Design reasoning behind separate sunroof buttons

[gbell210]

My friend has asked me this before, and I couldn't come up with a good reason other than separate failure points and because its fun to have more buttons like a cockpit

But, why did Toyota decide to make the sunroof slide and tilt features separate buttons. Other cars in that era (for example BMW) only have 1 and it makes sense since you can't have a sunroof tilt open while it is slid back into the roof.

Anyone have the design reasoning behind this?

 

[Lka1988]

Dunno. I always thought the 1-button design was weird.

I guess Mr. T's design just makes more sense.

 

[IronYuppy]

It's a good question. IMO it's one of Toyota's weaker ergonomic designs.

I think a switch you have to hold while the motor works should be in an easuer space, like on the centre console. I knot it's a little annoyance, but I don't like having to hold my arm up there while I'm driving. I'd rather have it near where my arm is resting, or near the steering wheel.

Or better yet, a roof-mounted dial - reach up, select the position, and relax while the motor does its thing.

IMO VW got it right with the late 90s models:

 

[Grolar]

FWIW, My '05 Toyota has that design as well. It's not like they wouldn't have the time to correct it... I never thought about is as an annoyance, though. One is the "auto" electric window switch that's "auto" on its way down, but not up. Every morning I swipe a card to enter the parking lot and that missing feature really bugs me. But that remains minor IMHO compared to the huge assets the yotas (and 80s of course) enjoy.

 

[cruzer971]

I thought that my sister's '00 4Runner was weird because it only had one switch. I guess I'm just used to it, and I like the multi button cockpit feel.

 

[Bear80]

Every morning I swipe a card to enter the parking lot and that missing feature really bugs me.

This IS a feautre on non US models. There is a VERY simple way to enable it.

As for the sun roof, I've only desired to have an auto close feature. I can also see now why the controls are on the roof. After all the extra non US goodies are added there isn't any switch blanks left.

 

[Cj80cruiser]

I thought that my sister's '00 4Runner was weird because it only had one switch. I guess I'm just used to it, and I like the multi button cockpit feel.

I hated the one switch deal on the 4 runners cause when you try and close the sun roof you have to listen to the different noise it makes when it shuts versus when it shuts and starts to open the rear part of the sunroof. If you hold it too long the rear part of the sunroof trys to open. I always wondered if I held the switch too long and the rear slightly opened ready to let in every inch of rain while I was at work.

 

[Brian894X4]

The sunroof does 4 things.

1....it pops up

2....it comes down

3....it lowers and goes under the roof and slides back

4....it returns back to closed position.

It's pretty hard to have one toggle switch do 4 different things. That's why there are two 2 position switches.

A lot of other sunroofs that go back and under the roof like the LC don't have the pop up option. Sunroofs that open back and over the roof like my CRX and lot of older Hondas have the pop up option as the first action when you push the button, so if you push and then release, it will pop up only. If you push and then keep pushing it will continue backwards and open up all the way.

I suppose Toyota could have put a single 4 position switch up there, but Toyota seems pretty fond of 2 position toggle switches for most of its accessories in its vehicles. Especially from that period.

Another advantage of the two seperate switches is that you can open the sunroof the way you want without looking, by just feeling for the right switch.

 

[TX_TLC]

Our '01 Maxima GLE has the same feature and the same switches. The only thing that is a little nicer on the Maxima is that the open and close are also auto.

 

[landtank]

One is the "auto" electric window switch that's "auto" on its way down, but not up.

the mod for this has been around for years.

 

[IdahoDoug]

Some motivation for T would be liability. Auto shutting panels injure people and this was long before the arrival of pinch sensing auto up window technology. This sunroof's design was likely completed in 1988 and I don't think much in terms of alternatives were around yet. Also the separate switches prevents the needless cycles of a 1 switch design where as noted sometimes the user holds it too long and activates the vent function, then has to close that as well - creating both a driver distraction (safety, liability) and additional wear on the mechanism.

DougM

 

[Firedog]

Not meaning to hijack but, when my sunroof slides forward to close it stops about 6" short. I have to then release the button and push it again for it to close completely.
Is that normal? I assumed it was to keep you from closing something in the sunroof.

 

[96r50]

Not meaning to hijack but, when my sunroof slides forward to close it stops about 6" short. I have to then release the button and push it again for it to close completely.
Is that normal? I assumed it was to keep you from closing something in the sunroof.

Yes and yes.

 

[Grolar]

the mod for this has been around for years.

Agree... but you'd expect a top carmaker like Toyota to sell cars that haven't to be tweaked by their owners to be perfected on such a simple feature...

 

[96r50]

Agree... but you'd expect a top carmaker like Toyota to sell cars that haven't to be tweaked by their owners to be perfected on such a simple feature...

Buy a Lexus

I agree with you it would be nice. Actually a lot of the new Rav4s, Highlanders, and 4Runners are coming with the auto up & down for the driver.

 

[therealratfink]

It's a good question. IMO it's one of Toyota's weaker ergonomic designs.

I think a switch you have to hold while the motor works should be in an easuer space, like on the centre console. I knot it's a little annoyance, but I don't like having to hold my arm up there while I'm driving. I'd rather have it near where my arm is resting, or near the steering wheel.

Or better yet, a roof-mounted dial - reach up, select the position, and relax while the motor does its thing.

IMO VW got it right with the late 90s models:

For what it's worth, our 99 Passat had sunroof issues for years. You had to work the switch every spring to get the contacts clean.

 

[landtank]

Agree... but you'd expect a top carmaker like Toyota to sell cars that haven't to be tweaked by their owners to be perfected on such a simple feature...

I wouldn't be surprised at all if Toyota took it slow with this sort of feature considering the nature of this country's lawsuit policy. If you read my thread where I outlined this mod people thought it would kill children.

 

[gbell210]

I hated the one switch deal on the 4 runners cause when you try and close the sun roof you have to listen to the different noise it makes when it shuts versus when it shuts and starts to open the rear part of the sunroof. If you hold it too long the rear part of the sunroof trys to open. I always wondered if I held the switch too long and the rear slightly opened ready to let in every inch of rain while I was at work.

Right.. same thing with my father's '99 4Runner. I like the idea they tried to implement with this design, but there should have been some logic behind it that said... hey I just slide closed, to vent open the user has to let go of the button and close it again to go into the vent position.

After talking with my buddy, his sunroof in his E34 is really 3 buttons. Slide Forward and Back to operate open/close of the sliding portion. And then if you push directly up into the ceiling, that allows it to go into the vent position. To close from vent position, you slide the switch forward (which is like the universal close operation) His also has the one touch open/close as well though.

As far as our LC's, is there a trigger switch that says the sunroof has almost slid closed (is that what makes it stop short of closing?). If so, I think that kind of circuit could be used in the same manner to fully close it, then transition to the vent position. All with 1 button.

Anyway, this were just some minor design thoughts I had and wondered if one else thought about them too. Thanks for all the inputs.

 

[Grolar]

I wouldn't be surprised at all if Toyota took it slow with this sort of feature considering the nature of this country's lawsuit policy. If you read my thread where I outlined this mod people thought it would kill children.

That makes perfect sense indeed.