Tatton DC Failure (1 Viewer)

[jcardona1]

Interesting thread. I also have a rear DC Tatton shaft and while it doesn't have a lot of miles on it, it's given me no problems yet. But I did go through a lot of work redoing the rear suspension to get the right pinion angles for a DC shaft. I'd be curious to see if there is a correlation between failure rates and those driveshafts that are outside the operating spec for a DC shaft. I wonder if those factors, along with lower-quality components is causing the earlier failure.

 

[baldilocks]

Another failure here. Less than 10k miles and the cv blew up on the interstate. The guy at tatton said he never saw failures and mine broke because I didn’t grease it. Claimed the cv should be greased every oil change otherwise it will seize up. We either grease too little or too much. Can’t win with Tatton. I reckon we get what we pay for boys! The spicer life joints held up though and prevented a catastrophic failure.

Tatton’s lube schedule is BS. I must have went 75k miles without lubing the center pin of the front dc joint in my 2005 Dodge 2500. It has 170k on it now and is still fine. The dodge system turns the shaft when the wheels are rotating so it’s similar to your AWD but with no power transmission until 4x4 is shifted in.

This thread is why I prefer to pay more and have drivelines built locally. I dealt with a very good shop in west Sacramento for many years on different projects and now with a dedicated driveline shop up here in Portland since I moved to WA. Both shops confirm that the DC is not spicer, I don’t think they make one for our bolt pattern, but I can’t remember who does makes them.

I run double dc shafts and have two shafts for the rear that I usually rotate out every 5k at oil change time. They get wheeled hard and have held up as far as catastrophic failure goes but with something like 20k or so miles on them, probably less on one of them and more in the other, my driveline shop found that a couple bearing caps were spinning in the 1310 dc joints of both shafts. Those are supposed to be a press fit.

We can’t expect a smaller U-joint to last as long as the over sized rear joints that the 80 came with because the bearing surface area is significantly smaller. This is why I bought two and always carry the second one with me.

Last August when my failing dc joints were discovered I gave Tom Woods drivelines a called and they informed me that Trail Gear would soon be marketing a transfer case output flange or yoke, one or the other, that would allow us Toyota guys to run a 1350 DC/CV. As it would be, I needed shafts right then for a Dusy Ershim run and didn’t have time to wait for TG to test and bring to market their new companion flange for our transfer case. So now I’m i$850 into two new 1350 rear shafts again.

So if you are in the market for a rear DC shaft give Tom Woods a call and see about a stronger 1350 DC joint. 1350 is considered 1 ton or was at one time. I used them on a previous build that had 40’s and was capable of 350:1 low range with no failures.

Just for reference, the spicer 1350 bearing cap diameter is 1/10th or .100” smaller than the diameter of the caps on your stock rear 80 series driveline. This is why I call the 80 rear joints over sized and why they last so long with proper maintenance.

Happy New Year

 

[Virginian]

technically the ideal setup is 0°, so no movement during operation.

My pinion flange is up 6deg, tcase flange is up 3deg.
This is with slee caster plates and 4” Lift.

 

[landtank]

My pinion flange is up 6deg, tcase flange is up 3deg.
This is with slee caster plates and 4” Lift.

I've always have done this to check pinion angle alignment for a dc shaft

DC-Shaft pinion check

I've had a few questions about vibrations and whether or not a DC shaft is the solution/problem. So I decided to post up how I evaluate the pinion angle to confirm if the pinion is aligned correctly for a DC shaft to operate without any vibrations. The technical aspect of this is that a DC...

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[COYS]

Similar issue, different brand, different vehicle. Mine was a custom from JE Reel. When I tore down the DC to see why it was binding and noisy, I didn't see any stamping giving me a clue who made it. I took it to a local shop and he said I was lucky it didn't disintegrate. Seems some of the drive shaft manufactures are using cheap Chinese parts. The shop I took it to said they see quite a few. Everything was replaced with Spicer.

I spoke with Jim, who I believe is the og owner of JE Reel, to commission a new DC driveshaft for me using all Japanese parts. I forget the name of the actual Japanese shaft manufacturer (something that starts with an F for Fuji******?), but the u-joints would be Matsuba which I understand was the original Toyota joint supplier before they lost the contract to Spicer once they started the whole US plant Tacoma/Tundra thing.

I'm excited to see what he delivers in about a week's time!

P.S. JE Reel sounds legit

Throwing parts at a 60 build thread. Now Featuring V8 swap

I know @woody touts these guys, but I don't see any Toyota categories on their website. Maybe there is a secret MUD entrance? https://www.reeldriveline.com/index.php?route=common/home

forum.ih8mud.com

96/97 heavy duty rear drive shaft

So what are the cool kids doing these days with regards to a heavier than OEM tube rear drive shaft? My custom fab guy is too busy to deal with me, so I am looking for an off the shelf product. I would like to keep the OEM joints as I feel they are better quality than Spicer or any other...

forum.ih8mud.com

 

[smritte]

I hope their product is better now. If you would have seen what I have with them over the years you would have wondered how they stay in business.

The issues I have seen and heard span decades, not just mine. On my last one the tube wasn't welded straight and the yokes were out of phase by about 10 degrees. This was a rear shaft for my Jeep so it was short. The amount of balance weight was shocking to try to fix this. I didn't notice the vibration until I regeared. I found the issue while trying to see it I got the yokes out of phase. At first I thought I bent it badly but there were no marks. I took it to a shop I had used in the past. The first thing he said was "Is this a JE REEL?". That shop was Irwindale drive line. The shaft was one year old. I paid him to retube it.
Two years later is when I had my failure with the CV. I took it to Inland drive line this time. The comment there was about the crappy CV's he was seeing alot of.
All three places are within 15 min's of my house. Irwindale drive line is a small place I have used since the late 70's. Inland is much bigger and does a ton of business. My shop was around the corner from Inland and I have dealt with them since the 80's. One told me who made it without a name being on it and the other has seen multiple failures due to crappy parts. All three are in the same area and people building Rock rigs is common here. All three companies will see a good share of the same shaft builds. Being into custom builds my whole life as well as working in the automotive field for several decades, driveshafts are not new to me. I didn't get into detail when I made my post because I didn't see the need. Some people love them and never have a problem. I nor anyone I know will use them again. As I said, I have known about them and know quite a few who have used them. My issue wasnt just me.

 

[COYS]

I hope their product is better now. If you would have seen what I have with them over the years you would have wondered how they stay in business.

The issues I have seen and heard span decades, not just mine. On my last one the tube wasn't welded straight and the yokes were out of phase by about 10 degrees. This was a rear shaft for my Jeep so it was short. The amount of balance weight was shocking to try to fix this. I didn't notice the vibration until I regeared. I found the issue while trying to see it I got the yokes out of phase. At first I thought I bent it badly but there were no marks. I took it to a shop I had used in the past. The first thing he said was "Is this a JE REEL?". That shop was Irwindale drive line. The shaft was one year old. I paid him to retube it.
Two years later is when I had my failure with the CV. I took it to Inland drive line this time. The comment there was about the crappy CV's he was seeing alot of.
All three places are within 15 min's of my house. Irwindale drive line is a small place I have used since the late 70's. Inland is much bigger and does a ton of business. My shop was around the corner from Inland and I have dealt with them since the 80's. One told me who made it without a name being on it and the other has seen multiple failures due to crappy parts. All three are in the same area and people building Rock rigs is common here. All three companies will see a good share of the same shaft builds. Being into custom builds my whole life as well as working in the automotive field for several decades, driveshafts are not new to me. I didn't get into detail when I made my post because I didn't see the need. Some people love them and never have a problem. I nor anyone I know will use them again. As I said, I have known about them and know quite a few who have used them. My issue wasnt just me.

Thanks for sharing your experience. I just want a high quality drive shaft and support a legit shop. I have no relationship with any shop locally. If landtank had his DC available now, I’d order another from him.

On one hand, I found some poor Jeep reviews on JE Reel while on the other can readily link to articles on a major publication.

How J.E. Reel Drive Line Specialists Builds Driveshafts for Our TJ Wrangler Project

How to select driveshaft U-joint, wall thickness, slip type, and CV, as well as different axle and transfer case yoke types for custom aftermarket Jeep driveshafts.

www.motortrend.com

Did you buy yours new from JE Reel?

If yes, since you were doing biz with Irwindale since the 70s et al, why did you buy a new JE Reel shaft?

You say it was a custom JE Reel job. What did you specify parts-wise?

 

[smritte]

My first drive shafts were on my early Drag cars. I lived in Glendora, Irwindale drive shaft was down the street and everyone in my area then used him. When I moved to Ontario in the mid 80's, Inland drive line was around the corner. My shop used them often. JE Reel came in....mid 90's? Around that time I bought a Jeep and needed a long slip yoke. They were starting to advertise so I tried them. I wasn't happy with the weld quality and they didn't balance it. I was told if I wanted it balanced, I had to pay more and tell them up front. By this time I have had two or three custom shafts made in Irwindale (never had to tell them to balance it), I "assumed" balancing was part of the cost. I paid Inland drive line to balance it due to their proximity and my frustration with JE Reel.
My next one was from Tom Woods. It was the same price as JE Reel and it came balanced. OH, JE Reel didn't mark the slip yoke for indexing, all my others were. Roll forward 10 years. New Jeep and I was having a long travel suspension installed (I didn't have access to my shop anymore). I was having the rear lengthened so I had to wait on the suspension before I ordered the shaft. The shop said they could get a JE Reel faster then I could get a Tom Woods or Inland drive line (price was the same for all of them). I figured with all the advertising maybe they stepped up their quality. I was wrong. Since then Inland drive line has build me two shafts, repaired the JE Reel shaft and reworked my Cruiser shaft.

Most of the complaints I heard from other people were balancing and workmanship. I was really pissed when I learned of the cheap CV they installed (should have bought the Tom Woods). I had already accepted the tube being welded crooked, the yokes out of phase and no slip yoke markings. The amount of money I spent on the last one from them (cost plus repairs) I could have bought two Tom Woods shafts. I know there's people out there who love them. I just got bit twice.

 

[smritte]

You say it was a custom JE Reel job. What did you specify parts-wise?

Just saw this. I didn't specify, The shop doing the suspension knew what I needed and they ordered it. Basically, this length, this slip yoke, CV.....
Everything was suppose to be Spicer. I do know all the parts were but didn't know the CV wasn't.

 

[ajax1]

@COYS Why not just build a shaft out of a runner or taco shaft with the cv then you will have what you want

 

[93yotasr5]

Interesting thread. I also have a rear DC Tatton shaft and while it doesn't have a lot of miles on it, it's given me no problems yet. But I did go through a lot of work redoing the rear suspension to get the right pinion angles for a DC shaft. I'd be curious to see if there is a correlation between failure rates and those driveshafts that are outside the operating spec for a DC shaft. I wonder if those factors, along with lower-quality components is causing the earlier failure.

Is that Tatton DC driveshaft still holding up? How many you have on it?

 

[Box Rocket]

My first drive shafts were on my early Drag cars. I lived in Glendora, Irwindale drive shaft was down the street and everyone in my area then used him. When I moved to Ontario in the mid 80's, Inland drive line was around the corner. My shop used them often. JE Reel came in....mid 90's? Around that time I bought a Jeep and needed a long slip yoke. They were starting to advertise so I tried them. I wasn't happy with the weld quality and they didn't balance it. I was told if I wanted it balanced, I had to pay more and tell them up front. By this time I have had two or three custom shafts made in Irwindale (never had to tell them to balance it), I "assumed" balancing was part of the cost. I paid Inland drive line to balance it due to their proximity and my frustration with JE Reel.
My next one was from Tom Woods. It was the same price as JE Reel and it came balanced. OH, JE Reel didn't mark the slip yoke for indexing, all my others were. Roll forward 10 years. New Jeep and I was having a long travel suspension installed (I didn't have access to my shop anymore). I was having the rear lengthened so I had to wait on the suspension before I ordered the shaft. The shop said they could get a JE Reel faster then I could get a Tom Woods or Inland drive line (price was the same for all of them). I figured with all the advertising maybe they stepped up their quality. I was wrong. Since then Inland drive line has build me two shafts, repaired the JE Reel shaft and reworked my Cruiser shaft.

Most of the complaints I heard from other people were balancing and workmanship. I was really pissed when I learned of the cheap CV they installed (should have bought the Tom Woods). I had already accepted the tube being welded crooked, the yokes out of phase and no slip yoke markings. The amount of money I spent on the last one from them (cost plus repairs) I could have bought two Tom Woods shafts. I know there's people out there who love them. I just got bit twice.

FWIW, I had a front DC shaft that was all Toyota parts and the DC failed last year. It had quite a few miles and a lot of hard use so no biggie. The typical sources for Toyota DC shafts had nothing in stock and no idea when they would so I had one from Tom Woods built. I put the TW DC shaft in the truck in Feb. Recently did a trip to Idaho and the driveshaft started making noise on the drive to Idaho. I pulled it out and the center joint of the DC joint had failed. Then I looked at the axle end and that ujoint was even worse. So my custom TW driveshaft that was 8 months old and had roughly 2700 miles on it (all normal road miles, nothing off-road) was total junk.

That was my first time using Tom Woods and the initial experience was not a good one. I figured with their reputation I’d get more the 8 mo. and 2700 miles. To their credit, they just replaced it under warranty. I would have been ticked if they had not. So I installed the new TW DC shaft yesterday. Hopefully this new one will do better. If not, it’s back to Toyota ones and never anything less.

 

[jstew0903]

I have a Tatton front DC in my 80 with 30k+ miles on it. I grease it when I do an oil change. No problems so far. I will say the DC fitting is a pain to grease. It's the needle type. The owner seems like a stand up guy.

Jason

 

[smritte]

So I installed the new TW DC shaft yesterday. Hopefully this new one will do better. If not, it’s back to Toyota ones and never anything less.

Well that sucks. That symptom was the same as my JE Reel. I will be disappointed if they started using the same junk CV I got stuck with.

 

[COYS]

JE Reel didn’t work out for me either. I commissioned a brand new DC using Matsuba joints else iirc they resort to the ubiquitous Spicer products.

It’s tough to avoid made in China parts these days and DC shafts are one of them…

Unless you rock what Landtank offers which I’m running currently with one brand new unit sitting in storage. Zero issues. 50k+ miles now.

 

[PIP]

I have often wondered if there would be room to use a common, oversize CV joint instead of a DC in driveshafts. Seems like the late model GM truck IFS CV's and boots would be a decent foundation to build a driveshaft with.

 

[eric90503]

Wasn't going to comment about this months ago, but just a FYI. Tatton's DS are questionable.. and they don't back their product up. Mine had less than 2k miles on it. 1368mi to be exact before it went. I bought it to fix a driveline vibration. DS went in and no dice from the get go, same driveline vibration. Spent months racking my brain trying to figure out what that vibration could be coming from, because it definitely couldn't be coming from my new DCDS.

I emailed and called Curtis, his response was" no grease.." no sh*#. I asked does it come greased at the shop and is it ready to go? He said yes, greased at the shop and basically to pound sand on trying to remedy it. Lesson learned, always give it a little grease despite what the shop says and don't get a Tatton.
Got a Tom Woods, driveline vibe fixed and all is good.

 

[BILT4ME]

Wasn't going to comment about this months ago, but just a FYI. Tatton's DS are questionable.. and they don't back their product up. Mine had less than 2k miles on it. 1368mi to be exact before it went. I bought it to fix a driveline vibration. DS went in and no dice from the get go, same driveline vibration. Spent months racking my brain trying to figure out what that vibration could be coming from, because it definitely couldn't be coming from my new DCDS.

I emailed and called Curtis, his response was" no grease.." no sh*#. I asked does it come greased at the shop and is it ready to go? He said yes, greased at the shop and basically to pound sand on trying to remedy it. Lesson learned, always give it a little grease despite what the shop says and don't get a Tatton.
Got a Tom Woods, driveline vibe fixed and all is good.



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I cannot believe that they think that "no grease" with only 1368 miles.

Hell that's only one weeks ' drive for me.

Going to get groceries? Better grease the Tatton shaft! Such horseshyt!

I work with industrial equipment and if something is that unreliable, chuck it and either redesign it or figure out a different solution.

 

[COYS]

How about support a vendor that actively contributes here and also happens to make the best DC shaft for your commonly 2-2.5” lifted 80s?

Landtank Products!

 

[jstew0903]

My Tatton was well greased with the red grease.

Someone should do a price breakdown of the different manufacturers. Show all of the options to everyone who's following this thread. Especially the people needing to purchase a DCDS.

With all of the back and forth bashing and bragging I would hope someone would make a list. Especially the ones who support this community.

Jason