Brake Pedal Feel (1 Viewer)

[Hokie99]

So there seems to be a big difference in brake pedal feel between my newly acquired 98 LX 470 and my 2002 LC. The 98 seems to take a lot more pedal pressure to engage the brakes. No difference after new brake fluid service, not that I was expecting that but thought I’d add this detail just in case.

Is this increased “brake pedal pressure” something to be concerned about, and if so what should I be looking and checking for?

Thanks you in advance.

 

[suprarx7nut]

If I could make any complaint about driving feel in Toyota truck/SUVs of this vintage it's definitely brake pedal feel. The brake pedals are just generally awful. This was true when they were new and I worked at Toyota and it's only gotten worse as they age.

I have a 99LC and an 06LX.

The 99 has always had a soft and spongy feel. Travel is LONG before brakes engage and you have to step into it if you really want to stop fast.

The 06 was always VERY abrupt in initial bite, but the pedal was overall soft and would fall to the floor if held for ~30 seconds+ at a stop light. After replacing the brake master cylinder (just he cylinder, not the huge pump assembly), the falling pedal disappeared, but it's still a spongy and numb Toyota SUV brake pedal.

I'm not sure which component(s) is responsible for the pedal feel, but I can tell you many of these rigs will feel like that. If the pedal doesn't fall with constant pressure and it reliably functions, I'm guessing you just have a typical late 90's, early 2000's Toyota brake pedal.

 

[Hokie99]

Thank you SupraRx7nut, yes I have no issues when at a stop light for long periods...I guess it’s just a different pedal feel from cruiser to cruiser.

 

[ClassyJalopy]

As @suprarx7nut said - Toyota seems to struggle with pedal feel. Even my Sienna when it was brand new didn't have a great feel. It brakes like a champion but if you drive other brands you will notice it right away.
But since we are comparing brakes between 100 series, there are couple of contributing factors:

1. Brake Fluid issues:
   1. Low fluid will throw the brake light on dash
   2. Old fluid will cause the pedals to be mushy, will also sometimes require longer press
2. Master Cylinder (MC): rebuild kit 04493-60330: Cylinder Kit, Brake Master for about $70. Symptoms:
   1. Pedals falls to the ground when pressed for a few minutes
   2. Requires double-tap. First press gives you weak response but if you take your foot off and then immediately press pedal again the brakes feel nice and firm.
   3. Brakes feel mushy and weak
3. Brake Pedal Adjustment: There is a clavicle at the back of you brake pedal that connects it to the master cylinder plunger. FSM calls for a very specific adjustment procedure (see pic below). I replaced the whole expensive brake booster assembly without improvement in the brakes until I did this adjustment!)
4. Brake pads:
   1. Low pads will make your brake pedals travel longer - brake force will be weak
   2. Low quality pads will not provide the bite you expect and will increase braking distance
   3. Improperly installed pads or pads not properly broken in will squeak and have shortened life
   4. Low quality pads will also cause brake fade: brakes lose their efficiency as they get hotter - more noticeable on longer descents.
5. Brake Rotors:
   1. Warped rotors will cause vibration on braking. In worst case scenario they will also cause vibration even when not braking
   2. Rotors worn too far will also cause the brakes to feel mushy and increase the pedal travel.
6. Frozen calipers:
   1. Brakes feel "glassy": The pedal feels that it has engaged even though you don't feel the deceleration as much.
7. Weak Brake Booster Accumulator: 47070-60010: Pump Assy, Brake Booster W/Accumulator for abt $1000
   1. Early signs are weak pedals, mudy pedal feel and most importantly, the accumulator motor runs longer than 40 sec on startup.
   2. Failure comes almost suddenly and causes total brake failure. This item will fail on all 100 series and should be replaced as PM on rigs with over 200,000 miles

 

[Hokie99]

Interesting and detailed read ClassyJalopy, thank you for the info.

 

[Hokie LX]

My only contribution to this thread is as follows.

GO HOKIES!

That is all...

 

[Hokie99]

My only contribution to this thread is as follows.

GO HOKIES!

That is all...

Hell yes!!!
Do you make it to any football games?

 

[jerryb]

lol, no wonder no one talks about adjusting the pedal height. That would take all day!

 

[ClassyJalopy]

lol, no wonder no one talks about adjusting the pedal height. That would take all day!

It is actually pretty quick. You just need to do the part I highlighted in the red square. No need to take off anything really. I adjusted to the point where I started getting the brakes to rub and then backed it out slightly. Checked to see if I can roll the heavy beast by myself on flat surface and that's it.

 

[jerryb]

ahhh, I see, hence the red circle. I'm slow.

 

[jLB]

So there seems to be a big difference in brake pedal feel between my newly acquired 98 LX 470 and my 2002 LC. The 98 seems to take a lot more pedal pressure to engage the brakes. No difference after new brake fluid service, not that I was expecting that but thought I’d add this detail just in case.

Is this increased “brake pedal pressure” something to be concerned about, and if so what should I be looking and checking for?

Thanks you in advance.

Noticed the same when comparing our 99 LX to our other two 100 series (00 LC & 06 LX).

Reading through a number of 'mud posts, there seemed to be a common element to the "long travel before brake engagement" (98/99 models), so out of curiosity I posted this poll:

Poll: Double Pump Brake Issue

Our recently acquired 99 LX, has a soft brake pedal and lots of pedal travel before the brakes start to engage, when compared to our other 100 series. The pedal does firm up a bit with a double pump. So far: We've flushed and replaced the brake fluid along with a proper bleeding of the system...

forum.ih8mud.com

I know EBD, VSC and ATRAC were added in the 2000MY, but I don't know how this might affect pedal feel in the pre-2000 models.

 

[hoser]

They added Electronic Brake Force (EBD) in the year 2000. Could that be the difference?

 

[thebeedeegee]

My LX has a spongey brake as well but my wife's 2011 FJC feels pretty good. FIrst time I drove a new Tacoma I almost threw myself through the windshield.

 

[Hokie99]

Ok, sounds like this is commonplace for possibly a number of reasons, interesting. Thanks all!