1st time DIY - Front End Rebuild (1 Viewer)

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Joined
Dec 29, 2009
Threads
12
Messages
57
Location
Las Vegas, NV
Aloha folks,

After too many years of listening to my pops telling me to get everything done right the first time by taking things to a professional mechanic, I have decided to step out of the shadow of his fear and my ignorance, and learn how to do the maintenance myself.

And I sure have not gotten it right the first time. Fortunately my roommate has been helping me, but he's never worked on a TLC, either, although his experience with his VW & Xtrerra has been so vital. If I can figure out how to get pictures from my phone onto here, I will see if I can post them if necessary. However, when I look at them now, I don't think I took pictures of anything useful. I had no idea what I was doing.

I read the first 4 or 5 pages of the FAQ badly prior to beginning the rebuild of front knuckles. I say badly because due to my naïveté, and upon review of the FAQ, I'm beginning to start to have a clue about where I may have gone wrong. I'd like to hear what you guys have to say first.

I rebuilt the PS first because there's some negative camber on that side, causing noticeable outer wear on the treads after 8k miles. The vehicle would also pull slightly towards the PS, even though I had taken it to a shop for an alignment twice. Sometimes there'd also be a bit of wandering with the steering and an occasional wobble. Replaced all seals, gaskets, bearings, & tie rods. This side looked relatively good inside, not soupy, just quite low on moly grease. It took half a day with a torch to get the front tie rod end off. Took a total of two days to complete the PS rebuild. Learned about the in-lbs thing - will need to redo this side because I broke two of the wiper seal bolts inside the knuckle housing. One of them broke off just while I was trying to unscrew it. I also did a piss-poor job of installing the inner axle seal. I used a block of wood, but the wood was too soft. Pieces of wood went everywhere. I have found out that a Sharpstone herb grinder will work almost perfectly for getting that sucker close to flush, then finished it off with a socket. I am wondering if I should try to replace that sooner rather than later and how many of the other things in the knuckle would need to be replaced after such a short time?

My plan was to do an alignment myself (I found the thread here on Mud - bookmarked it somewhere) after completing both knuckles. The steering was worse after the first rebuild.

The following weekend, we did the DS. This side was visibly leaking, difficult to tell if it was just from the wiper blades or if the where the steering arm attaches, if it was leaking there too or just dripping down to there. Grease inside the knuckle was extremely soupy. There was residue of some sort of sealant on various parts, which I removed. I didn't find this on the PS. I also did not take pictures of this, and can't remember which parts had this residue. At some point, during reassembly, I discovered that I lost my spring gauge scale. We winged it by just estimating pulling by hand. Right when we were wrapping up the DS and tightening those final bolts on the flange, the last ones you tighten just before installing the snap ring & dust cap, one of the nuts stopped tightening. It literally just spins in place now - can't tighten nor loosen. Not sure how I'm going to get that off. Plan is to grind it off if we can't come up with a better solution. Any ideas?

Decided that since that nut wasn't going anywhere for the time being, to finish putting it together and go for a test drive. We only changed the back tie rod end on the DS, as the plan was to change the front DS when doing the alignment. Even with this not having been done yet, the steering was much improved. The vehicle still pulled, but wandered much less and no more wobbling. Drove the vehicle around for 3 days, even going up to 70 mph on the freeway. But on that 4th day, crunch crunch knock knock. oh boy.

Pulled over, looked underneath, nothing obvious. Pulled off the dust cap, and the grease is all cooked off, snap ring sitting in the dust cap. I managed to have this happen a mile away from home. Managed to coast home, every second and every crunchy sound was agony.

I've reinstalled the snap ring 4 times, and test drove 3 of those times. Each time, it comes right off after less than 5 min of driving at no more than 25 mph. I've tried tightening the snap ring & that did not seem to help. So it's sitting all put together after that 4th reinstall, but I know it'll just pop right back off without me doing something else.

The other detail I think important to mention is that the thrust washer, adjusting nut, and lock nut on both sides had some sharp edges, were a little chewed up. I had taken a file and smoothed them out. I'm wondering how this plays a role in everything that's happening, and why they might have been chewed up in the first place? I'm considering replacing them. What are your thoughts?

The timing is so funny. My goal was to get the work done before a business trip so upon my return, there'd be no more work. Not the case it seems, so I will have to go dark after Tuesday for two weeks. Upon my return is when the correcting work will begin.
 
That took a whole bag of popcorn to get through.

Kudos for jumping in with both feet.

First, you tube is handy, but it's not the FSM. Get one.
Second, if the snap ring won't stay on, it needs to be replaced; buy one from Toyota. Somewhere. It's made of hardened steel and doesn't like being bent out of shape. It'll take a couple of expansion cycles, but not an infinite amount, and not being expanded out out shape.
Third, get an copy of the FSM. And read it. Both of you.

As to the nuts - they get abused by people who honestly believe a chisel is an acceptable tool to remove them with. As long as the threads aren't damaged, you can remove the chisel damage and they'll be fine, but...they're cheap. A complete axle kit will have the nuts, washers and snap rings in it, along with the bearings and seals. If the nut is stripped, pull on it while turning it and it will come off. I'd be very leery of cutting that nut off. If you screw up, you'll be buying a new axle stub. Do not, under any circumstances, use heat on that stub. I'm sure someone will chime in telling you they've done it 8 zillion times and have experienced no damage; if they do, have them come over and do it for you. Have them bring a new stub, too, just in case they screw up.

If you hear grinding when the tires are turning, you have a problem. Tear the whole thing down and look at every part. Make sure the shiny parts are shiny and not scratched. Make sure the bearing preload is correct; or at least as correct as you can get it. FWIW, I've never used a spring scale, but I'm a former US Army helicopter crew chief/mechanic and I have calibrated elbows. So there's that.

Seriously, good on you for doing this yourself. Post back if you need help. You'll get it if you ask.
 
+1 on the FSM.
The snap ring under the dust cover can pop off if the hub bearing preload and locknut are not properly tight, and don’t forget to stake the nuts properly with the
Star shaped washer. The washer tabs need to contact both the inner and outer nut. A worn staking washer will rotate on the hub. The left wheel is the main culprit in this situation as rotating forces will tend to try and loosen the hub. A hub that’s too loose will grind(rotor usually rubs on caliper). The snap ring mostly keeps the outer axle 1/2 shaft from floating too much.
My current Truck tried to lose its left front wheel a week after I got it, a previous mechanic had poorly staked the hub nuts and the only thing that keep it from coming apart was the brake caliper, when I started to take the hub apart the first thing I noticed was the snap ring sitting in the dust cap.

Good job tackling it on your own. Next time you will much faster as you’ll know your way around the whole process that much better.
 
Look up Otramm videos on Youtube. This will get your visual part satisfied.

Your description could be so many things from a bad Birfield to smoked wheel bearings.

This is sometimes the learning curve.

Don't worry about the spring scale. Torque the wheel bearings to 30 LB-FT while rotating for the inner nut and 45 LB-FT for the outer nut. This fish scale doesn't work.
 
Good advice so far.

It's good to remember that the snap ring is considered a wear part. As was mentioned, they get tired. The snap goes out of them and the lack of that causes them to fling loose. If anything is wrong, that tendency is aggravated, but this can happen solely because of only the snap ring needing replacement.

As for the sealant you found on one side, sometimes it's used as a field expedient instead of the proper gaskets. Get those and use them after cleaning things up of all the old sealant.

Grinding = No bueno

Check those torque values as BILT4ME recommends and use new parts if in doubt. Based on what you found in reusing/substituting for wear parts so far, I'd say there's more than enough doubt to justify replacing all the common metal wear parts as well as a full, fresh set of gasket's. I'd also question those bearings, if they were reused and especially if that's where the grinding originates from.

On the broken bolt holding the wiper seal, the thing to do is get the right size easy-out. If things are broken off flush on the hub bolts that use the cone washers, you may need the easy-out there, too.
 
Good jumping in... You will get it right. I do all of my own work and i am not a mechanic. I don't believe most mechanics get it right the first time, and i certainly don't either, but i know in the end it is right. and you will also know when it is all good, you did it right, and how to do it again when it is needed if needed. I would add advice but the previous posters have covered it. You will find, getting back in there again will be more familiar, the second time.
 
I did not mention earlier: I replaced all the bearings, races, gaskets, & seals with a kit from Cruiser Teq.


As for the sealant you found on one side, sometimes it's used as a field expedient instead of the proper gaskets. Get those and use them after cleaning things up of all the old sealant.

I'm probably going to need more info on this in the future. Seeing as I didn't make any real notes on where it had been, I don't know where to reapply.

Look up Otramm videos on Youtube. This will get your visual part satisfied.

Yup - thanks for the confirm. Otramm & 6th Gear Garage were our go-to videos & helped immensely.


I really appreciate all the words of encouragement. I'm still freaking out about the whole thing on the inside. I found the digital FSM here on Mud a while ago. Reading it before was the same as reading the FAQ - nothing was really sticking in my brain - didn't grasp what I was reading.

That's all I can do for now. I'm going to go ahead and order new lock/adjusting nuts & snap rings for both sides. They should arrive while I am away for work. Will provide more updates upon my return & will see what I can do about taking proper pictures.
 
No need for sealant, just use new felt wipers, I'm old school, but I always use a socket to drive my seals in just find a socket that fits the seal nice.
 
Broski is correct on the sealant. You want to clean it out. Sometimes people use the sealant when parts aren't available, and in a pinch like a field repair yeah, it can be used in certain places. But then you have a mess to clean up and set right once you get home. Sometimes people use it out of ignorance or because they think they know better. You should avoid it's use except in an emergency. Mr. T does used FIPG sealant in some places on the 80, but not in the front hub assembly AFAIK.
 
Spinning nut mystery, stud doesn’t move, no room to get a screwdriver to wedge in. I got a new stud & cone washer & nut just in case I need to pull out the grinder

 
Split it. They have these at northern tool and likely just about any autopartes store. You are not sure which one Is damaged. Nut or stud. I would bet stud but you never know. Vice grips will help you hold it better than those channel locks but i think you need to just split the nut and then asses the stud damage if any.

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Got it with the nut buster, thanks for the tool recommendation.

Good thing I bought a new stud with my new nut & snap ring

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Now the fun part! This is shakira when she did the BIRF refresh several years back. If you are not carful you will be just as covered in moly .

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The cone washers were the hardest part for me. After that it is just messy and lots of cleaning but not bad.
 
The oil looks burnt on one but not both of the washers? I drove less than 100 miles after the rebuild but before the snap ring started popping off. Hoping this burnt oil thing is related to the tightness of the adjusting washer?

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Does it smell burnt? Normally it is the spindle that i see damage on. Not really the nut. Do you have a picture of how the bearing is sitting on the spindle? You did washer, to bearing then nut, tabbed washer then nut again right?

Also how do the splines look and the axle flange?
 
I wasn’t going to pull all that out since it had all looked good (with my untrained eye) when I first rebuild it.

The adjusting washer is not going on smoothly. Not sure what’s going on with it. By trying to wrench it on, the threads seem like they are shaving.

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Yep you can see slivers of metal coming off the nut. Is it just the picture or is your brake rotor not showing an even shine/wear on it?


Also how does the thrust washer look?
 
Ok, I took um off. Really hard to remove the hub this time compared to last time.

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Rotors were worn uneven at one point then had um turned.

Attached is the old thrust washer, i have a new one - figured I’d replace it with the lock & adjusting nuts as the PS looked worse during the rebuild. This is the DS that I’m having issues with.

New thrust washer has no groove.

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Ok so thrust washer looks normal for a loose bearing and old. Mine looked like that. The rotor still looks to be wearing uneven and maybe even getting hot. How do your pads look? Brakes can put a lot of heat in to the hub.

The hard pull was that a suction issue front he bearing race and spindle? The bearings role smooth and quiet still ?
 

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