Clutch Replacement Time? How can you tell?

Discussion in '60-Series Wagons' started by 87CRUSR, Jun 27, 2005.

  1. 87CRUSR

    87CRUSR SILVER Star

    Messages:
    1,968
    Media:
    10
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    519
    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2003
    Location:
    So Cal
    What are the symptoms of a clutch is going bad (not girls gone wild)?
    When engaging first it seems like the clutch pedal is almost all the way out before it engages. Is this a sign or is a simple adjusment all that is needed?

    Thanks
     
  2. cahilc

    cahilc

    Messages:
    1,067
    Likes Received:
    2
    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2004
    Location:
    Dry Fork, WV
    There is a pedal adjustment from the inside under the dash. Might get a bit more miles this way but not a tons of miles.

    If you can basically do the cluth on demand, then I'd wait until it starts slipping, then pull the trigger and get-r-done quick with flywheel resurface.

    If not able to do on demand, sounds like a clutch job is in your need future.

    Also possible to pull the inspection plate underneath and get a visual check to verify.

    Either case it sounds like your in 'clutch-needs-to-get-done' time.

    Cheers,
    Cahil

    P.S. Check this thread for more info ...
    https://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=22002&highlight=mucxh
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2005
  3. Live to Ski

    Live to Ski

    Messages:
    989
    Likes Received:
    150
    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2005
    Location:
    Dana Point/San Diego CA
    All righty, I'm in the same boat.

    I pulled the inspection cover and measured approximately 5/16 of clutch thickness. Now the FSM says in order to inspect the clutch, you need to remove and measure rivet/surface distance.

    Anyone have any idea how to estimate wear w/o removing? I'm not slipping, but I hear when it goes, it goes quick.
     
  4. 87CRUSR

    87CRUSR SILVER Star

    Messages:
    1,968
    Media:
    10
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    519
    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2003
    Location:
    So Cal
    I had the same symptoms. A new clutch and now it engages alot sooner as I am releasing the clutch
     
  5. PAFJ

    PAFJ

    Messages:
    1,644
    Media:
    17
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    6
    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2005
    Location:
    Roseville, CA
    What year is your 60? If pre 4/85 you can adjust the push rod at the slave cylinder as well.

    Good Luck-
     
  6. Live to Ski

    Live to Ski

    Messages:
    989
    Likes Received:
    150
    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2005
    Location:
    Dana Point/San Diego CA
    It's an '87. Does anyone have a new clutch that's not installed? If so, could you measure the friction plate overall thickness and post?
     
  7. bigbrowndog

    bigbrowndog

    Messages:
    1,662
    Likes Received:
    17
    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2005
    Location:
    N.Q. australia
    it should be measured from the rivet face to the clutch lining face to be correct.
     
  8. Rusty

    Rusty

    Messages:
    477
    Likes Received:
    3
    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2006
    Location:
    Abbotsford, British Columbia, Canada
    I've never worn out a Crusier clutch... come to think of it I've never worn out any clutch... but generally you can tell if a clutch is slipping, you'll know... if you're really not sure drive the truck normally shifting into 2nd or 3rd gear (in a 5spd, or 2nd in a 4spd). At a normal driving speed and engine RPM shift into the highest gear and open the throttle aggresively. If the engine lugs like hell it's not slipping, if the engine RPM's rise with no vehicle speed increase your clutch is toast.
     
  9. Live to Ski

    Live to Ski

    Messages:
    989
    Likes Received:
    150
    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2005
    Location:
    Dana Point/San Diego CA
    How do you measure from rivet face to clutch lining face with the clutch still in the vehicle?
     
  10. freeamerica

    freeamerica

    Messages:
    291
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2003
    Since I just replaced a clutch this weekend this is still pretty fresh.

    I do not see any way to measure the rivit to disk surface without removing the clutch disk from the truck. Even then it would be a trick to get a truely accurate measurement. I won't have time before this weekend, but I could measure the outside thickness of my new clutch as installed so you can compare to your current.

    Live to Ski: From what you describe, if the 5/16 is the full side to side thickness, you are really close to not having a clutch.

    Either way, you can adjust the pedal travel distance under the dash, but this will buy you a few weeks at most for a daily driver. Every time I've gone through a clutch on a Cruiser it has literally just "gone" and it was all I could do to limp it home. If this happens, you'll get really good at double clutching and shifting by RMP in a big hurry, or you'll get home in 1st gear. :)

    If you are mechanically inclined replacing a clutch in a 60 is a big job, but not a difficult job. Now that I've done it a couple of times, I can get from pulling the 60 in the garage to back out again in about 10 hours and that is taking my time and having a few beers along the way. I can give you some tricks that will help save time, but mostly it is just laborous to muscle the tranny/transfer out and back in again.
     
  11. GLTHFJ60

    GLTHFJ60 Rum Runnin' SILVER Star

    Messages:
    23,491
    Likes Received:
    7,969
    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2005
    Location:
    Durham, NC
    Doesn't anyone know how to shift without using the clutch at all? Let's say that if your clutch goes to the point that it slips almost endlessly, you can start the truck in gear if it is in first. Then, on the fly you can shift the transmission without using the clutch at all, as long as you match the rpm's to each gear that you are shifting into. For example, one would shift out of 1st at 15 and 3k rpms, and then match the rpm's to shift into 2nd at lets say 13, so maybe 1500 at 13mph.

    Does anyone know what I am talking about?
     
  12. bigbrowndog

    bigbrowndog

    Messages:
    1,662
    Likes Received:
    17
    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2005
    Location:
    N.Q. australia
    you can't ,,so what does that tell you... it needs to be taken out to be measured correctly.

    The pages from the workshop manual are in this post. cheers
    https://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=113159
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2006
  13. Live to Ski

    Live to Ski

    Messages:
    989
    Likes Received:
    150
    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2005
    Location:
    Dana Point/San Diego CA
    Well, I won't be replacing any clutches in the near future as my old, wobbley just rebuilt knee (this past april) needs another tune up (kinda like my LC). Heading up to PC utah sunday with surgery this Tuesday.

    freeamerica: I do have the FSM, but any hints you can send my way would be most appreciated.

    I figure I'll modify the TC for 2L while it's out and maybe slap in a 55. Just dreams now though.

    Wish me luck!
     
  14. KANE

    KANE

    Messages:
    98
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2006
    Location:
    The Palm Springs of Washington
    I drove my 85 around for about 6 months with the clutch obviously slipping. It wasn't that big a deal on flat land, but going up hill sucked (major slippage). I go re-aquainted with the fine art of clutchless shifting.

    I replaced the clutch disk, pressure plate, throwout bearing, pilot bearing, slave cylinder & brake master cylinder last winter adn the rig feels brand new. I agree with freeamerica that it isn't a difficult job, just a little strenuous fighting with the tranny/transfer case. Borrow or rent a transmission jack. It will save your arse. It is a full day + job as you'll have to get the flywheel resurfaced once removed (+ drink lots of :beer: ).

    Make sure you resurface the flywheel or make certain it is done if you have someone else do the job. Some people/shops skip this step. The resurface should only cost around $30.

    Also replaced the engine rear main seal, which is a no-brainer when you're in that deep already.
     
  15. freeamerica

    freeamerica

    Messages:
    291
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2003
    CAUTION - these are not factory authorized procedures, if you f' something up or hurt yourself, it ain't my fault!

    Clutch replacement tips (in no particular order):

    1. Airtools - you can do it without, but an impact wrench, even a cheap one, will save at least an hour of wrenching time.

    2. You don't need to pull the tranny hump on a 60, just the shifter boots. There is barely enough clearance to sneak it out/in if you do #4

    3. LEAVE THE CROSSMEMBER ON THE TRANNY!!! Everything says to remove the crossmember and use a tranny jack. I have found it MUCH easier to leave the crossmember attached to the tranny and use a big floor jack to move the tranny in/out. The crossmember acts almost like a downrigger and makes controlling the tranny much easier as you manouver between the block and the floor. In fact once out, I just push the jack/tranny/tcase to the rear axle and work in front of it. Why even muscle it out from under the truck.

    Leave the crossmember bolted to the frame while you unbolt everything that needs unbolting (tranny to bellhousing, driveshafts, electrical connections, shift levers, etc.). The last thing after placing your floor jack is to unbolt the crossmember from the frame. Now start pulling the tranny back.

    4. FSM makes no mention of whether to support the engine or not. I use the OEM bottle jack and a 2x4 under the oil pan with just enough pressure to control the tilt of the engine block once you remove the crossmember. Basically, for removal, I keep the block/tranny as level as possible while clearing the pilot bearing and clutch plates. But you hit the tranny hump before you can get all the way out. At this point, I slowly drop the tranny, and the engine block (using the bottle jack) until the engine just barely has any pressure on the 2x4. This angle will allow you to finish pulling the tranny out and down from the engine.

    Reverse for install.

    5. Replace the rear main seal. Do it! I don't care if it is leaking or not, just change the damn thing will ya...?!?! You know it's gonna start leaking the day after you finish your clutch...

    5b. When you pull the old seal, trim off the excess gasket material and use on top of the new seal when you are tapping it into place. Or spend the money for the SST.

    6. To get 2L, when you put the t-case shifter back on, make sure you throw out the bracket that prevents you from shifting into 2L. Don't waste your time trying to modify or bend it. Just throw the damn thing away it doesn't do anything else.

    7. If you have time, this is a good opportunity to flush your clutch hydraulics. You certainly don't need to just because you replace the clutch, but once complete you'll basically have all "new and happy" shifting stuff. Make sure your clutch slave isn't leaking while you are under there. If so, replace it, which then requires you to flush the system.

    If I think of more, I'll let you know.
     
  16. Darkrealms

    Darkrealms

    Messages:
    681
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2005
    Location:
    OR, USA
    Uh, when my clutch went out I was pretty much coasting down the road at 45mph in 4th with the tach trying to pin on me. . .

    . . . but that may just be me. I had a lot of slipping, I wasn't getting the power I should, I was have a hard time on the line when starting to go.
     
  17. Live to Ski

    Live to Ski

    Messages:
    989
    Likes Received:
    150
    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2005
    Location:
    Dana Point/San Diego CA
    So, when I recover enough to even contemplate the job, is this possible as a 1 person operations.......or?

    freeamerica: just out of curiosity, when you get a chance, could you measure the friction plate thickness of your recently installed new clutch?
     
  18. Darkrealms

    Darkrealms

    Messages:
    681
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2005
    Location:
    OR, USA
    Live to Ski didn't actually do it my self but from everyone I talked to, they wouldn't recommend doing it solo.
    For one thing if something happened you wouldn't have any help and the tranny isn't that light.
     
  19. CJF

    CJF

    Messages:
    7,249
    Likes Received:
    2,205
    Joined:
    May 31, 2005
    I know exactly what you're talking about, but it doesn't apply in this situation. What you're talking about is how to drive it when the clutch won't disengage (lost the hydraulics, or whatever). It won't do anything to alleviate a badly slipping (ie, won't engage) clutch.

    Curtis
     
  20. Live to Ski

    Live to Ski

    Messages:
    989
    Likes Received:
    150
    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2005
    Location:
    Dana Point/San Diego CA
    Thanks guys. I get the picture now. 2 person,one weekend,tranny lift, beer!
     
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.