2007 LX 470 Head Gasket Blown (1 Viewer)

[suprarx7nut]

I came to the LC world from the BMW world where overheating and blown engines (on M52/M54 engines) were rampant due to plastic cooling pump impellers and other plastic parts in the cooling system.

The 2UZ does not have these design faults. BUT I'm wondering if the coolant temp gage is "buffered" like on the BMW's, where it would stay in the middle until the engine was WAY too hot, then quickly jump to the hot side and light up the red LED. You had no warning.

Modern engines vary coolant temp within a range. I've read that the dealers did not want customers coming in and complaining about "temp needle moving around", so they LIE to you by falsely showing a perfectly stable coolant temp - UNTIL IT IS TOO LATE.

One thing that helped was a digital gage, hooked up to OBDII, displaying the coolant temp. If it was running too hot you would notice. That gave you some time to get off the road and shut down. On the BMW's I had the P3Cars unit.

On my 2006 LC I have the ScanGage II.

Was this (no warning of rising engine temp) a factor in your engine damage?

This is a common practice in all OEM temp gauges I'm aware of. The 2UZ is buffered and so is almost all (maybe literally all?) factory coolant gauges are designed to work. I do not believe there's much ill-intent behind it - quite the opposite.

I've understood that to be to exactly as you say - prevent unnecessary concern and complaints. The temp gauge is simply a problem fabricator if it reports in a linear fashion. This is because quite simply.... the average car driver is ignorant. The average car person probably has no clue that the coolant will be cooler when driving fast and hot when idling. Or that coolant gets colder when you turn on cabin heat. All these fluctuations are opportunities to make a problem out of nothing. Too many false alerts is much worse than benefitting the very few sharp drivers that will know that 178F-204F is fine, but 209F is a problem sign - unless of course you're in Phoenix and it's 118F outside and you've been idling on the highway in traffic for 40 minutes in which case 209F is barely a concern. Maybe even impressively good. I digress...

The intent of that gauge is not to give you early warning when there might be a future problem in some scenarios. It's to warn you that critical damage is about to occur or has already occurred no matter what situation you're in. If you drive an unreliable car and trying to catch catastrophic failures in the very brief moments before it all goes to hell, this might be annoying, haha. I was once that annoyed person daily driving a variety of mk3 supras for about a decade always ready for a blown head gasket.

 

[plimsoul]

I came to the LC world from the BMW world where overheating and blown engines (on M52/M54 engines) were rampant due to plastic cooling pump impellers and other plastic parts in the cooling system.

The 2UZ does not have these design faults. BUT I'm wondering if the coolant temp gage is "buffered" like on the BMW's, where it would stay in the middle until the engine was WAY too hot, then quickly jump to the hot side and light up the red LED. You had no warning.

Modern engines vary coolant temp within a range. I've read that the dealers did not want customers coming in and complaining about "temp needle moving around", so they LIE to you by falsely showing a perfectly stable coolant temp - UNTIL IT IS TOO LATE.

One thing that helped was a digital gage, hooked up to OBDII, displaying the coolant temp. If it was running too hot you would notice. That gave you some time to get off the road and shut down. On the BMW's I had the P3Cars unit.

On my 2006 LC I have the ScanGage II.

Was this (no warning of rising engine temp) a factor in your engine damage?

Interesting. It very well could have been. Your gauge idea makes a world of sense.

 

[shtbrwn86]

.... the average car driver is ignorant. The average car person probably has no clue that the coolant will be cooler when driving fast and hot when idling. Or that coolant gets colder when you turn on cabin heat. All these fluctuations are opportunities to make a problem out of nothing.

They could put a green "safe zone" on the gauge or something and let it move freely. Then at least people wouldn't freak out because it will start going down again after you start moving again. The problem with the gauge is that it's often too late by the time the gauge spikes.

 

[suprarx7nut]

They could put a green "safe zone" on the gauge or something and let it move freely. Then at least people wouldn't freak out because it will start going down again after you start moving again. The problem with the gauge is that it's often too late by the time the gauge spikes.

You're not wrong, but I think that's a problem they're not interested in solving. For almost all drivers that purchase cars new (the *real* customer of Toyota/Lexus/BMW/Ford, etc...), they will never need to worry about that gauge for the entirety of their life. It may as well be blacked out.

Putting emphasis on the variability of the "catastrophic engine damage gauge" isn't exactly good marketing for a reliable vehicle.

For those of us that care about coolant temps, we can run Torque on our phones, Grom equipped headunit, or better yet install an aftermarket gauge with built-in configurable alarms. For the other 99% of the population that uses their car as a temporary and disposable utility, that sluggish and buffered factory coolant gauge is just right. Is it cold? Is it overheating? That's all they need.

 

[shtbrwn86]

You're not wrong, but I think that's a problem they're not interested in solving. For almost all drivers that purchase cars new (the *real* customer of Toyota/Lexus/BMW/Ford, etc...), they will never need to worry about that gauge for the entirety of their life. It may as well be blacked out.

Putting emphasis on the variability of the "catastrophic engine damage gauge" isn't exactly good marketing for a reliable vehicle.

For those of us that care about coolant temps, we can run Torque on our phones, Grom equipped headunit, or better yet install an aftermarket gauge with built-in configurable alarms. For the other 99% of the population that uses their car as a temporary and disposable utility, that sluggish and buffered factory coolant gauge is just right. Is it cold? Is it overheating? That's all they need.

Yeah I guess that's true. In fact when I think about it, most cars I have owned have not had a temp gauge. Most just had dummy lights and I never even thought about it.

 

[MountaineerLC]

Like some other posters in this thread, I've long been confused when engines are swapped and considered junk because of a HG failure. I came to Toyota after 20 years of Land Rover ownership. HG failures on the old Rover V8 are common and the typical fix was to replace the gasket and have the head decked. A few vendors offered a rebuilt head and you could send your old one in as a core.

Heck on my old 00' Disco II I replaced both HG after one failed. I checked the heads with a straight edge and didn't have them decked because I couldn't find a trusted machine shop in my area. In my youthful exuberance I rolled the dice and buttoned her back up. It ran fine for a few more years till an overheat from a blown radiator hose killed the engine. Then I learned how to do a full engine swap!

I don't recommend that approach, but in times when good replacements and parts are getting hard to source, why are we junking otherwise good engines if a head gasket replacement and some machine work will get it running again? Educate me gentlemen!

 

[2001LC]

Few reason to swap engine rather than just head gasket job. In most cases the head gasket blows, due to over heating. Which often warps the head or heads. I did see some "hear-say" reports in mud of reportedly from service manager at Dealerships of head gasket leak, without over-heating. But, I've my doubts, of that, in the 4.7L 2UZ Japan made!

If coolant got into combustion chamber. A small amount my not hurt, if driver realizes early and shut down. But coolant steams cleans combustion chamber, remove lubrication, just as over-heating increases need for lubrication. This results in cylinder wall, rings and piston damage. Now we're taking about a full engine rebuild and possibly boring, with over-sized piston and rings. Which, if we want to stay with OEM Toyota, they offers STD or .005 over only. Modern rings can not be filed to gap. They must be sized to fit. So even honing by a machine shop, we made need to use over-sized rings. Then certain procedure during rebuild like honing, which stones to use and speeds to run at. I've could not find in Toyota FSM or school training info. So to match OEM Japan made tolerances, is hit and miss.

I looked into, the rebuilt engine around. I was not happy with parts or tolerance they used. I ask for OEM parts to be used, and price skyrocket. We'd still have issue of workmanship, even if willing to spend more!

One head only blew a gasket. Here we can just replace head gasket, if cylinder not scored. But if head warped, we need to have milled. This present issue with rough idle if other head not milled/shaved to balance engine. So a ton of labor, to do both heads. We looking at $5K at INDY more at Dealership. Then we issue of workmanship also.

Factory 4.7L engine (USA or Japan) is know as the million mile engine. That at 1 million miles still has honing marks on cylinder walls, and can go another million miles presumably. They don't smoke or use oil. To get that in a rebuild, takes great care (blue printing as it's called).

If we scope cylinder, and no scoring found, and no coolant in oil. Head job should be consider. But in non VVT often times a good engine can be found and can be faster to swap, then do head job. VVT engine tend to be harder to find good ones, so more weight goes into considering rebuilding.

 

[Ellex the 470th]

Hi All. I'm looking for help/opinion from people who love 100 Series vehicles. I have a 2007 LX470 with a blown head gasket. Rare, I know, I've read the IH8Mud threads. This discovery was made just AFTER I paid to have a new radiator and new brakes installed all around. Of course. Currently in the shop we all know is best in the Pacific Northwest. I won't go deep into the reasons for the engine failure..but, like all things, it is an unfortunate combination/perfect storm.

Before I make the ultimate decision on what to do, I am posting here to see if anyone knows of a used engine out there for sale. The shop it is at is also attempting to source and it is proving more difficult than previously thought.

Similarly, if someone would like to take this project on, I would sell the car at a heavy discount. Seriously. Somebody out there has the skills to put this thing back into shape.

In so many ways I truly love this vehicle. Inside it is very clean. I love the comfort, the power, and the tape deck equally. And it pains me to admit that it is not the right car for my family and I.
It has not been an off road vehicle (despite the photos I posted where my son and I tried to make it look cool). It is our ski bus and our camping trip bus and it drives to soccer practices more than anything else.

It grew up in Canada and has the rust issues that plague Cruisers.

What would you do? (besides remove the running boards!)

Thank you for your input.


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sorry you have to deal with this. Bought a clean looking 2000 off of ebay that turned out to have a blown head gasket. Only 158k. Apparently the prior owner (who sold it to the dealer I bought it from) didn't do any maintenance, despite the truck having a very high AuthCheck score of 78 (Autocheck is completely a useless guide, btw). None of my local guys including the dealership in Orange County NY, can seem to source one of these. Sure there are numerous motors available on Ebay but Im reluctant to buy one of those. Yes, it has been recommended by at least 2 places to just replace the motor rather than do the head gasket repair

 

[neoworm]

Man you guys overthink this s***. Pull the head(s) off. Assess condition, freshen up if necessary and slap a new headgasket on. Continue to enjoy Land Cruiser.

 

[Ellex the 470th]

Man you guys overthink this s***. Pull the head(s) off. Asses condition, freshen it up if necessary and slap a new headgasket on. Continue to enjoy Land Cruiser.

I certainly dont have the skill to do this, much as I'd like to. And no one within 100 miles of me feels like doing the head gasket replace.

 

[neoworm]

I certainly dont have the skill to do this, much as I'd like to. And no one within 100 miles of me feels like doing the head gasket replace.

That sucks. So the shops would rather replace the whole motor than the headgaskets? I'd keep looking or start learning to wrench. Good luck.

 

[SteveH]

They could put a green "safe zone" on the gauge or something and let it move freely. Then at least people wouldn't freak out because it will start going down again after you start moving again. The problem with the gauge is that it's often too late by the time the gauge spikes.

They could also turn on a 'check gauges' light or the 'check engine' light in times of overheat. One would think Lexus or Toyota could add this tiny bit of code to the ECU without breaking a sweat. Yes, we should all be scanning our gauges every 15 seconds as we drive (as I was told in driver's ed class), but we don't always do that.

 

[Ellex the 470th]

That sucks. So the shops would rather replace the whole motor than the headgaskets? I'd keep looking or start learning to wrench. Good luck.

Yes, the shops around me would rather replace the motor than do the HGF repair, and their rationale is that if the head gasket(s) are blown, there is a high likelihood that the cylinders are scored, and other issues that will become evident. While I dont necessarily agree even the Lexus Dealer is saying this. Apparently HG's that go bad are so uncommon on these 2UZFE motors that it may be more cost effective to replace the motor. What Im looking at $$ wise is at least $35-3600 for the HG replace, and thats not including any other issues that crop up, or $1500 for the motor plus about 23-25 hours of labor, anywhere from $85/hr. (local guy) to $150/hr (Stealership)

 

[nissanh]

I did a complete head gasket job including valve seals, resurfacing on my 92 Prizm (corolla) for the first time and was a success. Have done 66K miles since then and it drives great! It cost just $250 for everything! Wouldn't hesitate to do again on any other engine...

 

[Ellex the 470th]

I did a complete head gasket job including valve seals, resurfacing on my 92 Prizm (corolla) for the first time and was a success. Have done 66K miles since then and it drives great! It cost just $250 for everything! Wouldn't hesitate to do again on any other engine...

fwiw, theres a reason why the head gasket repair on the 2uzfe engine is billed at 23-26 hours of labor. its because there is so much involved in stripping the engine down just to get to the head gaskets in the first place. Not a job for a beginner wrencher!