Brake upgrade (1 Viewer)

[Destinys Dad]

Hi Everyone,

This is my first foray into heavily modified 40’s. As part of my engineering requirements for registration, to accomodate the v8 that has been installed, I have a requirement to “upgrade the brakes”. The engineer tells me that it’ll need to be more significant than braided brake lines. I’ve been told these things will fit but no one around here knows much about it:

Calipers

Has anyone had any experience with this upgrade? If so, I’d. be interested to understand what discs you used with them as I think mine would be too thin.

Does anyone have any knowledge or resource they could share?

Thanks,
Jim

 

[pjohnson]

Welcome to Mud!

Can you provide a few more details about your 40?
What year? What other modifications?
Do you have OEM disk brakes or an upgrade 'kit'?

And of course, pics are always helpful.

 

[pb4ugo]

In the US, disc brakes were offered from 1976 and later, so most folks would swap out the disc components from the knuckles out. This keeps all the parts stk Toyota. I believe the Calipers you reference along with the proper rotors would fit on to the stk disc knuckles and such.

 

[Destinys Dad]

Hi Everyone,

This is my first foray into heavily modified 40’s. As part of my engineering requirements for registration, to accomodate the v8 that has been installed, I have a requirement to “upgrade the brakes”. The engineer tells me that it’ll need to be more significant than braided brake lines. I’ve been told these things will fit but no one around here knows much about it:

Calipers

Has anyone had any experience with this upgrade or can suggest an alternative? If so, I’d. be interested to understand what discs you used with them as I think mine would be too thin.

Does anyone have any knowledge or resource they could share?

Thanks,
Jim

Welcome to Mud!

Can you provide a few more details about your 40?
What year? What other modifications?
Do you have OEM disk brakes or an upgrade 'kit'?

And of course, pics are always helpful.

It’s a 1978, with 2 inch suspension lift, extended shackles and 2 inch body lift. I believe the current setup is the OEM conversion, but am happy to go with any setup that will get me through inspection (and keep me alive).

I am waiting on delivery as I bought it from the other side of the country, so will post some pics when it arrives next week.

 

[Downey]

I'm certainly not opposed to disc brake conversions, but know that I drove a 300 horse power Chevota, towing a fully self contained travel trailer for 3 years with drum brakes, soooooo I wouldn't say you absolutely have to have disc brakes. The bigger problem is trying to hold your rig on a steep hill side with 33" or bigger tires and drum brakes.

 

[pjohnson]

It’s a 1978, with 2 inch suspension lift, extended shackles and 2 inch body lift. I believe the current setup is the OEM conversion, but am happy to go with any setup that will get me through inspection (and keep me alive).

With OEM, you should be able to upgrade your rotors and calipers using the 4-runner calipers and FJ60 rotors. You may have to slightly grind a casting nub off the caliper body depending on the wheels you are running.

 

[pjohnson]

This may help a bit:

76 Brake and Caliper options

Hi everyone, I'm in the process of getting this 76 FJ40 back on the road but I'm missing the calipers and rotors. I've been searching the tech pages and searching the site in general but not finding much on better calipers and vented rotors for a 76 with the smaller Knuckles and warn hubs. I...

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[Dread Scott]

This may help a bit:

76 Brake and Caliper options

Hi everyone, I'm in the process of getting this 76 FJ40 back on the road but I'm missing the calipers and rotors. I've been searching the tech pages and searching the site in general but not finding much on better calipers and vented rotors for a 76 with the smaller Knuckles and warn hubs. I...

forum.ih8mud.com

I'm certainly not opposed to disc brake conversions, but know that I drove a 300 horse power Chevota, towing a fully self contained travel trailer for 3 years with drum brakes, soooooo I wouldn't say you absolutely have to have disc brakes. The bigger problem is trying to hold your rig on a steep hill side with 33" or bigger tires and drum brakes.

He is asking about discs because his country is requiring the upgrade for the purpose of registering it.

 

[pjohnson]

He is asking about discs because his country is requiring the upgrade for the purpose of registering it.

Yes. He also says that he already has OEM disc brakes. The only real upgrade path he has is rotors and calipers. Hence his original ask about the calipers on fleabay.

It would have been more helpful if the engineer he mentions would have given him some guidance as to what should be upgraded.

 

[Dread Scott]

Yes. He also says that he already has OEM disc brakes. The only real upgrade path he has is rotors and calipers. Hence his original ask about the calipers on fleabay.

It would have been more helpful if the engineer he mentions would have given him some guidance as to what should be upgraded.

Agree. 78 front disc only, rear drum.

 

[Destinys Dad]

I'm certainly not opposed to disc brake conversions, but know that I drove a 300 horse power Chevota, towing a fully self contained travel trailer for 3 years with drum brakes, soooooo I wouldn't say you absolutely have to have disc brakes. The bigger problem is trying to hold your rig on a steep hill side with 33" or bigger tires and drum brakes.

I agree, I’ve had some fast cars with drum brakes that pulled up fine. This is a requirement to have it registered where I live. Without an upgrade I won’t be able to have it on the road.

 

[Destinys Dad]

Yes. He also says that he already has OEM disc brakes. The only real upgrade path he has is rotors and calipers. Hence his original ask about the calipers on fleabay.

It would have been more helpful if the engineer he mentions would have given him some guidance as to what should be upgraded.

He is not allowed to provide specific advice. He is limited to advising me what the law states and then help me reach the minimum standard (at least). The law states “brakes must be upgraded from standard if the increased horsepower exceeds 20% gain”. As the disc brake front are considered standard so he said I’d need to go one step further.

The guidance was upgraded calipers, discs and braided lines would be enough to pass it. He said if I can find a disc brake rear end it would also help but wouldn’t be necessary.

 

[Destinys Dad]

With OEM, you should be able to upgrade your rotors and calipers using the 4-runner calipers and FJ60 rotors. You may have to slightly grind a casting nub off the caliper body depending on the wheels you are running.

Thanks. I will source some 60 series discs and see how we go. Thanks for the advice. This was exactly what I was looking for

 

[Destinys Dad]

Thanks to everyone for their help. I think you’ve all given me what I need

 

[cruiser182]

Seems like a very ambiguous regulation, is there any performance testing involved? A bit of useless info but in NZ, the equivalent certification involves multiple stops from 100km/h within a specified time period to test brake fade. Hence people often run a very aggressive brake pad and some high-temp fluid to pass the test.

I have LN130 calipers like the one's in your ebay link on mine (stock FJ40 discs), unsure if they make it stop any quicker but they have bigger pistons, so your engineer should consider it an upgrade. One thing to check would be the clearance between the caliper and wheel that you have now, because if it's marginal now then the new calipers will likely rub on the outer ribs.

 

[JAG666]

I'm certainly not opposed to disc brake conversions, but know that I drove a 300 horse power Chevota, towing a fully self contained travel trailer for 3 years with drum brakes, soooooo I wouldn't say you absolutely have to have disc brakes. The bigger problem is trying to hold your rig on a steep hill side with 33" or bigger tires and drum brakes.

Jim;
I stuffed a 429cid Caddy (& TH400) into my '74LC (about 350HP & ft lbs of torque) and towed a 23', 6000lb travel trailer around from '78 till '92 with the stock four wheel drum brakes (rims & tires) I did use an Equalizer Hitch, Equalizer Bars, Sway Bars (two!), etc. Had to "pump" the brake pedal once or twice to slow, three to four times to actually STOP!! and that was WITHOUT the Trailer!! The FJ40 actually stopped FASTER with the Trailer's Electric Brakes!! Other than that, the rest of the '74 FJ40 was bone stock!
Charles 1974 FJ40

 

[Destinys Dad]

Seems like a very ambiguous regulation, is there any performance testing involved? A bit of useless info but in NZ, the equivalent certification involves multiple stops from 100km/h within a specified time period to test brake fade. Hence people often run a very aggressive brake pad and some high-temp fluid to pass the test.

I have LN130 calipers like the one's in your ebay link on mine (stock FJ40 discs), unsure if they make it stop any quicker but they have bigger pistons, so your engineer should consider it an upgrade. One thing to check would be the clearance between the caliper and wheel that you have now, because if it's marginal now then the new calipers will likely rub on the outer ribs.

There will be a performance test involved, but first I need to get past the fact that they need to be “upgraded”. The vehicle will need to undergo a stop test, which I believe is from 40km/h and a swerve test involving a fast lane change and brake test at the same time from 80 - 110km/h (different engineers seem to perform the test under different conditions).

Thanks for the information around the figment and the wheels. I’ll make sure I consider this before I decide on the final combo.

 

[Living in the Past]

I'm certainly not opposed to disc brake conversions, but know that I drove a 300 horse power Chevota, towing a fully self contained travel trailer for 3 years with drum brakes, soooooo I wouldn't say you absolutely have to have disc brakes. The bigger problem is trying to hold your rig on a steep hill side with 33" or bigger tires and drum brakes.

This is in Australia which is heavily regulated compare to the US. You can't even replaced the seats with out it being engineered. Legally switching engines has to be approved, doesn't always happen from what I've read. What the penalties are probably depends on which state.

Agree. 78 front disc only, rear drum.

Australia didn't get front disc brakes until the 83 model.