock wheel bearings and carrier bearings. The only reason I swapped trunion bearings was because I messed them up when taking it apart. Even with blown out seals, the design of the hubs and knuckles is such that any water intrusion usually just spits itself back out.
As I said, I wouldn't even compare the BJ/FJ60 against the D44. No comparison. Aside from brute "i'm a retard with the throttle and my suspension isn't setup correctly so I bind up tires all the time" strength, I don't think the D60 has much on them either. Definitely a close comparison with the D60 in a properly built rig. Just cheaper, lighter, and easier to work on cause fxxx cast iron.
So I bit the bullet and did the BJ60's, and I'm damn glad I did. Just figured I'd spread the word for the next guy waffling between tons and BJ60s. Ultimately I think they're the best axle choice for anything from a mall crawler up to a medium weight buggy (that won't be doing big hucks at least). I'm planning on using them on all future builds. Likely building a set to go under one of the XJ's, and I think we're doing another 1st gen that'll get'm as well. Mine will likely get a rear steer soon as well.
Oh, and just to give ya'll an idea of just how good these axles are, I picked up 3 sets of junkyard axles. All bone stock, and all complete with the factory installed bearings and seals. That's a 40 year old axle that was probably beaten on for at least 30 of those years. Every one of them was in perfect condition. I actually re-used the stock wheel bearings and carrier bearings. The only reason I swapped trunion bearings was because I messed them up when taking it apart. Even with blown out seals, the design of the hubs and knuckles is such that any water intrusion usually just spits itself back out.
As I said, I wouldn't even compare the BJ/FJ60 against the D44. No comparison. Aside from brute "i'm a retard with the throttle and my suspension isn't setup correctly so I bind up tires all the time" strength, I don't think the D60 has much on them either. Definitely a close comparison with the D60 in a properly built rig. Just cheaper, lighter, and easier to work on cause fxxx cast iron.
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