Bad Catylatic Converter (1 Viewer)

[j-dub]

took my newly purchased 87 fj60 to midas today to have them give me a price on removing the gay ass tail pipes PO put on. he got it on the rack and within a minute had me come out to have a look see. he says "well we can put a new muffler and pipes on it, but your catylatic (sp?) is shot". well my rig has been de-smogged (previous thread: to smog or not to smog) another PO job. the guy at midas then tells me he can't replace the CC without all of the proper smog stuff cuz it will burn up within weeks. i've been leaning towards putting the smog stuff back on, and this may seal the deal, but i have a couple questions:

is this guy at midas full of s***? will the CC burn up? can i say F**k it and just go ahead with the new muffler and pipe with the CC in its current condition?
thanks for the input.

 

[tonkota]

Midas?? RUN LIKE HELL!

What else are you missing? Do you have ox sensors?

 

[Tinker]

Ditto Tonk: friends own a couple Midas' & I'll only let them weld stuff for me. They'll try to sell you anything but a hood ornament, regardless of whether you need it.

By federal law they can't remove the cat, & it's illegal for you to, too, but who's to tell. Search this board for gutting your old cat - R&Ring it isn't hard. Then you could have an independent shop put on a free-flow muffler & 2-1/2" pipe.

A new cat may die earlier if there's no air pump in front of it, so they weren't exactly lying. I wouldn't let them work on an FJ: they generally don't know squat.

 

[chitown40]

I gutted my cat a few weeks ago, and although it took care of my restriction problem, it stunk and the fumes were pretty noxious. To gut it, just remove the bolts and drop the cat making sure not to damage the thermo sensor. The bracket holding it in place is probably rusted to all hell, but just break it off. Oh yeah, make sure it's nice and cool first. The cat takes a while to cool off since it gets pretty hot. There is a round plug on the top of it. Take an allen wrench that fits the plug or use some vise-grips and unscrew it. Mine actually opened up quite easy. Dump the catalyst and pull out all the metal you can. Screw it back together and remount it. After a few weeks of driving, I got tired of the CO poisoning and I opted for a local shop to install a new one. $125 out the door welding and a custom bracket to hold in the thermo sensor. Performance is the same, smell is better. The new cat has a funny, but quite pleasing smell, without choking me to death. If you still have your air pump under the hood, just connect it up to the exhaust rail and you'll get air going through it all the time to keep the cat cool. If you don't, then just rip off the whole cat, ave the flanges, and take good measurements of what you need, then go to a local independent exhaust shop and have them bend up what you need and weld on the flange. Then you should be set.

-Rob

 

[jesterb]

Go to a jake leg shop and pay them cash to cut it off.

My 62 with a flowmaster and no cats sounds like a bitchin camaro

 

[GLTHFJ60]

Could a bad cat, in theory, go so bad that it clogs the exhaust system and refuses the truck to idle properly? Probably not, right?

 

[tonkota]

bitchin camaro

WTF? Is there such a thing? That's like saying your Jeep Liberty isn't

 

[j-dub]

Midas?? RUN LIKE HELL!

What else are you missing? Do you have ox sensors?

honestly, i don't know if i have oxegen sensors. i'm a rookie on this board and kind of a rookie trying to learn automotive repair on an fj60. the truck already smells BAD, probably due to the broke down cat.

 

[j-dub]

If you still have your air pump under the hood, just connect it up to the exhaust rail and you'll get air going through it all the time to keep the cat cool. If you don't, then just rip off the whole cat, ave the flanges, and take good measurements of what you need, then go to a local independent exhaust shop and have them bend up what you need and weld on the flange. Then you should be set.

-Rob

so like i said, i'm kind of new at this. i'm going to get out my haines and chilton manuals and see if i can figure out what you're saying here. it makes sense and in theory i understand. need the visual aid to solidify things. trying to understand the part where i hook up the air pump to the exhaust rail (kind of foriegn terms).

 

[j-dub]

i've been looking through both haynes and chilton for about an hour now and i can't for the life of me find an illustration of what the exhaust rail is??? the suggestion that rob made above makes sense, but leaves a few questions: i've been thinking about this and doesn't the cat work properly due to the high temp inside it? will pumping air from the air pump through the cat reduce the performance of the cat because it is cooling it down? how would i go about hooking up the air pump to the exhaust? I'm a newbie. i know. i know.

 

[jesterb]

WTF? Is there such a thing? That's like saying your Jeep Liberty isn't

I got it off a movie.........you get the idea

 

[Pluton]

Haynes and Chilton don't show everything...it's essential for you to get the Toyota emissions manual[and preferably the engine and body/chassis manuals] for your 60. Otherwise you'll NEVER know what's supposed to be there and how it's supposed to work. Also, the air injection system is not there to "cool down" the catalyst. The air injection system["smog pump"]usually helps the catalyst run hotter so it can more thoroughly burn the unburnt stuff in the exhaust.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

I just bought the engine manual and it is fantastic. I'm going to get the other two when I get the money.

 

[chitown40]

Haynes and Chilton don't show everything...it's essential for you to get the Toyota emissions manual[and preferably the engine and body/chassis manuals] for your 60. Otherwise you'll NEVER know what's supposed to be there and how it's supposed to work. Also, the air injection system is not there to "cool down" the catalyst. The air injection system["smog pump"]usually helps the catalyst run hotter so it can more thoroughly burn the unburnt stuff in the exhaust.

Pluton you are correct. The main purpose of the AI system is to burn the unburnt fuel, however the deceleration fuel cut opens and closes within the system based on the temp of the cat and thereby routes the air directly into the exhaust pipe rather than the exhaust air rail to help cool the catalyst.

And GLTH, no it wont make your truck not idle. The intake manifold leak you have is the most likely problem. Are you ever going to take it off and fix it already instead of trying to speculate what the problem "might" also be.

 

[GLTHFJ60]

I'm working on it. It has alot more problems than I thought it originally had, so I am taking care of those parts first. It is happening, yet slowly.

 

[j-dub]

Pluton you are correct. The main purpose of the AI system is to burn the unburnt fuel, however the deceleration fuel cut opens and closes within the system based on the temp of the cat and thereby routes the air directly into the exhaust pipe rather than the exhaust air rail to help cool the catalyst.

so the way you are explaining this i think is that it IS ok to route the air pump directly to the rail. and that this infact will help cool down the CC, which, if the guy at midas was right, is what i need to do to keep a new CC from burning up when i put it on. am i following you?

 

[j-dub]

Haynes and Chilton don't show everything...it's essential for you to get the Toyota emissions manual[and preferably the engine and body/chassis manuals] for your 60. Otherwise you'll NEVER know what's supposed to be there and how it's supposed to work. Also, the air injection system is not there to "cool down" the catalyst. The air injection system["smog pump"]usually helps the catalyst run hotter so it can more thoroughly burn the unburnt stuff in the exhaust.

ok. so ineed to get the manuals. sounds good. where do i get them and how much are they?

 

[chitown40]

Yes and no. There is more to the system that just the air rail. Without seeing what you have hooked up, I'd have to say go ahead and get the FSM and go off of that. Sorry I can't be of more help, but it's pretty complicated to try and type out on here. Read over the FSM and it will make sense.

 

[j-dub]

right on. thanks for the help.