Another 300-series rumor thread

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Not to thread highjack but I'll be in Dubai for the next year and can order these parts if they're Middle East spec and send them back to the states potentially.
PM me. I looked into this extensively, including contacting some Middle East Mud guys. Another issue is you supposedly have to give your LC vin to get the parts (they don’t want them going on non-TRD 200s).
 
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. People buy based on emotion, and a new tahoe "feels" great for less than $40k..
You won’t get a new Tahoe for under $40k. Tahoe starts at $49k, but is more likely to be $60-70k out the door. The Yukon Denali and Escalade are more expensive.
 

bloc

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You won’t get a new Tahoe for under $40k. Tahoe starts at $49k, but is more likely to be $60-70k out the door. The Yukon Denali and Escalade are more expensive.
Sure not out the door, but I did a quick price check on autotrader before posting that and there are at least a handful listed in my area for 38 and 39k, 8-10k off MSRP. Many, many more below 41k. Yes, base model. If you toss in leather and all the stuff a cruiser has it goes up quick, but that's exactly what toyota knew when they decided to pimp-my-ride to the 200.. a base cruiser would likely compete on price with those much more optioned tahoes, and might not even have the KDSS that makes it so good on-trail.

My point stands though.. people have become spoiled by the feature set of these far lower quality trucks and if they don't already know the cruiser will outlast it 3 to 1, they have a lot of trouble justifying the nearly 80k.
 

1world1love

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Sure not out the door, but I did a quick price check on autotrader before posting that and there are at least a handful listed in my area for 38 and 39k, 8-10k off MSRP. Many, many more below 41k. Yes, base model. If you toss in leather and all the stuff a cruiser has it goes up quick, but that's exactly what toyota knew when they decided to pimp-my-ride to the 200.. a base cruiser would likely compete on price with those much more optioned tahoes, and might not even have the KDSS that makes it so good on-trail.

My point stands though.. people have become spoiled by the feature set of these far lower quality trucks and if they don't already know the cruiser will outlast it 3 to 1, they have a lot of trouble justifying the nearly 80k.
It’s interesting. People don’t seem to have any problem dropping 80-100k on an Escalade. I have never seen a two year old Escalade that didn’t rattle. When you get into the four year old Escalades, they look like junk. I mean seriously look like they should be scrapped for parts. Trim pieces falling off, paint issues, etc. ai am sure that somewhere, somebody has a well maintained, four year old Escalade that does not have issues, but I have never seen it. They actually seem to be built to worse tolerances than the Tahoe and Yukon, when supposedly the Escalades are the premium of the platform.

Having said that, I travel quite a bit and rent cars regularly. Tahoes and Yukons are standard for most agency fleets, and while they are nice to drive as a rental, if they have more than 10k, it is predictable. The front interior door handles will be loose, the dash will rattle, and at least one of the power seat controllers will not work. It has been like this for years.

Why do people tolerate crap like that on $60k vehicles? Hell, there are people that have asked Toyota to pay for a cracked radiator on a 200 series with 90k miles. The tolerances in the vehicle build mirror the tolerances of the buyers I guess.
 

Artie

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It’s interesting. People don’t seem to have any problem dropping 80-100k on an Escalade. I have never seen a two year old Escalade that didn’t rattle. When you get into the four year old Escalades, they look like junk. I mean seriously look like they should be scrapped for parts. Trim pieces falling off, paint issues, etc. ai am sure that somewhere, somebody has a well maintained, four year old Escalade that does not have issues, but I have never seen it. They actually seem to be built to worse tolerances than the Tahoe and Yukon, when supposedly the Escalades are the premium of the platform.

Having said that, I travel quite a bit and rent cars regularly. Tahoes and Yukons are standard for most agency fleets, and while they are nice to drive as a rental, if they have more than 10k, it is predictable. The front interior door handles will be loose, the dash will rattle, and at least one of the power seat controllers will not work. It has been like this for years.

Why do people tolerate crap like that on $60k vehicles? Hell, there are people that have asked Toyota to pay for a cracked radiator on a 200 series with 90k miles. The tolerances in the vehicle build mirror the tolerances of the buyers I guess.
Comparing a rental to one someone owns may not be the best comparison, rentals are notoriously abused. Also, if you need a 3rd row or have a family and need to have the space the domestic SUVs are an attractive option. I can’t speak for the GM’s but we are approaching 3 yrs in our Lincoln and it’s been solid so far. I stress the ‘so far’ part.
 
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Comparing a rental to one someone owns may not be the best comparison, rentals are notoriously abused. Also, if you need a 3rd row or have a family and need to have the space the domestic SUVs are an attractive option. I can’t speak for the GM’s but we are approaching 3 yrs in our Lincoln and it’s been solid so far. I stress the ‘so far’ part.
That’s why Toyota needs to get off their duff and redesign the Sequoia. Nice, large 3-row SUV and built better then Ford and GM. I like the current Sequoia, but would never consider one, as it is so dated.

It’s all about sales. Toyota has a good stable between Rav 4, Highlander, 4Runner, Sequoia and LC. Plus I think the Venza is making a return. Moving up or down stream will impact other Toyota models for sure. More people buy the Sequoia, so that should get more attention than a LC. I am talking US market. They need to eliminate either the Sequoia or LC in the US market. There is an SUV craze in this country, yet Sequoia and LC sales are low. Something has to give.
 

Artie

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That’s why Toyota needs to get off their duff and redesign the Sequoia. Nice, large 3-row SUV and built better then Ford and GM. I like the current Sequoia, but would never consider one, as it is so dated.

It’s all about sales. Toyota has a good stable between Rav 4, Highlander, 4Runner, Sequoia and LC. Plus I think the Venza is making a return. Moving up or down stream will impact other Toyota models for sure. More people buy the Sequoia, so that should get more attention than a LC. I am talking US market. They need to eliminate either the Sequoia or LC in the US market. There is an SUV craze in this country, yet Sequoia and LC sales are low. Something has to give.
Very well put. We looked at both the LC and Sequoia, the Navigator redesign was far beyond both as far as amenities, luxury and space. One other thing that hasn’t been mentioned is the level of service from the dealer. Another selling point for us on Lincoln was their valet service for any maintenance or service, they come to me and leave me a vehicle and take mine for the service, it’s awesome for me as a stay at home parent.
 
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Do fleet wide fuel economy averages come in to play with Toyota’s import numbers on LCs? Maybe that is another contributing factor to sales suppression and why the 300 series permanent is rumored to go away from the 5.7.
 
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Do fleet wide fuel economy averages come in to play with Toyota’s import numbers on LCs? Maybe that is another contributing factor to sales suppression and why the 300 series permanent is rumored to go away from the 5.7.
Toyota only sells about 3,500 Land Cruisers per year in the US, compared to 400,000 RAV4s, so the impact on fleet economy is just about 0.

However, the Land Cruiser shares its drivetrain with the Tundra and Toyota sells over 110,000 Tundras per year. That does impact fleet economy, which is why the 5.7 is going away.
 
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Sure not out the door, but I did a quick price check on autotrader before posting that and there are at least a handful listed in my area for 38 and 39k, 8-10k off MSRP. Many, many more below 41k. Yes, base model.
I suspect that the base model is a very small proportion of Tahoekonburbanali sales. The base models are designed to get people in the door, whereupon they get easily upsold into a nicer trim.

Looking at the inventory of a Chevy dealer near me, they have 18 Tahoe’s. The Tahoe’s in their inventory start at $57k and go up to $80k MSRP. Not a single base model to be found. Yes, you can get a good $10k off MSRP, but my point stands — very few Tahoe’s are going out the door under $40k. A more typical price is $50-60k.
 
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You guys might want a more defender like 200 replacement but the rest of the world (where the 200 sells best ) want something like the 200 but abit more modern. Also in those markets they already offer more spartan 200s.
The 200 replacement is coming, no doubt about it. We will still get base 300s/mid level/fully loaded lexus specs. The formula won't change.
The question is will the US get it or will you guys end up getting a spinoff LC?

Another thing I'd like to mention, they sell around 120k 200s per year and almost 40k LX's, combined that's almost 160k units per year. Global sales keeps improving each generation. It might be dead in certain markets, or on life support but in markets where it always sold well, sales keep getting better.
 
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bloc

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I suspect that the base model is a very small proportion of Tahoekonburbanali sales. The base models are designed to get people in the door, whereupon they get easily upsold into a nicer trim.

Looking at the inventory of a Chevy dealer near me, they have 18 Tahoe’s. The Tahoe’s in their inventory start at $57k and go up to $80k MSRP. Not a single base model to be found. Yes, you can get a good $10k off MSRP, but my point stands — very few Tahoe’s are going out the door under $40k. A more typical price is $50-60k.
And that 50-60k would likely still be cheaper than a stripped down 200. Everyone here knows the cruiser would still be the smart move, but how many posts do we see about “my wife would kill me if I bought a vehicle with cloth seats”?
 
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And that 50-60k would likely still be cheaper than a stripped down 200. Everyone here knows the cruiser would still be the smart move, but how many posts do we see about “my wife would kill me if I bought a vehicle with cloth seats”?
You seem to think I’m an advocate for a stripped down Land Cruiser. I’m not. I like my leather heated and ventilated seats. I like the heated steering wheel and the coolbox. I like the radar cruise control and wish it worked down to 0 mph. I’d like more autonomous driving aids. I‘m willing to pay the $85k for a new Land Cruiser.

I was just pointing out that you were perhaps exaggerating the price difference between a Tahoe and a Land Cruiser.
 

1world1love

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Comparing a rental to one someone owns may not be the best comparison, rentals are notoriously abused. Also, if you need a 3rd row or have a family and need to have the space the domestic SUVs are an attractive option. I can’t speak for the GM’s but we are approaching 3 yrs in our Lincoln and it’s been solid so far. I stress the ‘so far’ part.
While generally true, the higher end rentals like the Denalis and Suburbans, and even the Tahoe variants, tend to get less abuse. But even so, it reinforces the point. A fleet Tahoe, top of the line, should be one of GMs best built vehicles and should withstand less than 10k miles of rental use without starting to fall apart.

I’ve heard good things about the Lincoln. I have rented a few Ford Expeditions in the past year and I wasn’t impressed with the build quality. The tech was very nice though.

You are right though. The Sequoia just can’t compete in that space. The difference between the interior of a top of the line Tahoe and the top of the line Sequoia is drastic. Of course the same is true at 100k miles, just in a different way.
 

1world1love

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Very well put. We looked at both the LC and Sequoia, the Navigator redesign was far beyond both as far as amenities, luxury and space. One other thing that hasn’t been mentioned is the level of service from the dealer. Another selling point for us on Lincoln was their valet service for any maintenance or service, they come to me and leave me a vehicle and take mine for the service, it’s awesome for me as a stay at home parent.
Are you sure this isn’t a dealer specific service? My local Lexus shop does the same thing and I didn’t even buy my used LX from them.
 
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Very well put. We looked at both the LC and Sequoia, the Navigator redesign was far beyond both as far as amenities, luxury and space. One other thing that hasn’t been mentioned is the level of service from the dealer. Another selling point for us on Lincoln was their valet service for any maintenance or service, they come to me and leave me a vehicle and take mine for the service, it’s awesome for me as a stay at home parent.
They have this service at Lexus. Lincoln is the luxury brand of Ford.
 
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I have a pretty good friend that is an engineer on the Tundra project up until COVID hit he was back and forth to Japan at least once a month he claims the new LX/LC will be turbo v6. I have seen some of the engendering drawings of the Tundra and he has said quite a bit about the new LC/LX.
 
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Spill the beans please.
The only way I keep in his goodwill is by keeping my mouth shut. I asked him if I could post what I have. And on a different note it amazes me how much of a discount they can get on anew vehicle. He let me build a LC on his work computer using his account and he can get one for about $500 a month and that includes insurance and all maintenance. He has a Sequoia now and it’s less than $400
 
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