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- #101
Good thought but the '93 does not have a "MAF" it uses an "AFM" which has been replaced already in this process.
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Good thought but the '93 does not have a "MAF" it uses an "AFM" which has been replaced already in this process.
- Thread starter
- #102
Frustrated only scratches the surface. I have spent a year chasing this and still have a vehicle my wife is afraid to drive.
I looked for some insight with "Tom and Larry" on the availability of skilled tech's in Toyota that might be qualified to deal with an 80 and they only recommended that I not expect that level of knowledge from their location.
CBT does a great deal for the members of Copper State Cruisers and it is where this unit was originally sold years gone by but it is also an hour and a half drive from my house. Knowing that this is a "leave it and let them look into it" sort of problem means I have to work out getting it to them and getting home without it i.e. a rental or I have to trailer it and leave my wife with the Lincoln for her daily while they have it.
I have to change out the P.S. pump hopefully this weekend and then look at getting it to CBT unless something else crops up.
As I have sat here reading your entire thread, I can understand why you are beyond frustrated!
Something that I started thinking about that MAY tend to be a bit erratic are the spark plug tube seals / valve cover gasket. If these are failing (or loose) they could move around or have leaky areas in them that will allow unmetered air into the system (through the PCV system).
I have noticed how horrible they run/idle when you remove the oil filler cap and was wondering if by chance it was a similar effect.
Change the spark plug tube seals, valve cover gasket, PCV grommet, and the oil filler cap and see what happens?
Just a thought.
Good Luck!
- Thread starter
- #104
I appreciate your patience to read through the thread and that you have brought something to the table not yet proffered.
While I will not discount this new direction out of hand I will say that of the new items to address only the filler cap has not yet been replaced. One of the things I did after getting this 80 was begin addressing the oil leaks and a full tune up.
So part of that process was new tube seals, PCV grommet, cover gasket and a little sprucing up of the cover itself.
I will have to eyeball those areas again and see if something has changed since I did that work.
I appreciate your patience to read through the thread and that you have brought something to the table not yet proffered.
While I will not discount this new direction out of hand I will say that of the new items to address only the filler cap has not yet been replaced. One of the things I did after getting this 80 was begin addressing the oil leaks and a full tune up.
So part of that process was new tube seals, PCV grommet, cover gasket and a little sprucing up of the cover itself.
I will have to eyeball those areas again and see if something has changed since I did that work.
Damn! That's PURTY!
Well,.......It was worth a shot and I didn't see it mentioned........
If'n I thinks of anything else.....I'll leave the light on for ya!
Damn that is good looking. Never would have thought about those seals. I heart MUD. Even if MUD does not love me back I still love you.
Hi Traakon, this is Tom I work for cbt. Murf has asked me to look at this thread and give my opinion on the issue. so I read the whole thing and the only thing not really mentioned is have you checked the wiring from the efi relay under the fuse box from the relay to the alt. the wiring gets very brittle and scorched and causes all kinds of runablilty issues. other that that I would need to see it here and fingers crossed murphy's law doesn't take effect and it acts normally while its here. that it acts up and we can find the issue ..
- Thread starter
- #108
Hey SIKNUT
I made contact with Murf and I am trying to work out when I can get it in to you good folks It's a long haul from my place in Queen Creek to CBT. I am considering running it up on my trailer and bring it down so I can leave it for you but I have to make my schedule and that of my wife meet her needs to have it available. I also want to replace the PS pump before I bring it down because I don't want it leaking all over your clean floors
To your point, I have not looked specifically at that area to find a flaw but have had the fuse box up and under it several times for other things and nothing stood out to me.
Murf asked me to put together a list of things I have done, it's a pretty long list and this thread is only one of two on this issue for me covering the things done. I will make sure that is as complete as possible when it arrives.
Oh yea, wife drove it the last three days and it "ran beautifully". Made a 5 minute run to the Basha's this morning and it acted up twice...
I struggled with my idle on mine. When I first bought it, it ran great. Then it died on me on the freeway-blew the EFI fuse. Replaced it with a. 25amp cuz that's all I had on the side of the road. 2 days later I see smoke under the hood, IAC valve was intermittent shorting out. Replaced it, good idle. Then I got a code 26 check engine light. Found some vacuum leaks. Then came on as code 25 running lean. Replaced o2 sensors, code came back even faster with new o2 sensors. Cracked open the afm cover, moved it about 6 clicks rich, light never came on again, rain beautiful. I just sold it, new owner was bragging about how good it runs, he took it up pikes peak, and claiming 14 MPG freeway with the 37" swampers. Pretty doubtful it's running THAT good, but everyone is happy so who cares.
- Thread starter
- #110
Well I have exhausted my efforts, "OSO" has been generously accepted Home to CBT for some professional help.
Loaded and ready.
Loaded and ready.
I went through the sme pains with my 93. After 10 minutes out came wd40 to look for intake leaks. Quick sprays around accordion folds on intake tube and idle smoothed. Duct tape was the quick fix. Toyota wanted like 180$ So I made my own. The leak only affected idle. You couldn't see the split but the o2 sensor noticed. Idles so well you can't feel it. Different mechanic different diagnosis.
- Thread starter
- #112
Dropped "OSO" off with Murf this morning.
Go figure, yesterday it would not run and was a chore loading. This morning She started right up, ran beautifully for unloading and relocating to the designated parking spot at CBT.
Siknut, you have your work cut out for you. Treat her well and send her home good as new if you please.
Go figure, yesterday it would not run and was a chore loading. This morning She started right up, ran beautifully for unloading and relocating to the designated parking spot at CBT.
Siknut, you have your work cut out for you. Treat her well and send her home good as new if you please.
- Thread starter
- #113
Wanted to add a follow up to this so that others reading/following this know what has transpired.
"OSO" spent about 3 weeks at CBT under the care of Murf and Tom. The conclusion was that the symptoms were the result of a bad/intermittent VAFM. The unit on "OSO" was a "re-manufactured" unit from Cardone that I installed just slightly over a year ago. I tracked down another unit and delivered it for Tom to continue his testing.
During this time, the alternator blew up on one of Tom's test drives
...yea, when it goes down hill it goes down hill.
Tom replaced the alternator and continued testing. The stutter/stalling was now gone, apparently thanks to the newest VAFM, but now the EGR was throwing CEL 71 again. This had been resolved for a while but now it has returned. Tom went over all the parts already replaced and went back to the VSV and installed a new one. No Joy. Tom had a conversation with the engineers at Toyota and they said it was a bad ECM. The reasoning is that in the '93 the EGR temp sensor that the ECM is looking at for the 71 code does not exist. It does exist on '94 and newer but not '93 and earlier. So if the sensor doesn't exist yet the ECM see's it as bad it must be something wrong with the ECM.
The ECM is yet another Cardone re-manufactured unit I installed about a year ago. So I took the original unit, another "Known Good" unit I bought from a fellow "Mud" member and a California spec ECM a Mud Member sent me. No difference, so I bought yet another ECM "Known Good" from a fellow "Mud Member" and installed it. No change.
So as it stands currently, "OSO" is running really well (apparently due to the latest VAFM) but showing a continuous CEL 71. Tom is going to have more discussions with Toyota and see where things can go from here on the "71" issue and it looks like I am starting a ECM VAFM collection
"OSO" spent about 3 weeks at CBT under the care of Murf and Tom. The conclusion was that the symptoms were the result of a bad/intermittent VAFM. The unit on "OSO" was a "re-manufactured" unit from Cardone that I installed just slightly over a year ago. I tracked down another unit and delivered it for Tom to continue his testing.
During this time, the alternator blew up on one of Tom's test drives
...yea, when it goes down hill it goes down hill.Tom replaced the alternator and continued testing. The stutter/stalling was now gone, apparently thanks to the newest VAFM, but now the EGR was throwing CEL 71 again. This had been resolved for a while but now it has returned. Tom went over all the parts already replaced and went back to the VSV and installed a new one. No Joy. Tom had a conversation with the engineers at Toyota and they said it was a bad ECM. The reasoning is that in the '93 the EGR temp sensor that the ECM is looking at for the 71 code does not exist. It does exist on '94 and newer but not '93 and earlier. So if the sensor doesn't exist yet the ECM see's it as bad it must be something wrong with the ECM.
The ECM is yet another Cardone re-manufactured unit I installed about a year ago. So I took the original unit, another "Known Good" unit I bought from a fellow "Mud" member and a California spec ECM a Mud Member sent me. No difference, so I bought yet another ECM "Known Good" from a fellow "Mud Member" and installed it. No change.
So as it stands currently, "OSO" is running really well (apparently due to the latest VAFM) but showing a continuous CEL 71. Tom is going to have more discussions with Toyota and see where things can go from here on the "71" issue and it looks like I am starting a ECM VAFM collection
lol just live with the cel if its running well its on old truck! mine throws wild codes sometimes when there is nothing wrong. may be a bad wire somewhere if you feel like tracking it down. otherwise wait till something actually goes wrong then worry about it. but it doesn't sound like a major issue.
also there is probably nothing wrong with the non remanufactured ecms. id sell them.
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- #116
The down side is that it is my wife's daily and with a continuous CEL if something does come up she would not have any warning. She is already hyper sensitive to anything it does...but she is happy to have the power steering back at full boost . I have to count that as a win.
I have not yet had the CEL cause an emissions fail...another win.
Oh I see
The down side is that it is my wife's daily and with a continuous CEL if something does come up she would not have any warning. She is already hyper sensitive to anything it does...but she is happy to have the power steering back at full boost . I have to count that as a win.
I have not yet had the CEL cause an emissions fail...another win.
Hi, I have read all the thread from the beginning to the end, a lot of espresso coffee and cigarettes and a tranquilizer, real hardcore material
I have a few thoughts first, maybe FZJ80 is too old to be reliable daily? At the same money (including the maintenance and Gasoline) you can get a newer car My daily is Mitsubishi Outlander 2016 my pig needs allot of work and I have already worked on it for 4 mounts and I have a few more, that's a lot of time without a delay. And after all this base line you can get a malfunction like in this thread because a minute crack in one wire at a harness you will never find
Second thought, maybe if I was in your shoes I would approach a specialist sooner
We have a perfect solution to old rigs CEL ON that work ok, actually two with the same outcome pull the bulb or put black tape over it
- Thread starter
- #119
Hi, I have read all the thread from the beginning to the end, a lot of espresso coffee and cigarettes and a tranquilizer, real hardcore material
I have a few thoughts first, maybe FZJ80 is too old to be reliable daily? At the same money (including the maintenance and Gasoline) you can get a newer car My daily is Mitsubishi Outlander 2016 my pig needs allot of work and I have already worked on it for 4 mounts and I have a few more, that's a lot of time without a delay. And after all this base line you can get a malfunction like in this thread because a minute crack in one wire at a harness you will never find
Second thought, maybe if I was in your shoes I would approach a specialist sooner
We have a perfect solution to old rigs CEL ON that work ok, actually two with the same outcome pull the bulb or put black tape over it
To OLD to be a daily driver?????...are you sure you are a ih8mud member
The wife loves HER 'Cruiser, she has always wanted a 'Cruiser (along with many other cool vehicles...yes, I am married to a lugnut
). It is possible that she loves it so much because she is not the one wrenching on it but that aside, there is no reason an 80 series should not be dependable and reliable.Would it be less work/headaches to have got her a new Acura RL, Range Rover, Volvo S80 or (lord have mercy) a Camry. Certainly...she really liked the Acura ZDX she had before we bought the 'Cruiser but where is the fun/coolness in buying what everybody else drives.
Yes, this truck has been trying, it has been a cash sponge, it has been frustrating and even once it was scary (when it nosed over at 60mph on the freeway and the guy behind raced by on the left emergency lane to avoid rear ending me
) But through the process I have connected to a lot of folks who love their 'Cruisers, had a lot of discussions, learned a lot about the Toyota mindset that went into these things and, yes, conversed with a lot of great folks here on "Mud" and become part of a community.At some point we will figure out what is causing this last CEL 71 thing (I hate not finding causes) and if the 'Cruiser continues to run well with the CEL the wife will become more confident with it each day she drives.
...and if not...anyone seen my '07 diamond black FJC rolling around Phoenix, she might want it back
To OLD to be a daily driver?????...are you sure you are a ih8mud member
The wife loves HER 'Cruiser, she has always wanted a 'Cruiser (along with many other cool vehicles...yes, I am married to a lugnut
Would it be less work/headaches to have got her a new Acura RL, Range Rover, Volvo S80 or (lord have mercy) a Camry. Certainly...she really liked the Acura ZDX she had before we bought the 'Cruiser but where is the fun/coolness in buying what everybody else drives.
Yes, this truck has been trying, it has been a cash sponge, it has been frustrating and even once it was scary (when it nosed over at 60mph on the freeway and the guy behind raced by on the left emergency lane to avoid rear ending me
At some point we will figure out what is causing this last CEL 71 thing (I hate not finding causes) and if the 'Cruiser continues to run well with the CEL the wife will become more confident with it each day she drives.
...and if not...anyone seen my '07 diamond black FJC rolling around Phoenix, she might want it back
So it is not her daily, but only one of them LOL that's reasonable i hope you have AAA
My pig is trail only so i have time to wait for parts in mean time if i want to go to desert i can allays join one of old geezers ( i will ask him to avoid gas forming food 2 days before)
