Considering replacing my 96 Tacoma with a 100 series (1 Viewer)

[SaturnAscends]

After going from a 97 Land Cruiser to a 96 Tacoma, I am regretting giving up all the interior space. and durability of a Land Cruiser, and am also looking for something better suited to a daily half-hour commute, while also perhaps being more resistant to frame rust when driven in wintry conditions.

I'm also considering a GX470, but am leaning towards a 100 series for the stronger 9.5" rear diff, the extra space, and the availability of a rear locker in the 98-99 models. However, I could be swayed toward the GX since they seem to command lower prices compared to the UZJ100.

However, I had a few concerns. I'd heard of issues with the ATRAC overloading the R&P on the front diffs, even in light snow. I'd prefer the 98-99 models for this reason; I prefer the idea of a rear locker instead, even if they do have the weaker front diffs from the factory (I figure most of those would be replaced by now?) Is there any insight on this issue? I figured maybe a front LSD would help as well..

Also, how do they compare with an 80 series in wintry conditions, in terms of performance and rust-resistance?

Will it be too big and ungainly for the narrow muddy tracks we have here in northwest Arkansas? My 80 series seemed to get bogged down relatively easily in these conditions with open diffs where a lighter Tacoma would crawl through easily.

Finally, is the usual (deferred) maintenance/baselining process less expensive and painstaking than that of an FZJ80? From what I've researched, they seem to have sealed bearings, obviating the obligatory front axle rebuilds on the 80 series, and the 2UZ doesn't seem to need top-end rebuilds every 200k like the 1fz; however, they do appear to have their own quirks, like cracked manifolds, etc.

Anyway, I'm sorry for the long-winded post, but I'd appreciate any insights on any of this from current owners. Thanks.

 

[jLB]

After going from a 97 Land Cruiser to a 96 Tacoma, I am regretting giving up all the interior space. and durability of a Land Cruiser, and am also looking for something better suited to a daily half-hour commute, while also perhaps being more resistant to frame rust when driven in wintry conditions.

I'm also considering a GX470, but am leaning towards a 100 series for the stronger 9.5" rear diff, the extra space, and the availability of a rear locker in the 98-99 models. However, I could be swayed toward the GX since they seem to command lower prices compared to the UZJ100.

However, I had a few concerns. I'd heard of issues with the ATRAC overloading the R&P on the front diffs, even in light snow. I'd prefer the 98-99 models for this reason; I prefer the idea of a rear locker instead, even if they do have the weaker front diffs from the factory (I figure most of those would be replaced by now?) Is there any insight on this issue? I figured maybe a front LSD would help as well..

Also, how do they compare with an 80 series in wintry conditions, in terms of performance and rust-resistance?

Will it be too big and ungainly for the narrow muddy tracks we have here in northwest Arkansas? My 80 series seemed to get bogged down relatively easily in these conditions with open diffs where a lighter Tacoma would crawl through easily.

Finally, is the usual (deferred) maintenance/baselining process less expensive and painstaking than that of an FZJ80? From what I've researched, they seem to have sealed bearings, obviating the obligatory front axle rebuilds on the 80 series, and the 2UZ doesn't seem to need top-end rebuilds every 200k like the 1fz; however, they do appear to have their own quirks, like cracked manifolds, etc.

Anyway, I'm sorry for the long-winded post, but I'd appreciate any insights on any of this from current owners. Thanks.

I do understand the regret, after going from a 94 LC, to an 04 T4R.

Lusting after the 98-99 rear locker (which also includes the 2-pinion front diff), and whining about ATRAC breaking front diffs, seems “off” to me. Aftermarket lockers do seem to enhance front diff durability.

As someone that lives in a snow “once in a blue moon” area, and has both VSC/ATRAC vehicles, and non-VSC/ATRAC vehicles, on an ice/snow day, I’m taking a vehicle “with” VSC/ATRAC.

As far as size, I don’t notice much difference in size between an 80 & 100 series.

No, the deferred maintenance is about the same.

 

[SaturnAscends]

I do understand the regret, after going from a 94 LC, to an 04 T4R.

Lusting after the 98-99 rear locker (which also includes the 2-pinion front diff), and whining about ATRAC breaking front diffs, seems “off” to me. Aftermarket lockers do seem to enhance front diff durability.

As someone that lives in a snow “once in a blue moon” area, and has both VSC/ATRAC vehicles, and non-VSC/ATRAC vehicles, on an ice/snow day, I’m taking a vehicle “with” VSC/ATRAC.

As far as size, I don’t notice much difference in size between an 80 & 100 series.

No, the deferred maintenance is about the same.

I appreciate the reply, but I'm not sure where you saw I was "whining" about the ATRAC system. I was simply wanting more info. I refer to the post below in the thread linked below, by a very respected LC specialist btw. I know this is an old thread, hence why I was seeking further insights.

Also, I'm curious why you say the baselining is the about the same as an 80 series. I thought the 4.7 didn't have as many common leaks as the old inline six, but I could be wrong.

John, you need to come up here and visit the shop a little, then your mighty opinion on the 100 will change. Believe me I love them, but I am not blind.

I know of 7 trucks that broke front ring and pinions in the last storm, including mine. I attribute it to that s***ty TRAC system. Some broke while wifes drove it in driveways. The 2 pinion vs 4 pinion has nothing to do with these breakages. All had a common theme, they just snapped a tooth due while tires were spinning and grabbing traction on snowed in roads.

You can also come an look at the 4 or so A Arms that we have repalced in the last two months due to creaking ball joints. NO, you can not just buy the ball joint on it's own.

PS, I am building your next 100, just send check and I will deliver it at Moab.

100 Series vs 80 Series

Shotts-you really are too much. You wern't there, yet you wouldn't have backed down. Easy to say. Webwheeling at it's best. I was there, and advised Amando to back down. Had he broken there, (and I believe he would have looking at those front wheels pointing at each otherand hearing the...

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[jLB]

I appreciate the reply, but I'm not sure where you saw I was "whining" about the ATRAC system. I was simply wanting more info. I refer to the post below in the thread linked below, by a very respected LC specialist btw. I know this is an old thread, hence why I was seeking further insights.

Also, I'm curious why you say the baselining is the about the same as an 80 series. I thought the 4.7 didn't have as many common leaks as the old inline six, but I could be wrong.

100 Series vs 80 Series

Shotts-you really are too much. You wern't there, yet you wouldn't have backed down. Easy to say. Webwheeling at it's best. I was there, and advised Amando to back down. Had he broken there, (and I believe he would have looking at those front wheels pointing at each otherand hearing the...

forum.ih8mud.com

Being drawn to a 98-99 pre-VSC/ATRAC, with 2-pinion front differential, because of a perceived weakness in 4-pinion ATRAC vehicles, seems “upside down” to me, but what do I know… If it’s a real concern, add a front locker.

Head gaskets & PHH, vs timing belts & heater T’s.

While the areas of focus are different, I see similar amounts of maintenance/baseline.

 

[97 AZ LC]

I appreciate the reply, but I'm not sure where you saw I was "whining" about the ATRAC system.

Well if you're not whining about ATRAC you should be. Then read up on VSC and whine about that too. They come as a package. It sounds to me like you're on the right track to be looking for a 98-99.

 

[SaturnAscends]

Being drawn to a 98-99 pre-VSC/ATRAC, with 2-pinion front differential, because of a perceived weakness in 4-pinion ATRAC vehicles, seems “upside down” to me, but what do I know…

Head gaskets & PHH, vs timing belts & heater T’s.

While the areas of focus are different, I see similar amounts of maintenance/baseline.

I was thinking most of the 2-pinion diffs had been replaced by now, but that's really just conjecture on my part. Can't you swap in a 4-pinion diff relatively easily, maybe with an LSD to increase strength?

To me, timing belts and heater T's seem easier to deal with than head gaskets, arch seals, worn rings etc. in the FZJ80.

 

[SaturnAscends]

Well if you're not whining about ATRAC you should be. Then read up on VSC and whine about that too. They come as a package. It sounds to me like you're on the right track to be looking for a 98-99.

I would go for another 80 series but it's very hard to find a reasonablly clean one that isn;t totally ragged out. If a decent 96-97 came up for a reasonable price I'd jump on it though.

As I said I'm also looking at GX470s; I'm not sure if they've also had front diff issues associated with ATRAC/VSC? Maybe the extra weight of the 100 series causes more breakage, idk.

 

[jLB]

I was thinking most of the 2-pinion diffs had been replaced by now, but that's really just conjecture on my part. Can't you swap in a 4-pinion diff relatively easily, maybe with an LSD to increase strength?

To me, timing belts and heater T's seem easier to deal with than head gaskets, arch seals, worn rings etc. in the FZJ80.

98-99 front diffs were 2-pinion from the factory, 00-07 were 4 pinion. Throttle, wheel RPM, and sudden traction probably have more to do with front diff breakage, than ATRAC.

CV axle rebuild is just as bad as a birfield rebuild.

I find the 80 to 100 series weight difference trivial.

The IFS is a learning difference from the solid axle 80, but you should’ve learned that with a Tacoma.

Talk to me again after doing a starter replacement on a 2UZ-FE, and comparing to a 1FZ-FE

 

[SaturnAscends]

98-99 front diffs were 2-pinion from the factory, 00-07 were 4 pinion. Throttle, wheel RPM, and sudden traction probably have more to do with front diff breakage, than ATRAC.

Talk to me again after doing a starter replacement on a 2UZ-FE, and comparing to a 1FZ-FE

Yea I had heard of the starter job being a PITA on the 2UZ.

Surely many of the 2 pinion diffs have been swapped out for the newer version by now?

I’m not necessarily opposed to ATRAC, I’d just heard rumours it could possibly contribute to front diff failure in some cases. I’m not claiming to be an authority on these topics though.

 

[jLB]

Yea I had heard of the starter job being a PITA on the 2UZ.

Surely many of the 2 pinion diffs have been swapped out for the newer version by now?

I’m not necessarily opposed to ATRAC, I’d just heard rumours it could possibly contribute to front diff failure in some cases. I’m not claiming to be an authority on these topics though.

Depends on the previous owner, and what they’ve done with it. 4 pinion diff = better, locker = even better.

 

[97 AZ LC]

Yea I had heard of the starter job being a PITA on the 2UZ.

Surely many of the 2 pinion diffs have been swapped out for the newer version by now?

I’m not necessarily opposed to ATRAC, I’d just heard rumours it could possibly contribute to front diff failure in some cases. I’m not claiming to be an authority on these topics though.

Most of the 2 pinions are going strong - they don't have ATRAC. The starter is likely to be replaced only once in the life of the vehicle, twice at the most, so not really a big deal.

 

[jLB]

Most of the 2 pinions are going strong - they don't have ATRAC.

In contrast, so are most of the 4 pinions, with ATRAC.

The starter is likely to be replaced only once in the life of the vehicle, twice at the most, so not really a big deal.

I’ve got one that needed it at ~100k mi (same with my old 80 series). I’ve got another 100 series, with 260k+ miles, on the original starter. I guess it depends on the luck of the draw, and your idea of “life of the vehicle”.

I take it that you’re not arguing against an 80 series starter replacement, is easily done in a parking lot, where a 100 series is much less so? You’re just saying that it’s infrequent enough that it doesn’t matter?

 

[Trunk Monkey]

I don't know why you'd think most of the 2 pinion diffs have been replaced with 4 pinion diffs? It's not something people are doing as a PM item, mostly only done when the diff breaks and then it's usually replaced with a locker. In the microcosm of Mud, I bet there's only a few dozen 98/99 trucks that have replaced the front 2 pinion. Outside of Mud, the thousands of 100's that are out there, I would bet that those that have broken the front diff have had them replaced with 2 pinion diffs at the dealer.

Anyway, for your ask about Taco vs. 100 and coming from an 80, a 100 is a pig on tight trails and from my experience, does poorly in mud lockers or not. For maintenance, same basic hub setup as the 80, needs greasing or replacing every so often. Don't know about your comment either of a HG on the 80 every 200k miles, again, not every person's experience and not universal.

 

[SaturnAscends]

I don't know why you'd think most of the 2 pinion diffs have been replaced with 4 pinion diffs? It's not something people are doing as a PM item, mostly only done when the diff breaks and then it's usually replaced with a locker. In the microcosm of Mud, I bet there's only a few dozen 98/99 trucks that have replaced the front 2 pinion. Outside of Mud, the thousands of 100's that are out there, I would bet that those that have broken the front diff have had them replaced with 2 pinion diffs at the dealer.

Anyway, for your ask about Taco vs. 100 and coming from an 80, a 100 is a pig on tight trails and from my experience, does poorly in mud lockers or not. For maintenance, same basic hub setup as the 80, needs greasing or replacing every so often. Don't know about your comment either of a HG on the 80 every 200k miles, again, not every person's experience and not universal.

I must be mistaken on the extent of the diff breakages/replacements. I thought I remembered there was a recall or service campaign, but I must be wrong.

Would you say the 100 series struggles in muddy terrain due to its sheer weight? I wonder if a GX470 would be any better in slick, tight trails.

Those are the conditions where the little Tacoma excels IME, as opposed to Moab-style “rock-crawling” trails with more constant traction and larger obstacles, where the heavy duty drivetrain of the LC comes into its own.

Thanks.

 

[krice118]

As a 98 owner- get an 03+ as your starting base.

 

[SaturnAscends]

As a 98 owner- get an 03+ as your starting base.

I’m curious what makes you say that; is it the 5-speed transmission?

 

[JunkCrzr89]

I second everything that @jLB and @Trunk Monkey said above.

Very small percentage of the 98-99 vehicles with 2-pinion front diffs have been replaced with an 00-02 4-pinion. I also don’t think ATRAC has much to do with the breakage. Lift a wheel, goose the throttle, and slam that wheel down and it will break the diff whether it has ATRAC or not. Conceptually, an ATRAC-equipped 100 should have lower probability of breakage in said scenario because the ATRAC will cut power to the lifted wheel.

My 80 has 352k miles on the original HG, so the 200k-mile HG interval on the 1FZ trope is nonsense (will prob blow tomorrow now that I said that). Timing belt jobs every 90k miles on the 2uz kinda sucks, starter replacement sucks, steering rack replacement sucks, but keep up with maintenance and the 2uz might last 1-million miles. Same front wheel bearing maintenance on the 80 and 100 - not being sealed bearings is a GREAT THING. Sealed front wheel bearings on the 96+ 4Runner/GX/Taco absolutely suck to replace and I sold every vehicle that had that $hitty design.

Multiple guys on here wheel all over Arkansas, Missouri, etc in their 100s. Maybe they’ll chime in about the trails. @OwnerCS ?

 

[jLB]

As a 98 owner- get an 03+ as your starting base.

As a 99, and a 06 owner, I don’t disagree. I love both, but if a child or spouse is involved, I lean 03+.

 

[SaturnAscends]

I second everything that @jLB and @Trunk Monkey said above.

Very small percentage of the 98-99 vehicles with 2-pinion front diffs have been replaced with an 00-02 4-pinion. I also don’t think ATRAC has much to do with the breakage. Lift a wheel, goose the throttle, and slam that wheel down and it will break the diff whether it has ATRAC or not. Conceptually, an ATRAC-equipped 100 should have lower probability of breakage in said scenario because the ATRAC will cut power to the lifted wheel.

My 80 has 352k miles on the original HG, so the 200k-mile HG interval on the 1FZ trope is nonsense (will prob blow tomorrow now that I said that). Timing belt jobs every 90k miles on the 2uz kinda sucks, starter replacement sucks, steering rack replacement sucks, but keep up with maintenance and the 2uz might last 1-million miles. Same front wheel bearing maintenance on the 80 and 100 - not being sealed bearings is a GREAT THING. Sealed front wheel bearings on the 96+ 4Runner/GX/Taco absolutely suck to replace and I sold every vehicle that had that $hitty design.

Multiple guys on here wheel all over Arkansas, Missouri, etc in their 100s. Maybe they’ll chime in about the trails. @OwnerCS ?

Does your 352k mile 80 burn much oil? At 230k my HG and bottom end was solid, but it was burning and leaking a fair bit of oil, I think partly from the valve stem seals and arch seal, both of which are not very novice-friendly jobs. From what I researched this is not uncommon for 80s around this mileage. Rings were also a little worn.

Also, the timing belt can be a pain, but it also seems to encourage better coolant maintenance, whereas people will just let the old coolant sit for decades in the timing chain-driven 1FZ, which could contribute to HG issues.

To be honest I'd still prefer an 80 series for its simplicity and durability, but as I said it seems much harder to find a well-kept example compared to 100s.

honestly the GX470 might be the best value now that I think about it, since they all have the 5-speeds and still are seen as "just a used car" by most people, without the Cruiser/Tacoma tax.

 

[D21FJ60]

My experience with a high mileage 99 that I got 3 years ago and haven’t been able to get alot done on, here’s some maintenance to look out for:

Front wheel bearings
Front cv axle boot rips
Steering rack
Power steering pump leaking
Power steering soft hoses leaking (These will cause alternator to fail)
Serpentine tensioner
Radiator browning
Heater hose t’s
Soft transmission cooler lines
Metal transmission cooler lines behind grill rusting out
Spare tire carrier rusting out
Rear crossmember frame rust
Third row ac leak
Windshield cracks
Driver window switches not working
Valve cover gaskets leaking
Uhh ripped leather seats

So no, not a top end rebuild but still plenty to do