12HT or 4BTA (1 Viewer)

Eco 45

Supporting Vendor
Joined
Mar 10, 2007
Messages
942
Location
Base of the Three Sisters Mountains Oregon
 
 
Looking for real world experience with the 12HT and not trying to start a debate.

If one were given the choice between one of these two engines the 12HT or 4BTA for a vehicle that weighed around 6000 lbs and was going to be used for some towing what would be your choice? This will be a daily driver rig as well.
 
Last edited:

ForealBoreal

Cummins Boostin
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Messages
6,636
Location
North Coast British Columbia
 
 
I have heard exceptional fuel economy coming from a 12ht
9l per 100kms is excellent for a cruiser
For me the parts thing doesn't really scare me but the engine is outdated
I would assume you would run an h55 with it

I also hear that the cummins engines specifically meaning the 4bt is bulletproof
What trans can you mate up to one?
I am assuming parts are readily avAilable for this engine
No clue on fuel economy though
I am interested to hear


Either or would be a good choice
 
Joined
Oct 22, 2007
Messages
1,570
Location
Enderby BC
 
 
I don't have any experience with a 4bt but do with a 12HT and loved it my HJ61. Coupled with a H55F it a was a joy to drive. Personally I think the question should be 12HT or 6BT. the 4BT from what I hear is one shaky engine and requires a 4" lift to clear the oil pan (same goes for the 6BT).

For the sake of keeping it Toyota I'd go 12HT
 
Joined
Jan 9, 2006
Messages
396
Location
Iceland
 
 
Unless you have 4BTs and 6BTs laying around I´d say 12H, a much smoother powerplant and plenty of power for towing (just intercool it and raise the boost a bit and oil ofourse)

that´s a 7 horse trailer I have towed on many occasions (never completely full though), moves it quite well, but then again the speed limit over here is 50mph for vehicles with trailers.
 
Joined
Nov 14, 2010
Messages
564
Location
Annapolis MD USA
 
I haven't driven a 12ht but my friends wife has a Dodge with the 6BT w/ NV4500. I liked it a lot. Much lower revving than the Toyota diesels though. I can only compare it to my 2H w/ a dead cylinder so it's not a fair comparison.
 
Joined
Sep 16, 2008
Messages
2,930
Location
Freensville
The 12HT is my personal favorite of the H motors - it can handle highway speeds, but still retains the tractor-ish traits of the 1 and 2 H, with improved oiling and cooling.

The downside is that it's a very old motor, and parts are no longer being manufactured. It's easier and cheaper to source parts for than, say, a 1H, but harder and more costly than a 2F.
 
Joined
Jun 4, 2009
Messages
733
Location
in cold north
IMHO i'd go for 12ht just for the sake of smoother ride and japanese quality... Also, i'd imagine it has plenty of power for towing especially if tuned a little (intercool, 3" exhaust and little more fuel). Only thing to keep in mind is that fifth gear and towing usually usually means gearbox will eventually give up, but 4th gear is good for upto 100kmh which should be enough unless you plan on breaking many speed limits while towing...
 
Joined
Jun 4, 2009
Messages
733
Location
in cold north
IMHO i'd go for 12ht just for the sake of smoother ride and japanese quality... Also, i'd imagine it has plenty of power for towing especially if tuned a little (intercool, 3" exhaust and little more fuel). Only thing to keep in mind is that fifth gear and towing usually usually means gearbox will eventually give up, but 4th gear is good for upto 100kmh which should be enough unless you plan on breaking many speed limits while towing...
EDIT; forgot to add that i occasionally tow a trailer, full of tools, weighing +1 metric tons and its a pleasure to tow with my hj61...
 
Joined
Oct 6, 2008
Messages
796
Location
Perth, Australia
Not true on this, all parts are available right now in spades. Australian suppliers are happy to post overseas no problem at all.

A 4BT is a stronger engine ultimately, but would shake like heck compared to the smooth 6cyl. They are a nice engine to drive.

As far as low end torque, if you get a high flow turbo you can have peak torque with an intercooler from 1500rpm upwards or 1600 upwards without intercooler. I realise you are talking std 12HT but the point is you can get them to produce terrific torque. Wont ever be a 6BT thats been hotted up, but you easily get it going better than a stock 6BT (early 160hp version I mean).

The 12HT is my personal favorite of the H motors - it can handle highway speeds, but still retains the tractor-ish traits of the 1 and 2 H, with improved oiling and cooling.

The downside is that it's a very old motor, and parts are no longer being manufactured. It's easier and cheaper to source parts for than, say, a 1H, but harder and more costly than a 2F.
 
Joined
Oct 6, 2008
Messages
796
Location
Perth, Australia
Real world experience.

OK, we have a hill here in Perth "Greenmount", Western Australia on a highway called "Great Eastern Hwy". On std 12HT it wouldnt pull at 80km/h in 4th up it. With boost and fuel turned up with 3" exhaust it could just do it in 5th @ 1900-200rpm, no acceleration, sometimes a downshift (then it flies).

Hiflow the turbo and it can do it easily in 5th and accelerate from 80. In fact it can do it from 1500rpm (<60) and when at or above 1600rpm (~60) it can accelerate at any part of the hill in 5th.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Jun 12, 2007
Messages
3,219
Location
Portland OR
 
 
4bts don't shake like crazy. They do produce vibs but nothing that shakes your fillings out or scrambles your brain, howerver, I do agree it won't be as smooth as a 6 cylinder. Once I take care of my out of round tires it'll be plenty smooth on the hwy meaning my annoying vibs are not coming from my engine. Parts availability for cummins is great but getting a cheap 4bt is getting harder. 6bts seem to be easier to find and can be cheaper but it is a big engine. Overall I really like my 4bt and it just keeps pulling no matter what I put behind it.
 
Joined
Sep 16, 2008
Messages
2,930
Location
Freensville
Cummins seems to be the best American motor company in terms of quality and support. Bottom line.
Yes, every Toy diesel I've seen has been the smoothest, quietest, and most attractive diesel ever made, but Cummins certainly has a strong contending, and I would swap a B3.3 into my truck without a thought if it didn't require buying an NV4500.

I did not know the folks down south had good access to 12HT parts, in North America, they're hard to come by, but if I could find one for a fair price, I'd pounce on it without a second thought.
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 1)

Top Bottom