3B Turbo Kit Build Review... Long Overdue (1 Viewer)

[ChrisB]

If You frequent the Diesel Tech forum you know Diesel42.
If You know about turbo kits for the 3B You know Diesel 42 makes one exclusively for 'Mud Members.
D42 has sold many of these kits to 'Mudders but no one has really described his kit in detail after buying one.

First let's start with the install.

Pulled the old exhaust manifold


IMG_0250 by Brompton Photography, on Flickr


IMG_0248 by Brompton Photography, on Flickr

Dry Fit the new one... Yep gonna have to re route those heater lines


IMG_0251 by Brompton Photography, on Flickr

Pulled my Push Rod Cover..... 2Hrs to get it off, 1Hr to get the gasket off of the cover and 3 more Hrs to get the rest of the gasket off of the block! I hate those gaskets.
A side note... Check for dishing on your cover if there is any dishing around the bolt holes gently tap them as flush as possible with a hammer and brass block.


photo 2 by Brompton Photography, on Flickr


Painted and re-installed Push Rod Cover with cork gasket and Permatex FormAGasket #2 both sides. did not over tighten.


IMG_0259 by Brompton Photography, on Flickr

Re-routed heater lines, dropped oil pan, welded bung, Painted pan, re-installed with new OEM pan gasket. removed oil plug from side of block for oil feed line replaced with supplied fitting.

D42's kit comes with 99% of everything you need to do this. He even includes the silicone hose adapters for the throttle body and the compressor outlet. The only pieces I had to purchase separately was connections from air cleaner to compressor inlet, the pipe to go from the turbo to the throttle body and exhaust flange.

Here's the turbo being installed on the manifold.


IMG_0267 by Brompton Photography, on Flickr

I lucked out at the metal superstore and got a 12" piece of 2" stainless pipe for 2CAD fit perfectly between my turbo and throttle body


IMG_0268 by Brompton Photography, on Flickr

After the turbo was in place, I torqued all my fittings for the oil lines and hoses etc. For the air cleaner to the turbo i bought a 3"-2" silicone reducer a 2" coupler and a 45 degree 2" exhaust pipe. total of about 100CAD. Expensive when I could have used a piece of central vac hose I'm sure it would have done the trick but this way it looked consistent with D42s kit.

I had a local exhaust shop do the connection to my existing 2.25" muffler-ed exhaust setup. it was pricey but it looks great.


Here is the final install.


IMG_0272 by Brompton Photography, on Flickr


Also not included in the kit of course is your choice of gauges. I went with the Auto Meter Ultra Light II series Electric Pyro and Mechanical Boost gauges. They are temporarily taking up my ash tray slot but do not like them there. They will be moved one day in the near future.

Stay Tuned for Performance Review tomorrow...

 

[mainlander]

Nice, looking forward to a ride one day soon

 

[TOBASH]

Stay Tuned for Performance Review tomorrow...

What do you mean stay tuned till tomorrow!!!

How do you think that makes me feel?

Now I'm gonna be up all night!

Seriously, I think this looks like the kit for me.

Do all the exhaust manifold bolt holes line up?

I ask as the manifold when stock from the truck company has some mis-aligned holes.

Ducting from my snorkel may need to be re-routed.

Why the repaint of the rod cover? Asthetics?

How much time do you have into the project?

Also, are you measuring exhaust gas temp?

Best,

T

 

[Dougal]

Big question for you. Got a dyno?

Soo many people are stoked with these conversions and I still haven't got to "see" my results.

 

[TOBASH]

Big question for you. Got a dyno?

So many people are stoked with these conversions and I still haven't got to "see" my results.

True, yet once I instal my turbo on my 3B I will probably use the seat of the pant dyno vs. paying for a pull on a dyno.

I agree that a dyno pull would quantify things.

Just this is not a dragster so a dyno run is not worth it, as who in the World is going to look for bragging rights on perhaps 130 hp (unless of course I'm the one selling the kits)?

 

[Dougal]

True, yet once I instal my turbo on my 3B I will probably use the seat of the pant dyno vs. paying for a pull on a dyno.

I agree that a dyno pull would quantify things.

Just this is not a dragster so a dyno run is not worth it, as who in the World is going to look for bragging rights on perhaps 130 hp (unless of course I'm the one selling the kits)?

I don't care about hp numbers. I want to see the shape of the torque curve.

 

[BreckenridgeCruiser]

Dougal, I cannot give you a torque curve, but my butt curve says D42s kits are sweet.... and that comes from your pushing us toward the GT2052.

Mine is a bit different in oiling, but the base components are the same. I have my wastegate disconnected though which makes me happy. I do have to keep a closer eye on the EGT and boost, but I know I have a lot more foot if I need it!

 

[samwise]

Thanks for posting Chris! I had been meaning to ask how this went for you. Looks great! Kieth is great a great help.
I am getting close to install, but still figuring out little details.
How did the exhaust hook up, did you buy a connecting flange, or did the shop do it all? Did they have what they needed? I am likely going to have shop do mine, but wasnt sure if I had to get anything, ie. flange, mandrel bent pipe etc.
Looks sweet, not sure when we will be in Maple ridge next but would like to meet ya and see your cruiser.

 

[ChrisB]

Nice, looking forward to a ride one day soon

What's sunday looking like for ya?

What do you mean stay tuned till tomorrow!!!

How do you think that makes me feel?

Now I'm gonna be up all night!
Sorry I was fading fast... The result wouldn't have been pretty.
Seriously, I think this looks like the kit for me.
This is the Kit for you
Do all the exhaust manifold bolt holes line up?
All Bolt holes line up between the block and the manifold
D42 has made an adapter plate to go between turbo and manifold
None of the heat shield holes line up but that is expected since the heat shield doesn't work anyways
I ask as the manifold when stock from the truck company has some mis-aligned holes.

Ducting from my snorkel may need to be re-routed.

Why the repaint of the rod cover? Asthetics?
I repainted the rod cover grey because I knew it would leak again.
this way I could see where it was coming from easier. Did the same with the oil pan.
How much time do you have into the project?
2 Full days once I had all the parts that I needed and the help from my neighbor with a welder.
Also, are you measuring exhaust gas temp?
I am measuring EGTs with an AutoMeter Ultra Light II Electric Pyro
placed through the manifold immediately before the mouth of the turbo. There is a small hole there used to mount the 13-B-T heatsheild I drilled out the hole with 11/32 bit and tapped it with 1/8 NPT. The pyro thermocouple bolted right in!
Best,

T

Big question for you. Got a dyno?

Soo many people are stoked with these conversions and I still haven't got to "see" my results.

Not in my back yard but I have spoke with Steve at EBI and we are hoping to do a before and after Dyno Run as his neighbor has one and will hopefully give us a great deal. I really want to do this for everyone on here. So if the price is right we can do it up. If its going to cost a ton of money perhaps all the interested folk out here could pitch in a couple bux.

Thanks for posting Chris! I had been meaning to ask how this went for you. Looks great! Kieth is great a great help.
I am getting close to install, but still figuring out little details.
How did the exhaust hook up, did you buy a connecting flange, or did the shop do it all? Did they have what they needed? I am likely going to have shop do mine, but wasnt sure if I had to get anything, ie. flange, mandrel bent pipe etc.
Looks sweet, not sure when we will be in Maple ridge next but would like to meet ya and see your cruiser.

Thanks
The exhaust hook up was probably the worst part.
I took the turbo to LORDCO and found a flange that Vibrant makes that would work for me I think it was labeled as T3 flange with external wastegate.
It was 60CAD that sucks I was hoping not to use it. So after everything was ready to be bolted on I grabbed a measuring tape and figured out the bend I needed to come off of the turbo to go down to the existing exhaust pipe.
I took the measurements and the turbo to a local "mom & pop" shop and had them make me a pipe to my spec which was basically a really sharp 90 (3" radius) with a flare on it so I could mount it to the turbo.
I had him make it 3' long so the exhaust would run out under the truck. Once I had everything together I Drove it with the temporary exhaust back down to these guys and had them cut the old one back and mate it to the new one. I'll take some pics of it for you and post them up here.
They charged me about 200 for that which I thought was steep. But that was his best price he said. ( I hate not knowing people in these places because I know that should have cost me 60 bux not 200)

On a side note, a 3' straight pipe off of that turbo is probably the sweetest thing I have ever heard. absolutely music to my ears! that turbo whistles so loud when there isn't a muffler involved and the truck really wasnt that noisy. very surprising. Might remove my muffler one day.

I hope I answered everyone's questions.
Work calls now but will write more later.

 

[Cruiser Innovations]

Looks Great!

Very nice, and simple system...

What did you build your transition piece out of from the turbo to the exhaust manifold or did you need to?

If you had to build a transition be sure you don't use regular steel. Under high heat conditions it can blister and cause premature turbo failure... Stainless 304 material will eliminate this possibility...

 

[amaurer]

If you had to build a transition be sure you don't use regular steel. Under high heat conditions it can blister and cause premature turbo failure...

What?

 

[Dougal]

If you had to build a transition be sure you don't use regular steel. Under high heat conditions it can blister and cause premature turbo failure... Stainless 304 material will eliminate this possibility...

Bollocks.

 

[jake2far]

What did you build your transition piece out of from the turbo to the exhaust manifold or did you need to?

If you had to build a transition be sure you don't use regular steel. Under high heat conditions it can blister and cause premature turbo failure... Stainless 304 material will eliminate this possibility...

Here is a piece of info you probably never read:
http://www.indpipe.com/images/PDF/stainless_steel_pipe_specification.pdf

Type 304 stainless is the most widely used analysis for general corrosive resistant tubing and pipe applications, it is used in chemical plants,
refineries, paper mills, and food processing industries. Type 304 has a maximum carbon content of .08%. It is not recommended for use in the
temperature range between 800°F and 1650°F due to carbide precipitation at the grain boundaries which can result in inter-granular corrosion​

and early failure under certain conditions.

304 SS is not the best choice for your exhaust to turbo adapter.
When you say regular steel should not be used because it can blister and damage your turbo, what are you talking about?
There are over 500 different types of steel, unless you get into exotics a steel transition is exactly what should be used.

Here is another read, maybe you should study up before offering advice?
http://www.ehow.com/list_7559897_materials-use-motorcycle-exhaust-headers.html

• Header material and design are critical to increasing power in four-stroke motors. There is some argument about the best designs and materials, but two things are commonly understood. One, headers that increase flow of spent exhaust gasses tend to build more power. Two, headers that are insulated, keeping the heat from quickly dissipating through the header walls, increase exhaust velocity and prevent cylinder scavenging, which creates more power.
  
  

Mild Steel

• Mild steel is the most common header material and for some applications is the best. Every material is a trade-off between weight, heat properties, ease of manufacture, and durability. Mild steel offers a high value in that it's the least expensive to manufacture, stands up well to heat cycles, and offers high performance, given a good design.
  
  

Stainless Steel

• Stainless steel offers slightly better performance because it retains heat better than mild steel and most would say it looks better. The material is more expensive and it is more difficult to work with, making the manufacturing process more expensive. The biggest downside is a poor ability to withstand heat cycles. It is more likely to fail from high temperatures than mild steel.
  
  

A diesel turbo engine has a very rapid heat cycle that changes frequently,
(remember the comment about the idiot and the foot on the pedal?) the intense heat cycle renders 304ss a poor choice for the adapter between exhaust manifold and turbo, the failure will be cracks in the material.

I posted this before in another one of your over the top discussions, please try and read it, comprehend it and practice it.
The Greatest Obstacle to Discovery isn't Ignorance, it's the Illusion of Knowledge.
You keep thinking you know something, you keep sharing your supposed knowledge with us, the problem is you don't know what you are talking about.

"metallurgy is concerned with the production of metallic components for use in consumer or engineering products. This involves the production of alloys, the shaping, the heat treatment and the surface treatment of the product. The task of the metallurgist is to achieve balance between material properties such as cost, weight, strength, toughness, hardness, corrosion and fatigue resistance, and performance in temperature extremes."

You don't have a clue what you are doing or saying.

Jim

 

[ChrisB]

Well put.
It's nice to see that there are people out there that are educated and take the time to support what they say.


I was intrigued by his latest thread. Only to find out that he's just blowin smoke up everyone's a s s!

I don't think anyone on 'mud takes this guy seriously anyways.

 

[gerg]

Im a big fan of mild steel in manifold work for the ease of fabricating and its resistant to tempering... being quite a bit softer than stainless. Ever die grind stainless? ugg lots more work and hard on the carbide burrs.

Lots of guys get really nice SS exhaust which is a good idea, but diesel exhaust does not rust from the inside out so a good high heat paint job on normal mild steel exhaust will last a very long time.

g

 

[Diesel42]

Well done on the install Chris. Your air intake came out very clean for those that like and want to keep there OEM filter housing. On the 40/42 series, the air cleaner cross over tube extends over top the turbo so it's alittle more difficult. That was an excellent idea. Are you still pushing 14-15 PSI? I am excited to also see your dyno results.

Jake- Thanks for the tutorial. When i developed the adapter i choose normal low carbon steel as i was afraid aluminum may fail us due to the lower melt points of ordinary alum. As heat treating is a study and profession of it's own but was aware over the years of it's possible drawbacks. Great info, just shows how we all continue to broaden our knowledge and skills as a result of the great site.

 

[jake2far]

Very nice, and simple system...

What did you build your transition piece out of from the turbo to the exhaust manifold or did you need to?

If you had to build a transition be sure you don't use regular steel. Under high heat conditions it can blister and cause premature turbo failure... Stainless 304 material will eliminate this possibility...

A member of this site decides to put his money and reputation on the line and build something that is needed by other owners of the Diesel Landcruiser. You come along and with a single post, you insult and damage the work of another all because you want to be someone.
Example 1. You called this a "simple system". Nothing could be farther from the truth. The insult is it is not simple, you don't have a clue what he went through to do this and you belittle it by saying its simple.
Example 2. Already showed you don't know squat about metal, kinda fits with your simple comment, if you don't know it must be simple. 304SS is better than regular steel, really? Simple, really?

Maybe what you should do is thank the supplier for a very nice well thought out turbo system and keep the rest of your comments to yourself. If someone was stupid enough to believe that you knew something, they bought this kit (or maybe they didn't because of your incorrect 304SS comment) it could ruin a mans work, all for your reputation?



Jim

 

[Cruiser Innovations]

Land Cruiser Site Or Day Care center?

My comment to this write up was never ment to insult the builder / writer. The work performed looks excellent!

While I was jumping through the hoops building my system I was informed by a number of local and very reputable CNC machinists that if I used the wrong kind of steel for the transition piece between the exhaust manifold and turbo it could blister there by potentially damaging or destroying the turbo / engine.

To Jim (Jake2Far):
Thank you for the clarification. Any knowledge I have offered has been from: Reps from Garrett Turbos, Reps from Nippon Denso (Injection pumps, and injectors), Matt from RFR fabrication (CNC Machinist, and drag car builder), and a number of other resources that are well established in their areas of expertise.

The next time I speak with Matt from RFR I'll find out specifically what steel he was referring to that blistered under high heat, and get back to you.

I'll be the first to admit when I'm wrong and have no interest in pretending to be a "Know it all". If you read my comments and feel I am doing otherwise then your not reading my comment in the context in which I ment to imply.

Miscommunication through short text write-ups are expected, and the fact that most mud members indulge in criticizing a pin drop on this site is the main reason I don't respond to most of the bulls!*$ response my comments tend to surface.

Maybe I'm wording my comments / write-ups wrong because I have yet to say anything that some hormone imbalanced member didn't take offense to...

For a Toyota Forum that does not allow negative feed back and attempts to maintain a constructive only content based theme, come check us out at:
The Yota Yard - Toyota Off-Road Community

All this said, great write up, and great work Chris!
My apologies for the miscommunication

 

[Dougal]

My comment to this write up was never ment to insult the builder / writer. The work performed looks excellent!

While I was jumping through the hoops building my system I was informed by a number of local and very reputable CNC machinists that if I used the wrong kind of steel for the transition piece between the exhaust manifold and turbo it could blister there by potentially damaging or destroying the turbo / engine.

While CNC machinists are generally awesome at CNC machining, for accurate information on material selection you should talk to an engineer in general or a metallurgist if you want specific advice.

304 is a bad choice for exhaust for a few good reasons. Which is why it's not used often. Steel also does not blister in the manner you suggest.

Miscommunication through short text write-ups are expected, and the fact that most mud members indulge in criticizing a pin drop on this site is the main reason I don't respond to most of the bulls!*$ response my comments tend to surface.

Maybe I'm wording my comments / write-ups wrong because I have yet to say anything that some hormone imbalanced member didn't take offense to...

The negative responses are because your posts are high on bollocks with no accurate technical content. Starting with an 8 page spiel on a 200hp 40mpg B engine (aka flying pig) was not a good move.

 

[Cruiser Innovations]

[/QUOTE]The negative responses are because your posts are high on bollocks with no accurate technical content. Starting with an 8 page spiel on a 200hp 40mpg B engine (aka flying pig) was not a good move.[/QUOTE]

The details on this "Flying Pig" will be posted on my website in the next few weeks...
www.Cruiserinnovations.com

Thanks for the suggestion on word usage... I'm fairly new to posting on this forum, and apparently need to watch what I say, or more so how I say it...