12HT and 1HZ Diesel conversions for American market (1 Viewer)

[MCJakeCrim]

Fellas, Gents, fellow Yanks.
Looking into the market for American 12Ht and 1HZ conversions for US Land Cruisers.
If a few fellow investors and I brought in some imported engines would there be an interest in US conversions? Say, 20 engines or so a year that we rebuild here in the US, with AUS engineered parts?
If so what type, model, year and what State are you from and which engine?
I'm in a position where i could possibly make this a business.
I'm not trying to rob people and make a ton of money, so what you guys, the common Cruiser head would like to pay for a diesel conversion would be interesting for a market research prospective. I'm retiring from my first career and this would be possible if i could sustain a business and not F-over people while making it worth my time. I have AUS contacts for exporting and all the right avenues in place for clean and solid engine rebuilds.
Knowing how the market of who wants a diesel and if they want a crate engine or installed turn key is important. Plus, what the common man is willing to pay. Theres no way I can import a used engine and not rebuild it new to spec for someone. Just doesnt seem correct. If the market just screams import and no rebuild, let me know. This is my outlet for market research so please speak up if its something you guys want. So, what year Vehicle, Model, Engine desired (12HT/1HZ), what state you're from, what you want, new rebuilt/used swap and what you think its worth in price to you for a crate and or labor for a full swap.
Thanks,
-Jake

 

[MCJakeCrim]

Also, Let me know if the 1HD-*T* variant engines is desired. Which model if so:
IHD-T, 1HD-FT, 1HD-FTE.

Thanks again.
-Jake

 

[Laughingjackal]

1986 - HJ60 - Colorado

I am interested in the 12ht. I'm currently trying to determine the pro/cons of replacing my 2H with a rebuilt 12ht or a crate R2.8. From my reasearch so far I am looking at anywhere from $8k to $25k. One of my primary concerns with the 12ht is the availability of parts, now and years down the road. From that perspective, the R2.8 is looking pretty appealing.

 

[roscoFJ73]

While the 1HZ maybe common, the factory turbo versions are not and you would be competing against established engine retailers. They haven't made a 12HT for 28 years

 

[MCJakeCrim]

Due to the no replies I can tell there isnt much market for this. My investor friend that just came back from AUS hunting down a used engine suplier said a lot of 12HTs in the country are getting boxed and shipped out to India. I thought that was interesting. Like theres a growing market over in that area for older diesel engines.

 

[roscoFJ73]

I think there is a market, but too many people promise on this and dont deliver because tracking down good 12HT's is near on impossible. I would take it with a pinch of salt about sending engines to India. He is probably trying to hide his market, which is most likely N America

 

[duncanrm]

My investor friend that just came back from AUS hunting down a used engine suplier said a lot of 12HTs in the country are getting boxed and shipped out to India. I thought that was interesting. Like theres a growing market over in that area for older diesel engines.

12HTs are very sought after in Australia.. I'm struggling to believe that they can make more money being sold in India than on-shore in Australia.

 

[60 mad]

The supply of 12hts is getting smaller and smaller in Australia so trying to find more then a couple a year would be very hard to achieve at a price that would not impact your margin by the time it got to USA to make a decent return on but 1hz engines are still very plentiful

 

[Tapage]

The best thing about the 1HZ come after the fact it's a engine that's still on production and on actual use on new models ( HZJ7* )

 

[roscoFJ73]

12HTs are very sought after in Australia.. I'm struggling to believe that they can make more money being sold in India than on-shore in Australia.

Wreckers wont even sell 12HT parts, they horde them away until they have all the components for a complete engine.

 

[wedgetail]

Yeah not a lot of 12H-Ts about that’s for sure. Certainly not at wreckers.

Also I struggle to see why you’d go to all the effort with a conversion just to put a 1hz in. They’re gutless and thirsty and crack the head and pistons if you try and get any power out with a turbo. They’re very reliable NA And a great engine in their original vehicle but if you’re going to all the vast time effort and expense the only engines worth playing with would be 1HD***. A lot of these here come from Japan and even Europe though. You could probably set something up bringing 1HD-FTEs in and putting mech pumps on them. If you had a good relationship (as in pricing) with a pump shop this might be viable.

I guess you could build 1hzs into 1HDs but parts aren’t cheap. Again the most expensive bit would be the pump, not that the head with gear, pistons and rods would be cheap but if you’re contemplating rebuilding anyway maybe something to consider

 

[Tapage]

If your goal it's performance .. 1HD-F** it's your path ..

 

[roscoFJ73]

Also I struggle to see why you’d go to all the effort with a conversion just to put a 1hz in. They’re gutless and thirsty and crack the head and pistons if you try and get any power out with a turbo.

A lot of people dont share that opinion. The acceleration from a 1HZ may not be stellar, but in the hands of a good driver it keeps up with the traffic and its open road speed limit is more limited by the handling and braking in a tall skinny body.

 

[wedgetail]

A lot of people dont share that opinion. The acceleration from a 1HZ may not be stellar, but in the hands of a good driver it keeps up with the traffic and its open road speed limit is more limited by the handling and braking in a tall skinny body.

i might have come across harsher than I meant. I drive and maintain 1hzs every day at work and I owned an hzj105 as our family car and loved it. They are very reliable and there’s no job they can’t do - just a bit slower than some others. I generally never go over 100 (although the neatest 110 road is a few hours away) and the lack of power never put me in a spot and I was only Down to Third occasionally... luckily we don’t get traffic out here! But they do use more fuel than any other Toyota Diesel engines in my experience (not that I’ve had anything to do with the B series), and reliability falls off a cliff when you try and get more power. And 5000k servicing gets old really quick when you do 60k a year.

But to actually go to the vast time/effort/expense of putting one in a vehicle that didn’t have it originally doesn’t make a lot of sense. If the 1hz had failed on my 105 I certainly wouldn’t have put it back in. But it didn’t, I sold it,bought an fzj105 and an fte with the change. My god now i see what I was missing.

 

[roscoFJ73]

I got rid of the 3F in my FJ73 and replaced it with a rebuilt a 1HZ, and it was a huge improvement. Fuel consumption went from 350klms to almost 600klm to a tank. Engine swaps of any kind rarely pay you back.
Friends with 1HD T dont get that much better fuel consumption.

 

[wedgetail]

Well I’m sure it would use less than a 3F! But then again a 2H would use less again. 1HD-Ts might only use a bit less, but it’s also got much more power potential and much better reliability when you crank it up. Shame they eat big ends...

My FTE conversion has already paid for itself 2 months later (probably not my labour) but that involved changing bodies. Granted most don’t for a little while

 

[MCJakeCrim]

The thing here in America is if you wanted a widely produced diesel, you pretty much have had three choices as far as a larger truck framed vehicle.
The love for Toyota diesels has exploded here in N. America, in my opinion because there have been a lot of veterans coming home from wars over the last 17 years in other countries and they are given a lot of toyota diesels to drive in those countries.
They come home with an infatuation for these tough toyotas.

 

[roscoFJ73]

But then again a 2H would use less again

No it wouldnt, the 6 cyl diesels all use pretty much the same, only the power differs. You cant push a lump of flat faced metal around and use less than 12/100.

 

[wedgetail]

No it wouldnt, the 6 cyl diesels all use pretty much the same, only the power differs. You cant push a lump of flat faced metal around and use less than 12/100.

disagree. In my experience on average the 2H uses less. My HJ47 troopy fully loaded with roof rack, full wrap around scrub bars and bullbar made from 2" heavy wall water pipe, incoopetating the roof rack and loaded with swags, 2 spares and 4 jerry cans (did a 7.5k toad trip like this) never got worse than 14 l/100. My brother's HJ60 gets 11-12 combined, down below 10 on the highway sometimes. My uncles HJ60 got 11-12 combined always (me driving and filling this is not second hand). It’s fuel usage is pretty much on par with my hdj105 if not better. I've consistently read about people getting these consumption figures in HJ75s, HJ60s and HJ47s. All with a mix of 235/85R16s with the 2Hs if anything much older and more worn. I'd rate my brother's HJ60 on par with most HZJ75s power wise too. I maintain and am a driver of 10 HZJ7*s at work, along with an HJ75 and HJ47. I know 60 series are a bit lighter than 105s but not that much and less streamlined.

I never got better than 12.5 l/100km in my hzj105, often up to 14. That's with 265s and corrected, no rack, alloy bar fairly empty. Fully loaded with roof rack 15-16. My hzj79 gets 15 at best after a dyno tune and new injectors (190k on it now). The best I've managed with an hzj75 is 14. The recent brake specific fuel consumption thread also confirms the 2H is ahead. I think the 1HZ is thirsty for what it is.

 

[Prairie Swamp]

You cant push a lump of flat faced metal around and use less than 12/100.

I just had to do it - that's 19.6 US miles per gallon for those of us stuck in the imperial system.