Belt routing Problems-need suggestions (1 Viewer)

[CruisinGA]

Background- '74 model F. FJ60 2F waterpump and crank pulley. York and alternator installed on PS of engine on brackets from kccruiser.com Belt that runs compressor and alternator is on front groove. I have two different p/s pump brackets. Mark's from marksoffroad.net (mounts low so F aircleaner may be used), and wdorry's. (mounts too high for F aircleaner.) I am using a 20-6000 Napa # Saginaw pump with industrial 3.5" pulley.

I started to test fit everything today, and found a problem that I am not sure how best to resolve. Mark's bracket (what would rather use) locates the pump so that only the front grooves on W/P and crank may be used. It is not possible to modify his bracket to use the rear groove without really reworking it. (Skills I do not have).

When I move the belt for the York and alternator to the rear groove, the belt contacts the thermostat housing.

It seems I have two routes that I can take to try and resolve this conglomeration of issues.
I can pursue preventing the york/alt belt from contacting the thermostat housing by finding a smaller york pulley (does one exist?), modifying the york bracket to lower it all down(complicated and difficult), or inventing some sort of idler pulley.
-OR-
I can rework marks' bracket to allow the pump to run on the rearmost pulley, or mock up wdorry's bracket and hope that it has enough adjustability to allow the pump to run on the rear belt. If I run Wdorrys mount I then have to figure out an aircleaner.


One more factor-I have a FJ60 thermostat housing waiting on gaskets from cdan to be installed. My measurements show that it will be no different from the '74 one on there now. I would be very interested if someone knows otherwise.

I'm including a picture to show exactly what I'm talking about. The more I think about it, it seems like reworking Mark's bracket is the best way to go about resolving the issue.

I wouldn't be so worried about it if I wasnt' heading to tellico in 9 days and David wasn't so busy I couldn't con him or Dustin into reworking marks bracket. I don't know anyone else who can weld.

Sorry for the longwindedness, this issue has a lot of interdependent variables. Any input, ideas, wisdom etc is appreciated.

 

[aZ..fj-40]

Belt options

Bailey, Would a longer belt and using the compressor adjustment, lower the York enough to have the belt clear the housing? Does the York have a double pulley? It looks like it does! I think lowering the York seems to be the easiest way out, but that's just judging from the picture. HTH Earl
P.S. I have a home built P/S, and A/C on my '74 fj40, and had to make several adjustments, such as the rear, wide, belt runs the A/C pump, the alternator, and the waterpump, while the narrow front belt runs the P/S pump with the gutted air pump as the adjuster!

 

[Poser]

Lower the compressor, and be done with it.

Go to Tellico without the compressor, your truck has ran fine without it so far....

Go have fun, and modify it when you get back, and have the time to do it right!

Good luck!


-Steve

 

[CruisinGA]

The compressor is nothing new, it has been on the truck for well over a year, and never had any problems until I had the need to move its belt to the rear groove to free up the front groove for the new p/s pump.

Removing the compressor had crossed my mind, there are several problems though.
1) ARB no workie.
2)Nothing for the alternator to bolt to. Could be solved with a 2F alternator bracket and another belt. I may do this.

If the new thermostat housing doesn't change anything I'm leaning towards running without the p/s pump. I've lived without P/S for 2 years, I think I can make it through one more trip to tellico.

My only concern is what I need to do to prevent this from damaging the P/S gearbox. Just seal off the fittings, or do I need to at least hook it up with lines to a non-driven pump and fill it all with fluid?
The steering with a minitruck box w/o boost feels no different than the stock M/S box did, so far as I can tell initially.

Thanks for the input, I think I am going to take the path of least resistance to get it to Tellico, and when i get home, step back, and take another look to see what needs to be done to get it set up permanently.

Any more ideas keep em coming.

 

[72cruiser]

you've got two t-stat housings, right?

grind the spare one down some and see if you can get it to work.

i have no idea about the thickness of the housing, but it would seem to me that you should be able to do that.... (and you have a spare, remember, ha ha. perfect reasoning to destroy it....)


malphrus

 

[72cruiser]

i know it's ghetto, but aren't we all a little ghetto ourselves?

 

[theo]

grind the spare one down some and see if you can get it to work.

This idea has merit. You could saw a lot of material off the bottom of the housing and weld a flat piece on. That would give you clearance. I would think twice, though, about how coolant would flow through a modified thermostat housing. Probably not a big deal. Take a stock t-stat housing with you just in case.

 

[JasonH]

I just finished putting on the kccruisers bracket and my new York. I run factory powersteering so I used one long ass belt to run the York, alt, and PS pump. I have a gutted smog pump to turn the water pump on the rear pulley.
It should work except I don't have a lot of contact on the York pulley. I haven't powered it on yet to see if it's going to slip. Although it's very similar to when I had an actual air conditioner on it and it worked fine.

 

[73lndcrsr]

I run the long belt on mine for the York, Alt, and PS pump. I works fine, I do not have any slippage that I can tell. I think my belt is 64" long.

 

[CruisinGA]

hm
had not thought of the long belt.
seems there would be very little contact with the waterpump. But who needs a waterpump when you have powersteering and an air compressor?

Malphrus- the grind on the housing idea had crossed my mind. During english today I think it was. If all the gaskets that I need to use my new housing come in on time I may try grinding on the old one to see what it does. Seems like the aluminum is about a 1/4" thick.

My belt is already 63.5" long. It had to be special ordered from Napa as a heavy equipment part. I'm gonna mock it up and see what length I would need and give Napa a call.

Thanks for the ideas. Hopefully they will have one long enough. This will at least get me through the next month or so and then I can rework the P/S bracket or york bracket to run two belts

 

[72cruiser]

Malphrus- the grind on the housing idea had crossed my mind. During english today I think it was. If all the gaskets that I need to use my new housing come in on time I may try grinding on the old one to see what it does. Seems like the aluminum is about a 1/4" thick.

yeah, that's what i was thinkin. when i looked at my t-stat housing after i put in a new gasket, it was fairly thick.

i wouldn't suggest grinding it down so the the reservoir would be tapped, but just enough so that you could get the belt by it. and smoothed out so it wouldn't snag...


malphrus

 

[CruisinGA]

Jason- I had the same feeling when i first installed my york.

It has never had a problem with belt slippage, I run it at 150# max.

 

[Degnol]

If I run Wdorrys mount I then have to figure out an aircleaner.




Bailey, I run a 2F aircleaner on my '74 F and Bill Dorry's pump mount. You need a 2F valve cover and intake and a little airhorn adapter that I made, but you can easily make one.
You can PM me if you want pics.
GL
Ed

 

[CruisinGA]

I have a 2F valvecover already on, but I dislike the 2F aircleaner. I would really like to see some pics of yours tho, like to keep my options open!

bquintrell@paceacademy.org don't have to downsize them if you don't want to.

 

[JasonH]

My belt is already 63.5" long. It had to be special ordered from Napa as a heavy equipment part. I'm gonna mock it up and see what length I would need and give Napa a call.

Mine ended up being around 74". Carquest had one behind the counter that worked perfectly. I'm using the narrower Chevy width belt as I'm also running a GM alternator. Works fine in the Cruiser pulleys.

 

[73lndcrsr]

I have had really good luck with the belts from Advance. They have had to order them, but they come in quickly.

 

[CruisinGA]

I mocked everything up and ran some corrugated loom to check to see if one long belt would work. It would if I didn't need a waterpump So then I tried running two belts, with the alternator/waterpump on one and the york/P/S pump on the other. Once again, if i could weld, I could lower the alternator bracket so the belt would clear the bottom of the york pulley. This would work beautifully.

It is looking more and more like I will be wheeling without P/S this weekend. Oh well, there are much worse things.

 

[72cruiser]

dude, you know you'll be like an angry bear if you don't have p/s. just grind that biatch


malphrus

 

[Degnol]

I have a 2F valvecover already on, but I dislike the 2F aircleaner. I would really like to see some pics of yours tho, like to keep my options open!

bquintrell@paceacademy.org don't have to downsize them if you don't want to.

What's not to like about the 2F aircleaner????It has the "warm air" intake for cold mornings. I run that with a header and it is sweet for those cold Missouri mornings like we're having right now! Not much of an issue in Jarja. Hell you can pick up a 2F manifold for about $20 and the same for the aircleaner. I'll make and send you the adapter...Priceless, but free. Bill Dorry's $hit is so nice, clean and strong.
Besides, if you have a '74 motor, it IS a 2F, minus the slight increase in displacement.
Just waiting to make that adapter...
GL
Ed

 

[CruisinGA]

What's not to like about the 2F aircleaner????It has the "warm air" intake for cold mornings. I run that with a header and it is sweet for those cold Missouri mornings like we're having right now! Not much of an issue in Jarja. Hell you can pick up a 2F manifold for about $20 and the same for the aircleaner. I'll make and send you the adapter...Priceless, but free. Bill Dorry's $hit is so nice, clean and strong.
Besides, if you have a '74 motor, it IS a 2F, minus the slight increase in displacement.
Just waiting to make that adapter...
GL
Ed

The 2F aircleaner is big and ugly, and does not flow as much air as the F aircleaner. The F also has a warm air intake. I do like Bill's stuff, but the other problem is that I have M10 engine mount bolts, and his bracket is made for M12. While I have the necessary bolts, it just does not feel that firm with the exta space. If I had time to make some bushings I would probably run it.

I'll take you up on your offer for the adapter though. I may change my mind and I really like having as many options as possible-I'll probably end up changing this belt setup at least once more before I am really happy. I'll at least pay for materials and of course shipping.