Dealer forgot to replace oil? (2 Viewers)

[jeddly]

Sad for this to be my first post, but here’s what appears to have happened to my 2011 lc200 with only 80k miles:
* brought into dealership for routine checkup, oil change and tire rotation
* did a few errands before returning home; parked it in the barn
* it sat for three days (not a DD)
* upon start, blows cloud of smoke (white/gray) - never happened before
* I check the oil: dipstick is sort of stuck, and there is no oil - at all.
No sign of any leaks on the floor, on the engine or undercarriage.
WTF?
Called dealership, they are goi g to arrange a tow to check it out.
If indeed they forgot to add oil, how much damage to the engine? Drove probably 30 miles? Does that seem possible? No lights were going off that I can remember …
Any tips for dealing with the dealership?!

 

[04UZJ100]

You likely didn’t make it 30 miles on no oil....hope for the best. Make sure you’re there to document absolutely everything as they pull it apart.

 

[jeddly]

@04UZJ100 - that’s exactly what I think, yet there isn’t any oil showing on the dipstick at all, and no apparent leaks.

the dealer called back and is arranging a tow back to the shop; they also stated that they have cameras all over and already reviewed. They said that they can see a technician pull the hose down (containing the oil), and that the tech was there for a few minutes, but they can’t actually see him adding oil …

 

[TeCKis300]

Uh, that sucks to hear. You'd be surprised how long it can run with no oil just causally driving as there's always some remaining enough for it to limp by. Just the same, the damage has been done and I wouldn't accept anything but a full up replacement longblock. That's also tricky as I hate rebuilt motors as that's subject to the skill of the shop or technician. I'd rather a used low mileage motor from a recycler. But as this is the dealership, should hold them to a higher level as that's why you're paying the higher prices and not an independent. New long block is what I would insist on.

If you're curious how much abuse an engine without oil will take:

 

[bryson]

It only takes maybe 2 quarts low to not register on the dipstick. In a system that holds close to 8 quarts, that doesn't necessarily mean catastrophic failure. Your engine would likely still run pretty happily on 6 quarts. Now that doesn't mean it is not really out of oil, but it's something to consider.

 

[04UZJ100]

Uh, that sucks to hear. You'd be surprised how long it can run with no oil just causally driving as there's always some remaining enough for it to limp by. Just the same, the damage has been done and I wouldn't accept anything but a full up replacement longblock. That's also tricky as I hate rebuilt motors as that's subject to the skill of the shop or technician. I'd rather a used low mileage motor from a recycler. But as this is the dealership, should hold them to a higher level as that's why you're paying the higher prices and not an independent. New long block is what I would insist on.

If you're curious how much abuse an engine without oil will take:

Reminds me of the sad cash for clunkers videos of Lexus LS400s just not dying.

 

[TheIcemanCometh]

Given the possible (legal) issue my suggestion would be to accompany the vehicle to the dealership so to document everything as they diagnosis it. For instance, I suspect they will drain the oil to see how much is there. You want to make sure the amount is accurate.

 

[MoJ]

Look around the oil filter for signs of a leak that would result from it not being tight enough or…entirely missing. The later unfortunately happened to my mother. She drove for a few days after an oil change before having catastrophic engine failure. No idea if the filter was loose and fell off or if it was never installed to begin with.

 

[jeddly]

Thanks all for your input! Really very much appreciated. My first LC and am not very knowledgeable yet, and am hoping for the best

 

[jeddly]

Look around the oil filter for signs of a leak that would result from it not being tight enough or…entirely missing. The later unfortunately happened to my mother. She drove for a few days after an oil change before having catastrophic engine failure. No idea if the filter was loose and fell off or if it was never installed to begin with.

Super clean, no leaks

 

[jeddly]

Given the possible (legal) issue my suggestion would be to accompany the vehicle to the dealership so to document everything as they diagnosis it. For instance, I suspect they will drain the oil to see how much is there. You want to make sure the amount is accurate.

You convinced me to go. It’s a trek off-island, but yes - they want to check the oil level and whether or not there are any metal shavings, so I should be there.

 

[TeCKis300]

It only takes maybe 2 quarts low to not register on the dipstick. In a system that holds close to 8 quarts, that doesn't necessarily mean catastrophic failure. Your engine would likely still run pretty happily on 6 quarts. Now that doesn't mean it is not really out of oil, but it's something to consider.

This is a good point and suggests we probably shouldn't overreact. There is definitely an low oil pressure switch and warning. The fact that the OP didn't see any light suggests there was at least sufficient oil pressure.

 

[Nooooooooob1]

Wow. Sorry to hear that. I'll have to keep up with this one.

 

[TimCFJ40]

As stated above, it is very likely they underfilled it, and added only 4-5 quarts rather than leaving it dry. I'm not certain what the low limit on the 5.7L is, but most engines will not even have the low oil pressure light come on until they're nearly down to 1/2-2/3 of full volume. The low oil pressure light comes on before the oil pump gets starved and bad things start to happen.

I'd bet the tech hit the 5 quart fill button he uses for all of the Camrys, and left you 2.5-3 quarts low. If this is the case (as evidenced by the dealership finding at least 4 quarts of oil in the pan), and the low oil pressure light didn't come on, the likelihood of lasting damage is very low.

While it is their mistake, the dealership should check the pan to make sure it was just underfilled, fill it correctly, apologize profusely, and that should do it. Asking for an engine replacement or similar would be unreasonable, and honestly could cause more issues than it solves.

 

[jeddly]

As stated above, it is very likely they underfilled it, and added only 4-5 quarts rather than leaving it dry. I'm not certain what the low limit on the 5.7L is, but most engines will not even have the low oil pressure light come on until they're nearly down to 1/2-2/3 of full volume. The low oil pressure light comes on before the oil pump gets starved and bad things start to happen.

I'd bet the tech hit the 5 quart fill button he uses for all of the Camrys, and left you 2.5-3 quarts low. If this is the case (as evidenced by the dealership finding at least 4 quarts of oil in the pan), and the low oil pressure light didn't come on, the likelihood of lasting damage is very low.

While it is their mistake, the dealership should check the pan to make sure it was just underfilled, fill it correctly, apologize profusely, and that should do it. Asking for an engine replacement or similar would be unreasonable, and honestly could cause more issues than it solves.

Thank you! I am nervous -- we bought this from the first owner with only 75K miles from N.M.; it's in great shape all around. Would be a crying shame to have damage to it from this simple oversight, but your comments give me hope. I'll report back later today with the findings ...

 

[Godwin]

Sad for this to be my first post, but here’s what appears to have happened to my 2011 lc200 with only 80k miles:
* brought into dealership for routine checkup, oil change and tire rotation
* did a few errands before returning home; parked it in the barn
* it sat for three days (not a DD)
* upon start, blows cloud of smoke (white/gray) - never happened before

I did not see this addressed in any of the replies. The white/gray cloud you saw after starting is likely normal condensation being blown out of the exhaust especially if it dissipated and disappeared once the engine was warm. On a cool, humid morning it is normal for the exhaust to produce a lot of condensation out the tail pipe.

 

[Cypress Cruiser]

With sales of the Land Cruiser being of such low volume, is selecting a dealership for routine maintenance an issue? I am a new owner of an LC200, any recommendations on Toyota dealership service centers in the Seattle/Redmond area?

The forums have identified independent shops (Torfab, Pacific Rim, Auburn Auto Repair and Offroad), but I would like to take advantage of the ToyotaCare maintenance plan while it is still free.

 

[CharlieS]

I’d rather do my own maintenance or go to an Indy than suffer the risks of free crappy dealer service.

 

[MrX]

Reminds me of the sad cash for clunkers videos of Lexus LS400s just not dying.

You don't happen to have any links of that, do you?

 

[jeddly]

Ok, here’s the update:
* It did have oil, albeit low considering it was changed a week earlier. No detected leaks.
* coolant was also a tad low, but I hadn’t checked that in a while, so unsure.
* normal cold start exhaust, and we didn’t get the same burning smell - or cloud — this time, so we couldn’t reproduce the issues that caused alarm. Could smell some coolant, but it went away after a bit of driving.

all we could think is that the change loosened up some gunk, and the three-day sit and then start combusted it, though we did another start the next day and got same.

not sure what to think except to watch it, otherwise we only topped the oil and coolant. At 80k, head gasket should be fine for a while …

I