Which of these wheels would you install on your own LC200? (1 Viewer)

[PaulC]

Folks,

I was hoping to get some sage advice on a build for a (new to me) 2014 Land Cruiser 200 series. I may have to spread the build out over time so my wife doesn't divorce me but in the short term, I'd like to swap out wheels/tires (and possibly upgrade a suspension kit if needed).

As you guys know, the OEM stock wheel on the LC200 is 18x8, +60 offset, 5x150 lug pattern, 110.0 hub bore. And the OEM tire is 285/60r18. I'm ok with sticking to the OEM tire size if its too much trouble to upsize to 35" tires.

As much as I would like to push the wheels outward a bit more from the stock +60 offset, in doing so, I don't want to unintentionally mess up the suspension's geometry (for example, by creating too large of a “positive scrub radius”). I was thinking about the wheels below, but would appreciate this group’s collective thoughts on whether or not any of them would be a good fit for the LC200.

• 18" Volk TE37 Large PCD Progressive: 0 offset, not sure what hub bore is? Obi Wong Kenobi used to run these
• 18" Enkei RPT1: 0 offset. I saw this on RPM Offroad Groups's instagram and love this rim, but not sure if this is available in 5x150 lug pattern? ...or what the hub bore is?
• 18" Black Rhino Roku: +12 offset. One of the few aftermarket wheels that is hub centric to the LC200 with a 110.0 hub bore. 470SNC installed these on a GX, but they are also available for LC.
• 17" FN Koenig Six Shooter (unannounced): Smaller 17" diameter. +25 offset seems about just right. But not sure whether the hub bore is 110.0 for the LC200 or 110.5 for the 2014+ Tundra. According to Dustin at FN (who has been incredibly helpful), this has a 110.0 hub bore, but some of the pics I’ve seen also include installs on the 2014+ Tundra (which has hub bore that's 0.5mm larger than the LC200). As has been documented in other forums, Dustin is an upstanding guy and was completely candid in steering me away from the 18” FN BFD.
• 18" 2019 Tundra TRD Pro BBS forged: 18x8, +60 offset is same as existing OEM wheels so its not really really going to push the wheels out. 110.5 hub bore, which is 0.5mm larger than the LC200. codyaustin5 purchased a set recently, so hopefully we’ll get a chance to check them out on an LC200.
• 17" Arctic Truck brand: +30 offset. 110.0 hub bore. 10" wide. Smaller 17" diameter. Because this wheel is custom made for the LC200 only and no other car, it is a perfect fit, meaning its hub centric, and even though it pushes the offset outward by 30mm, it still maintains the same suspension geometry with a zero scrub radius. The Aussie Arctic truck build by Ballsbgym is nothing short of incredible. But as he indicated, Arctic Trucks won't export their wheels; instead they require customers to ship their trucks to Iceland to be converted. But he did mention that Fjallasport was willing to export the wheels. Also, while every single one of the Arctic Truck builds are stunning, they are all on 35" tires (or larger) - so its hard to visualize if the same wheel would look just as good on the OEM stock tire size. ...and would the OEM 285mm wide tire be too narrow to fit on a 10" wide wheel?

With aftermarket wheels, it has been nearly impossible to find a wheel that checks the boxes of each and every one of my following criteria: (1) hub centric, even if with adapters; (2) optimal offset that doesn’t throw off geometry & scrub radius in particular; and (3) load rating, whether indestructible forged, flow formed as a middle ground, or a cast wheel. Compromise is almost a necessity. I can usually check 1 of the boxes, and maybe 2 if I’m lucky, but never 3 – except that the Arctic Truck wheels seems to be spot on with everything, including a zero scrub radius.

With respect to offset, I’m less concerned about stuffing the wheel into the fender, because I’ve seen several folks in the forums that have stuff a zero offset wheel such as the TE37 (with OEM tire sizes) stuff the wheel at full compression/articulation. Instead, I was worried about the resulting effect of a large positive scrub radius on handling (e.g. creates toe out on acceleration, toe in during braking, additional stress/wear on bearings, lugs, suspension).

If I'm just overthinking the whole hub centric or offset thing, just let me know. I wasn't sure how important hub centric was for a heavy 5,800+ lb car, or whether a large positive scrub radius was anything to worry about.

On a side note, I'd like to eventually swap the front bumper for this Rhino Bar bumper on the Vogue Industries build, but its going to have to wait because my funds are finite.

Thank you in advance for your time. Look forward to the feedback from this group.

 

[Whiskerz]

My questions which some of these wheels do not answer is where are they made ? How are they made ? weight and load rating?
I would eliminate Chinese and castings and see what is left. The Black Rhino and Koenig give not a lot of information on the website. The Volk wheels are forged and made in Japan. The BBS wheels are solid. The Enki's are as well, I think they are cast. I have Enki wheels on 1 car and am happy. 285/60-18 can run on a 10 inch rim. At least on the K02 that I am running.

 

[TeCKis300]

I'm glad to see that someone is paying attention to scrub radius. It's an important variable if one wants to maintain good handling, both on and off-road. Basically anytime the steering is turned, or the suspension is cycled, the scrub radius geometry is at play. Definitely worthwhile to focus on.

Given your own consideration of scrub radius, I would eliminate anything with an offset 25mm or lower. That shortens the list dramatically. IMO, it's just too much of a compromise. To scrub radius. But also, to fitment and tire clearance, as it causes a tire to "swing" in the tire well more, causing its own clearance issues. Because of this, it also limits the practical tire sizes that can be run.

You've mentioned sticking to OEM tire size, but also 35's? That's a huge spread, with many many great tire dimensions within that range.

What is your tire goals? Overall tire diameter has an influence on ideal offset. It plays into the the geometry too, due to the kingpin and steering axis inclination.

 

[PaulC]

My questions which some of these wheels do not answer is where are they made ? How are they made ? weight and load rating?
I would eliminate Chinese and castings and see what is left. The Black Rhino and Koenig give not a lot of information on the website. The Volk wheels are forged and made in Japan. The BBS wheels are solid. The Enki's are as well, I think they are cast. I have Enki wheels on 1 car and am happy. 285/60-18 can run on a 10 inch rim. At least on the K02 that I am running.

Thanks Whiskerz. Always good to hear from someone who has hands on experience with these brands.

 

[PaulC]

I'm glad to see that someone is paying attention to scrub radius. It's an important variable if one wants to maintain good handling, both on and off-road. Basically anytime the steering is turned, or the suspension is cycled, the scrub radius geometry is at play. Definitely worthwhile to focus on.

Given your own consideration of scrub radius, I would eliminate anything with an offset 25mm or lower. That shortens the list dramatically. IMO, it's just too much of a compromise. To scrub radius. But also, to fitment and tire clearance, as it causes a tire to "swing" in the tire well more, causing its own clearance issues. Because of this, it also limits the practical tire sizes that can be run.

You've mentioned sticking to OEM tire size, but also 35's? That's a huge spread, with many many great tire dimensions within that range.

What is your tire goals? Overall tire diameter has an influence on ideal offset. It plays into the the geometry too, due to the kingpin and steering axis inclination.

With respect to tire sizing, my preference is to actually stick with OEM tire sizing, mostly due to the fact that: (1) if I'm honest with myself, the LC will be used for hauling the kids to ski and MTB trips, but not rock crawling; & (2) I have no desire to add weight unnecessarily. For my purposes, the OEM is plenty big. The only reason I contemplated 35" tires was because the Arctic Truck tire is a large investment to import blindly without ever seeing them on an OEM sized tire. If I ended up importing them but (after arriving) the OEM tire size looked awkward, if I wasn't able to sell them, I would keep the wheels and upsize the tire.

It was good to hear your thoughts on scrub radius, especially since I hadn't really found many folks discussing it. I'm still in learning mode trying to take in as much info as possible.

 

[bjorn240]

Of those, I'd pick the forged 18" TRD rims. Though as you say they won't push the rims out (which I see as a positive). That said, having just made this decision a few months ago, I'd go with Rock Warriors (as I did). I think forged, 23.5 lbs, OEM wheels can't really be beat.

 

[grinchy]

@PaulC that FN wheel option looks interesting. When are these available?

 

[TeCKis300]

I come from the school of sports cars and track days, where having the right scrub radius is crucial. It's not any less crucial on trucks, but there's somewhat less noticeable impacts. Don't get me wrong as there is, but people are more forgiving of ill suspension habits, and truck steering has a way of isolating and masking the steering feedback.

I ask about tire diameter, because it has immediate implications on optimal scrub radius. Following the graphic, one can imagine if the tire diameter grows, the intersection at the tire contact patch between the tire center and pivot angle radius will change. Having the right offset per tire diameter brings that relationship back to center.

Back of the napkin estimates says:
Stock 31.2" tire, 60mm offset.
For a 33" tire, ~48mm.
35" tire, ~35mm.

This is why you see all OEM wheels, designed to run a ~31.2" tire, have an offset of 60mm. Also why rock warrior wheels, designed to run a ~32.8" tire (285/70r17), have an offset of 50mm. And also why the Arctic Truck wheel, designed for a 35" tire, have an offset of 30mm.

So before picking a wheel, one wants to narrow down the desired tire size.

I personally like OEM wheels. Pick the style you want, then apply the spacer, as necessary, to get the optimal offset. I don't love spacers, but it's the lesser of some evils in my mind.

Wheel manufacturing process, while interesting, is not as important in my mind. Each process can make a good wheel. Some inherently stronger, perhaps with less material. But where this comes into play, is that manufacturers will vary the wheel geometry to take advantage of a process, to reach a final strength requirement/target. Therefore, none is inherently stronger, unless they are designed to meet a higher load rating requirement. I personally trust OEM wheels for the heavy lifting my car needs to do.

Somewhat off topic and this is from the rumormill, but there's suggestions that 16+ OEM wheels may have a slightly different stock offset? I've heard ~56mm? Perhaps as a result of redesigned suspension upright changing steering axis inclination?

 

[bjorn240]

Evo Corse rims are also an option.

 

[PaulC]

@PaulC that FN wheel option looks interesting. When are these available?

I spoke to Dustin on Oct 12. Even though they haven't been publicly announced (perhaps at SEMA later this month is my guess?), they are available now, and he can email you pics of fitments on various cars. Dustin is at (951) 735-1100.

 

[PaulC]

I come from the school of sports cars and track days, where having the right scrub radius is crucial. It's not any less crucial on trucks, but there's somewhat less noticeable impacts. Don't get me wrong as there is, but people are more forgiving of ill suspension habits, and truck steering has a way of isolating and masking the steering feedback.

I ask about tire diameter, because it has immediate implications on optimal scrub radius. Following the graphic, one can imagine if the tire diameter grows, the intersection at the tire contact patch between the tire center and pivot angle radius will change. Having the right offset per tire diameter brings that relationship back to center.

Back of the napkin estimates says:
Stock 31.2" tire, 60mm offset.
For a 33" tire, ~48mm.
35" tire, ~35mm.

This is why you see all OEM wheels, designed to run a ~31.2" tire, have an offset of 60mm. Also why rock warrior wheels, designed to run a ~32.8" tire (285/70r17), have an offset of 50mm. And also why the Arctic Truck wheel, designed for a 35" tire, have an offset of 30mm.

So before picking a wheel, one wants to narrow down the desired tire size.

I personally like OEM wheels. Pick the style you want, then apply the spacer, as necessary, to get the optimal offset. I don't love spacers, but it's the lesser of some evils in my mind.

Wheel manufacturing process, while interesting, is not as important in my mind. Each process can make a good wheel. Some inherently stronger, perhaps with less material. But where this comes into play, is that manufacturers will vary the wheel geometry to take advantage of a process, to reach a final strength requirement/target. Therefore, none is inherently stronger, unless they are designed to meet a higher load rating requirement. I personally trust OEM wheels for the heavy lifting my car needs to do.

Somewhat off topic and this is from the rumormill, but there's suggestions that 16+ OEM wheels may have a slightly different stock offset? I've heard ~56mm? Perhaps as a result of redesigned suspension upright changing steering axis inclination?

Yes, that rumor is correct. With the refresh that happened to the LC200 in 2016+, the OEM offset was reduced to +56mm. The wheel-size.com website has the wheel specs for every car by year. The 4mm delta seems so nominal/deminimis that I can't imagine that Toyota changed the SAI on a refresh (as opposed to a full redesign) - just my guess. But Toyota did upgrade to an 8 speed transmission that 2016 year, so I may be wrong on SAI not changing.

 

[PaulC]

With respect to the 2019 Tundra TRD BBS wheels, should I be concerned with a 0.5mm delta in the hub bore if my desire was to be hub centric? I realize we're talking about only 1/2 of a millimeter delta in the hub diameter, which I can barely make out on my ruler.

If its makes a difference, that's fine and I'd rather go into it eyes wide open (or scratch it off the list). I just don't want to talk myself into it like the "goal seek" function in Excel.

 

[blatant]

TRD rims or an oem variant.

 

[Reg Wang]

Question: on Tirerack, the tire/wheel combo of 18" AX201 with BFG KO2 would result in almost identical dimension as factory 2011 LX570. However, the overall diameter increase from like 795mm to 799mm (converts to 31", only different in decimal places), so do I need to get the car re-clibrated?

 

[Hoosier Daddy]

With all the wheel options in the world, why can't there be a 5x150 17 inch wheel under 30 lbs, with a 2500 lb wt rating, and offset between 50 and 60? Oh, and for under $300 each new? RW is the only thing that comes close, but they're priced like gold bars these days.

And while we're at it, how about a 33 inch tire for an 18 inch wheel in anything other than load range D or E?

 

[Rigger]

I like the look of the Black Rhinos.

 

[TeCKis300]

Yes, that rumor is correct. With the refresh that happened to the LC200 in 2016+, the OEM offset was reduced to +56mm. The wheel-size.com website has the wheel specs for every car by year. The 4mm delta seems so nominal/deminimis that I can't imagine that Toyota changed the SAI on a refresh (as opposed to a full redesign) - just my guess. But Toyota did upgrade to an 8 speed transmission that 2016 year, so I may be wrong on SAI not changing.

I believe the uprights were redesigned on 2016+ models. Evidence of that is revised brake caliper mount and bolt spacing, which is not compatible with the pre-2016 models. The new 2016+ models have stronger brakes, and perhaps just a tad more sporty geometry in the suspension (by LC standards).

 

[DPA200]

I’d go TRD Rock Warrior, then Evo Corse, otherwise stock, in that order. TRD Rock Warriors are the 1st choice of almost anyone with a 200 for many reasons.

Question on the Rhino Bar bumper. Can you actually buy that anywhere? I’ve never seen it anywhere other than on that build link you showed.

 

[grinchy]

Question on the Rhino Bar bumper. Can you actually buy that anywhere? I’ve never seen it anywhere other than on that build link you showed.

View attachment 1813932

View attachment 1813933

South Africa. You can buy from uk reseller,I looked into it 6 months ago was like $2500 and $1000 shipping. Not to hard to find on internet search.

 

[codyaustin5]

@PaulC check out SCS wheels too. Hub centric and specifically for Toyota’s. They have some options for the tundra. I love the ray10s.

www.stealthcustomseries.com